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November 12, 2019 at 9:44 am in reply to: Trade Ideas/Acquisition Ideas/Non-Cards Rumors – 2019 #114147
i think that is about right for Leone
He had plenty of chances this past year to step up and really never did, feels kind of like letting Mayers go…it’s not that he doesnt have value and upside, but for the cost i don’t see how he staysNovember 11, 2019 at 1:56 pm in reply to: Trade Ideas/Acquisition Ideas/Non-Cards Rumors – 2019 #114124
Just re-hashing a few ideas in one place to see them
-Chapman + Mateo
Hudson + Gorman + Gant + Genesis + Munoz + Randy
-Merrifield + Soler
Oneill + Bader + Ponce + JMart + Thorres
Fowler + 1/2 salary + Capel + Gomber
Whit, Wong, Goldy, Chapman, Soler, DeJong, Yadi, Thomas….Carlson
Jack, CMart, Mik, Ray, Waino…Woodford
Carp, Knizner, Sosa, Edman, Williams/AdGarcia…..Thomas
Gallegos, Miller, Brebbia, Helsley, Junior, Webb, 2 of Cecil/Leone/Reyes/Whitley/Dobz/Roel…Hicks
-Rotation is a bit thin, but i believe in Rondon and Woodford being closer, and i think we could sign a few vets to minor league contracts
-offense is transformative and scary to the opposition, defense is even better than last year
-bench is versatile and fast and lacks a little punch, but has room to promote easily
-bullpen is a little weak until Hicks comes back…but has plnenty of room for promotion from AAA and plenty of upside candidates are there…a veteran signing (Romo, Neshek) could go a long way, i’d also look hard at Betances even though he is hurt
Only reason to release Cecil is to clear up a spot for someone to protect via Rule 5. OR if we needed to clear room to acquire someone via trade.
Those are the only logical arguments. One could argue losing a player to Rule V (even a middling player who MAY not get picked) is not worth the potential value of Cecil returning due to the lack of confidence in him to stay healthy OR perform well.
What is more likely? Cecil returning to form? Or someone taking a gamble on a player we HOPE won’t get picked in Rule V?
It’s a tougher call than i’d like to admit at this point though.
Perdomo could be a nice piece for the pen or rotation right now. And trading Mercado seems a huge error if it was linked to making room for him for protection in Rule V. Though, it could go the other way and we keep Derian Gonzalez and he hasn’t panned out to b worth that 40man spot he got a while back.
I still remember how good Cecil can be. I was a big fan of the acquisition at the time. But i have only seen that pitcher for a handful of games due to ineffectiveness and injury. I’m not sure even if healthy he would be the guy we are paying.November 8, 2019 at 12:48 pm in reply to: Trade Ideas/Acquisition Ideas/Non-Cards Rumors – 2019 #113994
I think everyone saw the deficiency in hitting from BAder all year including the Mets, I think they may want Randy + Gant + another hitting prospect…Thorres or Capel?
If they value BAder more, then I get it, but I could see them looking at Randy’s stats from last year in the minors and getting more excited than a #8 hitter at best right now with GG level defense.
I do think Gant has value, and in a swing role or set up or #5 he could really fill a lot of potential holes for any team acquiring him and be flexible enough to fill holes unseen later
however IMO…i’d rather spend my time fixing the offense instead of the pen which is probably out least need right now
having said that… a deal for MCNeil or Conforto + Diaz (or maybe all 3) would be intriguing
November 8, 2019 at 9:37 am in reply to: Trade Ideas/Acquisition Ideas/Non-Cards Rumors – 2019 #113982
- This reply was modified 3 days, 21 hours ago by thejager.
I dunno Forsch… it’s really not enough information for me to make a decision
there is more to a player than those 4 stats
I have no idea who is each, but for me Whit is worth the investment (even if he isnt one of those) because:
-WAR…3.9, 5.5, 4.0 last three years
-played every game of 2019 and missed 4 in 2018
-can play all OF, 1b and 2b
-true all around leadoff man
-34, 45, 20 SBs per year last 3 years
-.283, .288, .304, .302 AVG last 4 years
-270, 275, 315 TB last 3 years
-16 HR, and 74 RBI
-MVP votes in 2018 and AS in 2019 (could get MVP votes this year, but unannounced at this point)
-led the league in hits with 206, and had 192 last year
-led the league in triples
-played well on a bad team, and as i said above didnt miss a game even in the light of being on bad team
-is 30 and controlled through his age 34 season (with buyout of 750k at 33)
-salary coming up: 5m, 6.75m, 2.75m (yes), 10.5 (though club buyout of 750k)
Are there other players with some similar stats? perhaps
But above you have the epitome of what we dont have, a solid all around contributor who does not hurt you in any part of the game. tough, dependable, versatile, power,speed, avg…and cheap AND you can cut ties when he may be on his downward turn…
Going big for a guy at the top of his game, from age 30-34 for about 14.5m total is exactly what you want. Especially when he fits what the Cardinals are missing.
