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If they can split in Washington considering they are facing Corbin, Stras and Max, I would consider that a win. Taking a minimum 2 of 3 in Chicago is a must since I’ll be at the Friday and Saturday games sporting my new Goldy jersey! It wasn’t ordered until roughly 90 seconds after the extension was announced….
Would a package of Lane Thomas, Justin Williams, Randy Arozarena and Helsley come close to getting them both? Helsley is included to give them someone to take over MadBum’s rotation spot and has some upside. Their system, at first glance, is shockingly weak throughout.
Gscottar, I hear the Cards are loaded with OF’s, who would it take to get MadBum and Will Smith? (I’m still dreaming)
Consider this, after several years of unfortunate injuries, especially last year when he was on a tear coming back during his rehab in the minors, and now he’s struggling with command issues and then being demoted…. if you wouldn’t be severely frustrated 100 times over, I wouldn’t consider you human.
Did he have a smart reaction? Of course not, but how many stupid things are done at that age? At least he was smart enough to not use his pitching hand!
The positives, it was mentioned above that his service time should now be extended for another year because this injury happened in the minors, which I was a big proponent of sending him down before opening day to keep him an extra year. Second, this could be a wake up call and let him work on the little things and relax. Then, come back up mid summer as a starter and be “Wacha-esque” down the stretch and in the playoffs.
People “giving up” on him over this is undoubtedly the worst possible and irrational idea.
True, but thinking what another desperate team would give up at the deadline is what I was thinking. Leaving out Montero would be more tolerable for sure, but with the Goldy and Carp contracts done, I don’t see a fit for him. Also, getting it done now, vs July 31st would be a much better investment.
Side note, I might be to much of an advocate of getting a solid lefty in the rotation.
Even as only rentals, MadBum and Smith would sure fill the Cards out. I just looked at stats for the Giants, they could use as many prospects that are close to ready as possible.
What about Lane Thomas, A. Garcia, Helsley, Ponce and E.Montero for both? Way to much?
Does anyone else want to jump on the “Sign Gio Gonzalez” bandwagon with me?
1) Having at least one lefty in the rotation can help throw the rythyms off in a series
2) According to MLBTR projections, 2/25 was what they projected and where the market is now 2/22 should get it done
3) 30 or more games started in 8 out of past 9 years, every SP in the projected rotation has at least a small ?
4) Percent chance the 5 projected starters are all healthy and ready to go to start the season is more unlikely than likely
5) Additional depth not to rush Reyes and allow him time in AAA in an attempt to save service timePlease join me on this bandwagon?
Gallegos is David Robertson lite from everything I’ve seen on him and…. I’m in agreement that he could be the biggest surprise BC. Hopefully Reyes doesn’t come up until June 1 (rough estimate to gain an extra year of control). Also, one more wild card BP option wouldn’t be awful, a Bud Norris type? Romo is still out there as of the last time I looked.
Tampa seems to line up to perfectly as far as their needs and value available to come back.
Tampa gets – Jose Martinez and Gant
Cardinals get – Jesus Sanchez and Shane McClanahan.Sanchez might be a little aggressive request from the Cards, but maybe not. He’s a LHH OF, their 4th ranked prospect via MLB and 33rd overall, finished 2018 in AA. McClanahan is a LH pitcher with a crazy FB and was just recently drafted. Due to control it seems he’ll end up as a solid BP piece, he’s their 8th ranked prospect.
BP help for 2019 would obviously be beneficial, but if they can get a very good prospect for him then they should jump on it. If Goldy for example goes down, or another few injuries happens, then I retract that comment of course!
Tyler O (to basically back up Fowler), Gyorko, Pena, LH bench bat, Munoz (plus several other not terrible options in AAA) would likely be the main 5, if they go with 5 vs just 4.
JMart, Gant and Gyorko should be traded and take the maximum return regardless of it being a solid prospect or a 2019 piece. There are plenty of relievers they could get for the money owed to Gyorko, Robertson, Britton, etc are all still out there at last check.