Whit plus a power bat with .275 AVG would be just what we are lackingNovember 7, 2019 at 2:05 pm in reply to: Trade Ideas/Acquisition Ideas/Non-Cards Rumors – 2019 #113923
Thanks for the comment on the Chapman idea…
I get that an good OF, SP, and Closer would be perfect….but i don’t really think that would be necessary
-i dont think we need a closer, if anything we have a pretty healthy bullpen with several guys who can step into that role before Hicks comes back…who is an elite closer
-i do think an OFer and an SP are important, though i think only one could be had via FA, the other via trade
– a good SP…(not Cole)…well i don’t think we need upper echelon…but i do think we need a rotation piece, but i am nto against not getting a lefty. If i did deal Hudson, I’d look for a bit more quality than a Miley or Wood… but im not approaching Stras or Ryu or wheeler or Bumgarner either in FA….I’d look at Keuchel on a short deal 2yrs max, maybe Hamels on a 1yr deal (he reported he might take that)….otherwise i’d look hard at Teheran…he is still young and has a little upside…he keeps his ERA down and is durable. Perhaps a 3yr deal for reasonable money could be done…worth a shot
-as for the OFer…this is where i cue the trade route with KC again…Merrifield is what we need, leadoff, speed, some power, high AVG, SB threat, and versatile to move around to fit if need be. you gotta pay for him (kinda like Chapman, but you are getting quality back in a spot and for use that we need)…perhaps Herrera would be an enticing piece for KC as PErez has been injured a lot lately, and perhaps they will want to move on from him after 2021 when his contract runs out…Herrera plus some other pieces, probably an OFer and a starter too….for the OFer i think you go with BAder…who might need a fresh start, and Matheny probably knows him well…and a close-ish starter in Oviedo or Seijas….i’d consider Woodford potentially too……so Bader + Herrera + Oviedo…or Woodford instead of Oviedo + GEnesis…and they add in Soler (yes this is a different type of deal for those two than i put up above…as this one leverages a lot of value in Hererra)
Chapman -power, defense
Merrifield- leadoff, defense, versatility, AVG, SB
Teheran- dependable 4-5 with upside and youth
Soler- power, and solid defense
would solve for the deficiencies in the team IMO….leadoff, stability in the 4 or 5, no lapse in power
would cost a lot in trades…not as much in salary though
main guys we would lose:
Gorman (replaced with Chapman)
Hudson + Wacha + Waino (replaced with Teheran + Waino + CMart)
Herrera (tough loss, have to lean on Knizner as the future catcher…but we do have some other nice catching prospects too)…though we would also snag MAtero, so another upside prospect
ONeill, Randy/AdGarcia, Bader (i am just assuming they are the most valuable)…replaced with Merrifield, Soler, Carlson, Thomas
Gant (replace with Ponce, Gomber)
Woodford (Ponce and Rondon and Gomber)
we still retain Carlson and Rondon and Thompson and a few others as top prospects to still plan for, but with the additions we don’t need to lean on them
Whit, Wong, Goldy Chapman, Soler, DeJong, Yadi, Thomas
Carp, Knizner, Munoz, Edman, Fowler (until Carlson is up)
Jack, Mik, CMart, Teheran, Waino
Hicks, Miller, Gallegos, Brebbia, Genesis, Helsley, Junior, Webb
Solid team, offensive powerhouse with sparks and great defense, solid if unspectacular rotation, deep bullpen, talented bench
It isnt perfect, and it wont happen but looking at:
2 complicated but do-able big trades
1 outside organization FA (who isnt a top tier)
1 internal FA
Sounds like an offseason plan that is do-able and not impossible in terms of timeNovember 6, 2019 at 2:42 pm in reply to: Trade Ideas/Acquisition Ideas/Non-Cards Rumors – 2019 #113849
ok…so during one of the STLTOday chats….there was a rumor that the A’s might be willing to listen on Chapman…not sure where it came from but alas…
probably a sell high thing, BUT maybe that is a good tactic from them as they have to deal with the Stros in that division and maybe selling high on Chapman to get multiple pieces that will help them compete a little farther down the road…
not likely…but enough for me to try an idea out…i put it in the chat…but i’ll put it (or something similar here)
so…you are buying a guy young (25) but in his prime already, cheap and controllable, belted out 35+ HRs, is a GG/platinum level defender at 3b, only knock on him is a low AVG…but not THAT low (.250 is the new .275 nowadays it seems)…he isnt super fast either but so what …
so that is SUPER high value….which means not only do you have to match value…but you also probably have to add more to pry him away
Having said that…he is cornerstone type of player
to me he is Scott rolen 2.0…which is a great thing to have…and i think you go at adeal for him in a similar way you went after Rolen…excpt more value going out…though i would make it a bit more
basically the Rolen deal was:
Rolen for Polanco + Bud Smith + Timlin
so for me:
Chapman + (Jorge Mateo)
Polanco = Gorman (don’t need him if you have Chapman at his age)
Smith = Hudson (Smith had just come off of what we all thought was a breakout year)
Timlin = Gant (veteran reliever…though in Gant’s case could be a 5 starter or opener)
Now I think the value is ab it high on the Cardinals side SO I would like to grab a speedster 2b/SS Mateo to better suit our backup SS needs and protect for life after Wong and in case Edman comes back to earth… but to get that I think you gotta add a bit more, so i went with Ad Garcia…whose power is for real and reall probably deserved a callup this year despite his striking out a lot…the A’s have had a lot of success with our castoffs and OFers (Piscotty and Martini)…though i woudl get it if we’d have to maybe offer Arozarena…i woulndt have Carlson, Thomas on the list…and i don’t think they’d want ABder as they already have a better version of him in Laureano…but Randy, AdGarcia,Capel,Williams are all right there for them…i would consider ONeill too…if that made the deal happen…
Chapman doesn’t help with needing a leadoff man, but it does give us a thumper and another GG defender, AND he woudl be locked in for many years and provide a nice new coree player
He would be expensive and rightfully so…
and perhaps my proposal is STILL too light…
but as long as you hold onto Knizner, Carlson, Jack, Hererra I think we could add in just about any other prospect/s to make it happen….losing Gorman is no big deal…Hudson COULD be…but if yo uare entertaining an addition of al efty to the rotation and Waino back and CMArt in the rotation…there is room to sell high on Hudson
It isn’t exactly like the Rolen deal…BUT with the way the Rolen deal turned out…for there to be a guy out there that might offer the same kind of return it woudl be foolish to not try to duplicate a deal like that if you can.November 6, 2019 at 2:20 pm in reply to: Trade Ideas/Acquisition Ideas/Non-Cards Rumors – 2019 #113847
I thought you were already going to do that Minute…at least you said you were unchecking yourself ahiel before…sure seems like you are seeking all of this out, that which you find to be worthless…..guess it isnt…
it isn’t grass is always greener…though not stagnating on ONE idea is a part of itIMO…to a lot of people…it is fun and interesting to talk through ways we might be able to improve the club in a safe environment that isnt full of people trying to attack or stop discussion just because they dont want to partake…
not all the ideas are 100% possible, but they often have a grain of truth in them enough that it might make someone think of a possibility they hadnt thought of….or instead of wallowing in waiting for moves to happen, see if you can come up with something positive…or better than what actually happens (in our own opinions)
I personally enjoy trying out different ideas and in different scenarios…sometimes instigated upon others thoughts, or sometimes other baseball resources, and most often on my own whims
There is NOTHING funny about making fun of other people’s thoughts and interests…unless you just want to be a bully that is…but to me that is the funniest thing in the world…someone who only attacks what they dont understand, agree with or want to see…someone so weak willed and minded that their only way to deal with anyone else is so make fun, laugh, or run away from that which they don’t like…THAT to me is what is funnyNovember 6, 2019 at 10:34 am in reply to: Trade Ideas/Acquisition Ideas/Non-Cards Rumors – 2019 #113835
ill stop for a while… (though i have been thinking about a deal with the A’s too)November 6, 2019 at 10:30 am in reply to: Trade Ideas/Acquisition Ideas/Non-Cards Rumors – 2019 #113834
after that deal…i’d also consider calling up KC to pry Merrifield from them…
now this is more risky….BUT
JMart + Gant + Woodford + Bader + Genesis + Montero
Merrifield + Soler
I threw it at the trade simulator and it says we are overpaying a bit, which is what i suspect it would take
Merrifield slots into CF, Soler into RF, Peralta into LF
Merrifield is at worst a good leadoff man, at best an MVP-lite guy…and cheap and controlled
Soler is a masher, but cheap and is arb eligible in 2021
I’d be fine with a lineup that looked like:
Whit, Peralta, Goldy, Soler, Moose, DeJong, Yadi, Wong
corrects for some guys who hit for high AVG at the top…some lefty power in Moose, and righty power in SOler who turned a corner it seems last year (plus i think he might like to face the Cubs every year and stick it to them for giving up on him)November 6, 2019 at 10:17 am in reply to: Trade Ideas/Acquisition Ideas/Non-Cards Rumors – 2019 #113833
A David Peralta + Robbie Ray trade might be an interesting route to explore
both are only controllable through 2020 so they can’t ask CRAZY returns…also ARZ i think must be pretty pleased with what STL and their farm has given them so far Kelly, Weaver both solid and Gallen now (via Marlins)
I would imagine they would be open to talking with us and probably have a good idea about what they like from our organization in prospects
also it makes me wonder about moving Fowler in a deal like that(as i think ARZ might be a legitimate place Fowler would take a trade to being close to his home in LV especially since he already has a WS ring
now i know Tomas seems a lost cause for most, but he hit .300 last year at AAA with 29 HRs, played 1b and LF. Now i can’t imagine he is great in the OF, and he is owed like 20m for the next year (and then he actually is arb eligible for one more year)…but perhaps we could swap him and Fowler
Fowler is owed 33 million over the next 2yrs
Tomas 20m for 2020
Maybe we take on Tomas for 2020 and eat 6.5m per year of Fowler
They are left paying what they had planned to pay for Tomas this year but spread out over 2 years while getting a player that they probably have more room for (better OF)
We also ask for Ray and Peralta in the deal….but also add other pieces…perhaps ONeill + Poncedeleon + Capel
We arent on the line for Ray Tomas or Peralta or Fowler after 2020 allowing us either to target whomever we like
Then move JMart to an AL team after to free up a spot on the bench for Tomas (but if he could hack LF maybe he slots in there a bit ina pseudo JMart role)
then look at a Moustakas 3yr deal
Waino and Wieters back
Jack, Hud, Mik, Ray, Waino…..Ponce
CMart, Miller, BRebb, Gallegos, Helsley, Webb, Junior, Genesis
Wong, Peralta, Goldy, Moose, DeJong, Yadi, Thomas, Bader
Randy, Wieters, Carp, Munoz, Tomas
As much as i am not a fan of Fowler and Carp’s money i am more bothered that is still TWO more years of it, which for me stagnates the teams flexibility to adjust based off of what happens each year
Which is why i’d rather pay more in 2020 just to be free of most of the obligation in 2021
yes, Tomas is no real answer and may be less valuable that JMart, but the change in ability seems marginal enough (especially considering that we should be able to get a solid return from a trade of him) to warrant the swapping, especially given the financial help for 2021
as for Shildt’s tirade…i could care less about what words people use…what i find problematic with it is that all the outward facing media stuff about Shildt is that he is super religious guy who takes his religion seriously and is such an honest and good guy. that he is some kind of saint…. yet behind closed doors (only reported by accident in hindsight by Randy) he is a foul mouth vindictive revenge fueled and inducing guy…
and that he came out after it was shared and said he wished it wouldnt have been seen is further indication of the twofacedness of him
and i personally dont care if a coach is foul mouth and revenge fueled…as long as the players are motivated and he isn’t attacking races or genders etc.
But putting forth a false image to the public of who you are and how you work is pretty rotten and distrustful…
They and he are trying to play the fans for fools….and they succeed most of the time it seems…. which is why i am distrustful of this leadership right now…they present one thing and do another…they say what we want to hear and then do something else…they say they will fix things, but their means for doing so are not active but passive
I actually miss Matheny… at least he was terrible with the media and didnt respond right to the media…even if he wasnt great he was who he was….he made mistakes didnt act as if they werent him and moved on……and he is rewarded with being fired…and they bring in a company man who will look and do everything the leadership want him to do and he will thank them for it…
want a super religious guy but not so much that he talks about it all the time so that the nonreligious folk wont turn away and so that you can still get the religious folk… sign up Shildt…is he ACTUALLY that guy…not really but he can be told and groomed to appear that way…. that is until Randy shows his true colors in that remarkable filming
ALready hearing sound bites from Moz about how they are anticipating Carp to turn it around and Lane thomas being an impact player
sounds a lot like signals for no big moves and no real change happening
(it’s not going to stop me from proposing them in other threads though)
Depending on the offense to “fix itself” is exactly what we did last year and look at what happened to the offense….bad to very bad and was the reason we didnt move on in the playoffs
not doing something active to fix the offense is a major mistake IMO
From what i have read, it sure seems like they arent going to do much this offseason. At least in terms of adding payroll. I wish that meant more trades, but i have a feeling we will be seeing these moves or storylines:
-rotation will be good and needs no help with Waino coming back and CMart in the rotation
-Moustakas added for either too much money or too many years…we will hear the nonstop drone of versatility and lefthanded power
-Thomas or Randy will be the outfielders traded not Bader or ONeill
-Fowler and Carp are going to rebound, and Goldy’s last season was an anomaly too
-Yadi will get another year tacked onto his current deal
-Carlson is the second coming of Pujols so we need no other offensive help any time soon
-Wieters brought back for too much money or a 2 year deal
-we will lose at least one player we dont want to rule 5 who will end up contributing
NostraJagerdamus has spoken!
(at least the pessimistic version of him)November 3, 2019 at 12:41 pm in reply to: Trade Ideas/Acquisition Ideas/Non-Cards Rumors – 2019 #113597
Yea there misses and huge contracts given out.
But when you see the impact of Chapman’s and iglesias’,puig, Yordan Alvarez,Contreras, cespedes, Leonys, Kendra morales, Jose Fernandez, hechaverria, Jose Iglesias, abreu, gurriel, Diaz, and probably Robert and gurriel and several others. You can deal with the possible problems and misses
Yes there is a gamble.
You may get a Castillo or Tomas (though both have contributed well at the mlb level and actually weren’t bad last year in the minors)
And there are other misses too. Plenty.
But not going the xtra mile on many of these players is obviously a miss when you look at impact of performance. Even at big contracts they tend to be massive bargains in the end.
Every FA signing is a gamble no matter where you get them. But the sustained success of several of the players in the Cuban league and in the world is not a small thing. Gurriel elder is doing exactly what he did for all those years inCuba. At the time we needed a 1b man and a 3b. He would have been a pretty nice fit for the last couple years.
Just because some of us consider the gamble on the international market to be worth it more than others doesn’t make it a bad decision
I’m all for the automated balls and strikes. And i have been for years.
It doesn’t eliminate the need for the skilled umpires at all. You just have a chirp in the umpires ear for strike and long tone for a ball. They still make the call.
Taking that out, they can focus on the real situations where the should be focusing on. Judgement calls. Interference, abiding by the timing rules at the plate and on the mound, and a lot more. Those things are things robots can’t fix for the most part and need the human judgement.
Just because pitchers have learned how to take advantage of the LACK of oversight in their profession doesn’t mean it should stay that way. I am sure a lot of spitball and junk ball pitchers were pissed when they banned that, and had to either get better at hiding it or get better at pitching.
If you are only good because you need the imperfection of the umpire to get the calls you want, then you arent playing baseball really, you are just trying to cheat at baseball.
The technology is already there. period. The umpires know it, which is why they are evaluated on their performances BY THAT TECHNOLOGY. Pitchers and teams know it is good to go too, because they use it to determine how well they are pitching as well.
They are SOOOO concerned about the technology being right EVERY SINGLE TIME yet their solution is to continue using a method (HUMANS) that are by their very nature not right 100% of the time.
The technology is already accurate enough, they just need to implement it in a way that is unobtrusive to the game. If the earpiece fails or there is a problem, you just g o right back to the umpires calling every pitch. In fact they SHOULD be doing so still, they only need the chirp or long tone to confirm before making their call out loud.
I don’t get why the pitchers are so upset to be honest, they will now get calls on things that guys cant hit. High curve balls, cross ups that stay over the plate but distract the umps with the catcher movement, even bottom of the zone pitches will get called if they hit the zone.
Even the complaint about the height of the batters changing is not a big deal. They already change with every ump looking, so error is already in there. With the tech, at least the same algorithm will be applied to take that factor into account so the error will be consistent and something to be learned or gotten better with time.
The tech is good enough, the accuracy is as good or better than humans. Move on.October 28, 2019 at 1:31 pm in reply to: Trade Ideas/Acquisition Ideas/Non-Cards Rumors – 2019 #112937
How many people said CMart was going to be in the rotation this past year too?
It’s been 2 years since we got good performance from Carlos as a starter
he was a reliever this year put up .9 WAR, last year as hybrid 1.5, before that …2.9…and before that 5.3 and 3.8 before that…then lower after as he was barely used
ROgers put up 2.5, 2.1, 1.2, and .9 in his only 4 years as a reliever… and until this year he was a setup man…this year as closer…his k/9 avg’s out to 9.8 (this year was 11.7)
CAN…Cmart produce big time value…absolutely… and i want him as a starter….but he hasnt been a starter for about 2 years… and is a reliever getting 11million+
If i could be assured CMart would be a starter going forward (even if that meant some up and downs that come with being a starter) then i’d be fine with it…and woudlnt want to trade hi mat all..
but if he is just going to be an expensive closer and eventual setup man…i dont see why we should pay all that money for him if we have other areas that might be addressed by clearing payroll
Carp and Fowler are 35million bench players at this point, and CMart an 11mil+ reliever
Having said all that…if we could get MORE from the Twins than a guy like Rogers…then id be all for it…
Kiriloff + Rogers + Astudillo would be might fine with me…even if i think we’d have to offer up more than CMart to get it done
but let’s try it…
Kiriloff + Rogers + Astudillo
CMart + ONeill + Whitley + Leone + Baker
Choo + Minor + Kiner-Falefa
Carp +1/2 money + AdGarcia + Gant + JMart
Fowler + 1/2 money + Randy
Jack, Hud, Mik, Minor, Ray…Ponce/Gomber/Woodford
Rogers, Miller, Gallegos, Helsley, Genesis, Brebbia, Junior, Webb….Hicks
Kiriloff, Wong, Goldy, DeJong, Choo, Yadi, Carlson, Edman
Kiner-Falefa, Astudillo, Munoz, Sosa, Lane, Bader
i love that young OF, of Kiriloff and Carlson with Lane/Bader slotting in after Choo is out after 2020
and possibly before Carlson is ready in 2020
Carp at 1/2 piece + Choo salary is a lot for one starting position, but at least Choo was valuable…and only half of it is left after 2020…Tex basically gets 10million or so extra to play with or pocket for this year while also getting Carpenter…they basically spread the Choo money out over two years instead of paying it all right now…
Minor and Ray are only 1yr solutions but either could be good guys for extensions…but two quality lefties is nice
the bullpen is deep and powerful and even more able against lefties…with Hicks back it is dominant…and cheap outside of Miller
i love the flex of the bench with two multiposition catchers both with unique characteristics (speed for Kiner and contact for Willians)October 28, 2019 at 9:34 am in reply to: Trade Ideas/Acquisition Ideas/Non-Cards Rumors – 2019 #112924
At the moment CMart is a closer getting paid over 10mil who has a history of injury woes…he MIGHT be a starter…but there is no guarantee on that…every time we try it with him he gets hurt…
i dont say we throw him away, we just have to find a team that thinks they can take advantage of us…yet we still have to get something more dependable back
I like the Twins because of all the arms they are losing and their low payroll…also, if we target Rogers as the central piece one could say that the Twins (while paying more) would at worst be exchanging a closer for another closer. while the Cardinals woudl at worst be doing the same (just paying less for it)…we’d be clearing money and getting more solid dependable backend lefty work in exchange for an upside Ace that doesnt seem to be able to work out for us…
I want nothign more for us to get CMart back in the rotation and be the best #3-4 in a rotation, but i am a bit over upside…i want proven talent and proven reliability… with hitters and pitchers
Rogers has shown he at worst is a dominant lefty pitcher at best a stand out lefty closer, that is what i want. CMart’s question marks occlude his performance potential..and i am done waiting around on it…i want to depend on something not HOPE for something
I’d rather over pay for proven talent than hope for upside or rebound years
I want high average over HR’s, but both is the dream…and i would take Adam Eaton over Tyler ONeill
I want relief pitchers who do their jobs consistently (Rogers more than Miller…Miller WAS a beast…but was also damaged when we bought him and had a poor year)
I want starters who compliment each other and make sense in our division…Minor or Duffy of Miley over Wheeler, Odorizzi…. OR i want a proven Ace without question marks…Cole or Stras over Ryu or Bumgarner
I am babbling again…ugh
gonna be a long offseasonOctober 28, 2019 at 9:24 am in reply to: Trade Ideas/Acquisition Ideas/Non-Cards Rumors – 2019 #112921
Id love to take Marte and Moran….but i can’t see any way that Bader and Carpenter are appealing to the Pirates.
Bader is cheaper, and better defensively but can’t hit and isnt a SB threat
Carpenter may be better than last year, but that doesnt mean he will be good, and his defense always seems to be smoke and mirrors good
Add in that they are intra-divisional..and despite a good deal maybe being able to be made, some wont even consider it a possibility
To get that talk started I think you have to lead with Gorman…
Gorman + Carp + ONeill + Gomber/Woodford + Seijas
Marte + Moran
Gorman is a future cornerstone type of player, that MIGHT get the Bucs to listen about moving a cornerstone guy like Mrte within the division…kind of a we will help you now you will help us later type of deal…
Also that level of prospect would probably have them willing to take on at least half of Carp
ONeill is a starter with power and cheap, Gomber/woodford is either a cheap lefty or solid righty for cheap…both probably could slot in next year into the rotation, Seijas (or another) is n upside lower level prospect to sweeten the deal
To get around all the immediate negatives of trading an MVP type of Marte in the division i think you have to give up a TON…
Having said that… id do that deal immediately, id even move better prospects if necessary..id even consider removing Morna from the deal to make it easier…even though i like his steady hand and lefty pop…October 25, 2019 at 10:28 am in reply to: Trade Ideas/Acquisition Ideas/Non-Cards Rumors – 2019 #112716
I wonder if Archer doesn’t get his option picked up if he’d be a target. He is squarely in the 2nd or 3rd rung but has top rung upside.
Ryu is also of interest as he tends to fly under the radar but has been very impressive when healthy (which is his big worry, BUT is the thing that will keep his price down)
I like taking a shot on Cingrani to a minor league deal if our doctors say he is worth the time and look.
I really am not happy with the unknown that is CMArt… it has to be really frustrating to have a guy who has top of the rotation ability and has shown that…be so enigmatic, so much so that you have to use him as a closer to just get value out of him…
I think you have to act as if he is a bullpen arm, despite any hope that he could return to the rotation. If you are wanting a top of rotation guy, then CMart can’t be the plan…because he might well be a reliever and you cant depend on hopes…IF you say you need that top of rotation piece.
But i am not sure they do, Jack and Hud both showed me they are good pitchers and Mikolas is solid if unspectacular
Jack fills Ace role, Hudson and Mik are solid 3 pitchers and either can pitch at #2 level
that leaves two spots… typical 4-5 type pitchers…..IMO usually those go to a veteran inning eater (im thinking like Suppan), and a kid or converted reliever slash long man to starter, spring training sensation (Gant, Thompson, POnce, Lyons, Wellemeyer)
We kind of have that kid/swing role set… Ponce, Woodford, Gomber, Reyes
the 4 spot…COULD be Waino if he wants to come back…and then we’d be pretty set…or it could go to another of the kids… OR CMart could fill that role…OR you go out and look for a FA vet or trade…
Im thinking Wade Miley would make sense…unspectacular but a lefty with a good history… PLUS let’s say CMart is good to go for the rotation….well now you slot CMart into the 4 and now you put the veteran in the 5 role which if he fails leaves a spot for the kids
If we go after a top rotation (or 2nd 3rd tier) I’d feel a lot better going up against big time lineups…BUT it would pretty much makes us either dependent on a kid…or CMart…unless we go out and get another Fa or trade…
out pitching didnt hurt us this year… the offense did…
I want a lefty in the rotation, but i don’t think i want that at the expense of moves or money that fixes the offense….CMart, Waino, Kids seem plenty of options for 2 spots…sure maybe you look at some low hanging fruit if it is easy…and sure you look at the trade market…but the offense is the concern …period
for me: (right now)
Minor + Choo…Carp deal (eating money) + prospects
Gordon + Haniger…prospects
Fowler (Eating money) somewhere close to LV for his family
Cmart somewhere…let someone else figure him out…id prefer the AL…
JMart in one of the above deals or elsewhere
-keep Carlson and Gorman…maybe Herrera…everyone else on the table
Haniger, Gordon, Choo
Edman, DeJong, Wong, Goldy, Yadi
Gordon and Choo are old but do their jobs well….and id take 1yr of Choo over 2 of Carp for the same price)…Gordon is expensive but fills a role we were terrible at filling
Haniger is coming off injury but has shown 5 tool production
Choo makes way for Carlson, and Gordon eventually clears space too for another OFer
Minor is thee lefty ace for the rotation…
also none of the acquisition are long term commitments really…Haniger is closest and works
We may lose the pop of Ozuna…but we gain the contact skills which suit a more athletic and fast team
im babbling…October 23, 2019 at 1:50 pm in reply to: Trade Ideas/Acquisition Ideas/Non-Cards Rumors – 2019 #112517
I was interested in Owings 2-3yrs ago before he got injured and.
Having said that, I would still be very much interested in him on a minor league deal. He could be a better version of Munoz if he still has his SS and CF chops.
I also was wanting us to sign Dietrich and Jose Iglesias last offseason too, but CC if you are only wanting to find a guy to bash on me with please continue. Big lefty power of DD in the first half would have been mighty helpful and Iglesias would have been our best offensive player.
I have never said all by ideas are 100% great moves and none of the players could be bad. I was also a big proponent of Khalil Greene before and when we went after and got him. And is and by that interest and reasoning still today. Same goes for Owings.
As a trade target I am very high on Astudillo from Minny in the new 26man team structure as his catching and ability to play everywhere on the field combined with his superhuman level of contact makes him the perfect utility player and backup bench/3rd catcher and pinch hitter extraordinaire.
Along the same lines as FA target is Blake Swihart, who may be had for a minor league deal and invite to ST. he can play outfield and can catch, and has even played 2b, 3b, 1b. he had a down year, but he is a switch hitter and is only 27. a switch hitting backup catcher with multiposition flex has value IMO. Adn at his age, he could still potentially have some upside.
We will undoubtedly release or whatever Hudson, and be looking for a backup catcher for Yadi, and I am not convinced we need Knizner to be the guy up and sitting on the bench to do that. a trade or signing for a flex position backup catcher OR even as a 3rd catcher with Knizner up too would be smart IMO. If Swihart could be had on a minor league deal and invite to ST, we could also keep that 40man roster spot open until 60 day DL is an option.
or as I said before…and STl… CMart to Minny for Rogers…then maybe ask for Astudillo as well, and see what else it might take (if anything) Rogers is a top closer and lefty setup man…and young and cheap…BUT Astudillo isnt super young anymore…however with Garver’s breakout year they dont really need another catcher….perhasp we can sneak him into a dealOctober 21, 2019 at 4:59 pm in reply to: Trade Ideas/Acquisition Ideas/Non-Cards Rumors – 2019 #112366
STL…i get all your points, i dont agree with all of them, but it’s not like any of us have any real answers. i dont think they are foolish or not potentially correct. I just dont agree with them. But that’s no big deal.
How about a shift in gears….how about a trade with Seattle? They are always dealing, and we have history with them
I’d love to buy low on Haniger who only really lost this past year due to a scary unfortunate male body part injury. He still has upside and is about in his prime. Can play all 3 OF, good power, good speed, good contact, and him paired with one of our youngsters and then eventually Carlson could make for a solid upside outfield.
And as I said “one” of our youngsters is how i get to us acquiring him. I think Dee Gordon could be had and would want to be moved by the M’s. He could step into our leadoff role right away, and provide good CF defense and still top 5 wheels in baseball for steals, while also providing us an offensive spark as he is still good with the bat. He has had some injuries, but we are looking for a deal here and he still provides a great option for a leadoff man
Haniger + Gordon for…. Randy + Montero + Ponce + Urias
Then trade with TEX for Minor….and to get him, take on Choo and swap with Carpenter and half the contract (evening them out, but costing TEX half the price for the next two years)
Minor + Choo for… Carp (and half salary) + JMart + Gomber + Oneill + Oviedo + Capel
Then look at ARZ and see about getting Ray….see fi we can get Fowler to go and include half the contract…
Ray for…Fowler (and half his salary) + Rondon + AdGarcia
Trade CMart to Minny….try to get Rogers….straight up
release Leone and trade Gant for a low level prospect to save money
so instead of going to FA with our eyes on the prizes, we use that money for upgrades through trades
normal increase = -25m
Carp and Fowler and JMart and CMArt = -32m
Ray= +arb (last year 6m…let’s say +8m this year)
Haniger= +arb1 (…tough call coming off injury…let’s say 4m)
coming in or money leaving = 57m
money added = 56.5m
Gordon, Wong, Haniger, Goldy, DeJong, Choo, Yadi, Edman
Jack, Hud, Mik, Minor, Ray
Knizner, Thomas, Bader, Munoz, Ravelo, FA-catcher(Romine?)
Rogers, Miller, Gallegos, Brebbia, Genesis, Helsley, Junior, Webb
team upgrades the offense with some better contact guys, it gets a bit old with Choo in the OF, BUT he still hits and is only here for one more year…then Carlson can come in. Gordon is expensive but provides an area of need. Ray and Minor give us big time lefty help in the rotation. Rogers gives us a young closer as well as setup dominant lefty to go with the other lefties to deal with the NL Central big time lefties.
Betting on Haniger is fine to me, as i like him, but the totality of the upgrade to the lineup of Choo, Haniger, Gordon is what makes me think that is what we are missing. Goldy and DEjong’s bat are plenty of power and the Choo and Haniger power is fine enough for second tier…Gordon is a premiere leadoff man and Wong and Edman supply upside offense…Yadi’s offense is not important as he ages and shouldnt be…
this team gets on base by hitting the ball instead of Fowler and Carp who get on base by walking…we need hitters not walkers at this point
I am sure my deals are light or awkward too..but i think there is something there with Seattle to help our offense…and I think Minor is gettable but we have to find a way to make them more apt to trade them…clearing Choo from TEX and Gordon from SEA i think would go a long way in making those deals happen…and while both have some concerns both could be very useful for a team trying to rebound offensivelyOctober 18, 2019 at 9:49 am in reply to: Trade Ideas/Acquisition Ideas/Non-Cards Rumors – 2019 #112072
Nice ideas STL, i like where you are going, im personally not too keen on offering Donaldson three years but i get it.
I just am not sure the trade ideas are enough of value on our sides
-I don’t think JMart Wong and Rondon are near enough for Boston, especially given Wong only has a year left too. JMart isa cnie cheap piece, but where would he play? IF they move Bettes i thought it was so they’d pay JD, who is a DH at this point. Wong + Woodford + Randy + Nunez …and that still feels light in comparison to other offers they might get
-Cmart to Minny is interesting, but again i think it is too light for what you want back…Rogers is a beast and super cheap…I’m not sure we could ask much more from Minny than him alone given his value to a team with a low payroll…maybe Balosovic, but definitely not Gordon despite some of his lustre coming off…having said that… CMart for Rogers straight up…i’d do it (as long as it meant we would reinvest that money on FA)
-Ray deal seems super light to me…no disrespect…Thomas is fine, and Munoz is a solid reserve but i can’t imagine that would get a talk started much at all for a frontline starter like Ray…Thomas + Munoz + Gomber + Oviedo….but that seems light too…not sure what they’d want, but they seem to like our young pitchers
as for Donaldson deal..at 23million per year for 3yrs…why not spend another 8m and get Rendon for 8yrs? we’d get Donaldson’s 34-37yrs….or Rendon’s 30-38yrs….about 3-4yrs of prime of Rendon, vs maybe one good year and a last hurrah for Donaldson…. I think 8yrs 31m probably gets Rendon no?
still i see the strategy…i think i personally would rather invest a big trade or two on guys we can control longer than Ray and Betts…1yr of Betts is fun and 2 of Ray is nice…but i feel a Rendon payday spending…and a trade for Merrifield and his low contract and control, as well as looking hard at some of the mid-end LHSPs on the market… (there are a few) or exploring a trade for a controllable SP… would go a bit farther…and as i said Rendon would free up Gorman to be a HUGE asset for a trade market making our trade targets much more wide
as an aside…don’t let the door hit you minuteman, no one asked your opinion of what they should or can post and they never should…if you can’t handle reading other people’s thoughts and AT LEAST respect the people enough to NOT say anything if you are so disgusted then i think you should reconsider why you want to be a part of any community of differing opinions. Add to that, posting passive aggressively about it is so much more insulting to yourself than you probably think.October 17, 2019 at 9:18 am in reply to: Trade Ideas/Acquisition Ideas/Non-Cards Rumors – 2019 #112015
yep that was basically my reasoning GScott
I like Wong a lot, but his value is super high right now, but his contract is too, i love his defense and i love his offense uptick
the upgrade of Rendon over Edman or Carp is much more massive
the downgrade of Wong to Edman…especially if you factor in the return of probably a decent prospect
If you ask most people who they would prefer:
Edman + Rendon
Wong + Edman
it’s not much of conversation
and while it is true that perhaps you could find the money elsewhere so you can have Wong AND Rendon, that would severely limit our ability to bring in another player with a contract via trade OR sign a free agent
which is why in my proposal we also spend big prospect talent to acquire Merrifield, and Boyd…both cheap but still have to be accounted for, which should free up enough money to either bring back Waino again or go after a lower priced lefty SP
my proposal is a HUGE endeavour and has almost no chance of happening…but the idea is solid i think
do whatever you have to bring in Rendon and trade for MErrifield…then see if you can take advantage of the Tigers to get Boyd and a good young SP potentially by dangling Gorman as a future cornerstone of their organization whom we wouldnt need because of commitment to Rendon
Carp + Fowler + Wong
Rendon + Merrifield + Edman
also…Boyd + Waino/Miley or Keuchel + Waino
(as a caveat…Manning + Boyd deal even with what i put in there is still pretty light I think…if we take out Manning it gets lighter, but keeping Manning in makes it tough because of his value….the way i looked at it was …Manning for Gorman + POnce…big starter potential for big hitter potential and a young cheap ready to go rotational piece…then Boyd for Oneill + Hererra/Thorres…this may be too light…probably is…maybe make it Herrera and Thorres + ONeill…basically young still high upside mshing OFer (they need young hitters remember) + a future hitting catcher and another hitting outfielder…. basically this whole trade comes down to giving the Tigers young hitting who will be in line for when their young pitching matures and Cabrera retires…while also replacing Boyd with a pitcher who can pitch right now and who coudl probably pitch later too when the youngsters are ready…They get to sell high on Boyd who ended poorly after a great start…we are taking a chance there…and Manning a top flight prospect who we are exchanging fora top flight young hitter (which they have none of IMO)October 16, 2019 at 3:57 pm in reply to: Trade Ideas/Acquisition Ideas/Non-Cards Rumors – 2019 #111959
ONeill + Gorman + Ponce + Herrera/Thorres to Detroit for Manning + Boyd
JMart + Bader + Reyes + Montero to KC for Merrifield
Carp + half money to LAA for prospect
Fowler + half money to SF for prospect
Wong to Boston for prospect
sign Miley or best lefty SP for decent price
inquire on Pomeranz
OZuna QO and gone
Jack, Mik, Hud, Boyd, Miley……Manning, Gomb, Woodford
CMart, Miller, Gallegos, Helsley, Miller, Webb, Genesis, Gant….Hicks
Whit, Edman, Rendon, Goldy, DeJong, Yadi, Thomas, Randy
Knizner/cheap vet catcher,Munoz, AdGarcia/vet cheap OF, Ravelo/Evan, Sosa ….Carlson,Williams,Schrock
i like that team..and while giving up big pieces of the future would be necessary as well as major financial backing…it would be a very good team that would get better defensively and still have great speed…while adding in very good players that do things this years team couldn’t do…high average and put the ball in play…two major contributors to the offense like Rendon and Whit while also shipping away the more streaky players (even at a loss) still brings us forward in a major way…bullpen is good already, bench is a bit weak, but would allow for Memphis to shuttle more players…the corner OFers are RAW but would get a chance to figure it out while not being depended on offensively…while the dearth of young OFers still coming could compensate if they fail
the two big trades i propose are probably not right, but i think we have the internal parts to make them work without losing the base of the team i put together….not dealing Carlson and Knizner is about all i woudl not put on the table from the farm…Jack and Hudson too…Edman at this point is probably a no go if you move Wong and Carp…