Britton, a top 100 prospect and (2) top 150 prospects > Gyorko, JMart and Gant and the money wouldn’t be substantially more, and they still have more than enough payroll room
I can’t find anything on this so this seemed like the best place to ask this, is there anything in the CBA that would prevent the Cards from simply ripping up Goldy’s current deal and just signing him to a 5 or 6 year deal now vs. having to add it on? They have more than plenty of money to spend in 2019, so wouldn’t it make sense to pay up now and have it taper off when he’s 34-36?
If it would take 140M over 5 after this deal, plus the 14.5M this year would be essentially a 154.5M deal.
2019 – 40M
2020 – 35M (and they sign Rendon for 2B)
2021 – 30M
2022 – 20M
2023 – 15M
2024 – 14.5Mjj-cf-stl, your comment of “Reyes optioned down from ST for 60 days sounds good to me.”…..
Finally someone agrees and supports this with me! That extra year of control is what matters, it was mentioned about the arb salaries being an issue, that is far from the issue, the year of extra control is what does after two have been essentially wasted.
Alex Reyes being sent to Memphis to stay stretched out to be a starter and be on somewhat of an innings limit would be ideal, and also keep him from wearing down to come up in July, Aug, Sept and hopefully October for the first time in a while to dominate. Win-Win for the Cards…
My hope due to knowing a bit about his attitude off the field is that he is traded immediately for the best available prospect/young player with control and they sign Keuchel(a LH SP would help the balance). It would be more money the next 4-5 years, but he would bring back a great top prospect or young player under control.
If the Yankees sign Machado, which I doubt they do at this point, Andujar for CMart would have been a pretty fair match up. Joe Adell plus another piece from the Angels would possibly work also, they have two years of the Trout era and CMart would help that more than Adell will.
Keuchel, lost draft pick and Adell >(x10) CMart, an extra 10M spent/yr and the draft pick.
This has nothing to do with adding someone, just thinking the BP could actually big a big plus this year.
An often forgotten piece of the BP that could have a huge bounce back and be one of the 7th, 8th, 9th inning guys is Dominic Leone. He had a 2.56 ERA and a 2.94 FIP with 10.3 K/9 in the AL east just two years ago. Injuries are possibly to blame for the drop off in 2018 and then add in the new environment adjustments and he could be in line for a big year.
Gallegos is another one to watch as well to break out. I’ve read two articles where he was being compared to David Robertson. He hasn’t done much or had much of a chance in MLB so far, but in AAA he has a 1.99 ERA and 12.9 K/9. That obviously won’t translate to MLB right away, but he could be a great 5th, 6th, 7th inning bridge guy.
He quietly put up very solid numbers last year, I’d agree that a 75-150 type prospect isn’t out of the question at all to the right situation. I’m sure the Cardinals are being “opportunistic” on moving him.
Miles, Cmart, Wacha, Flaherty and Waino (with Reyes hopefully spending time in AAA for service time reasons) are likely penciled in unless injury of course.
Miller, Hicks, Brebbia, Cecil, Shreve, Gregerson, Leone, Gallegos, Ponce, etc are all in line for the BP. And I still think they’ll sign one more piece or trade for one.
Would Gant and JMart bring back Taylor Rogers and another piece? That would be ideal. I’d love to have them both, but there just isn’t room, especially if they play on adding another decent LH bench bat.
Has a Shelby Miller reunion been discussed in any threads?
If not, I know he was non tendered. If he would accept a minor league deal with the expectation of being used out of the BP, I think he’d have the stuff to be a possible bullpen stud coming out for just an inning or two. Just a thought….
I’m still in favor of swapping something involving Fowler and Seager to play 3B. Not sure if that could be a straight swap or not, but we could include a Junior Fernandez or another not top 10 but not great prospect. But then what to do with Carp?
1) Would he be able to play 2B? And then trade Wong for something?
2) How great of a return would he bring back if moved? Probably pretty darn good, but then that defeats the wanting a LHH which is why I was so in favor of the trade to begin with.
3) With all of the “If’s” for 2020, who could move around to make it work.
4) Who could be the leadoff guy? Bader or Wong? That doesn’t feel comfortableIdeally, Carp could play 2B…. but how bad would that hurt the D?
Carp, DeJong, Goldy, Ozuna, Seager, Oneill, Yadi, pitcher, Bader would be the best NL Central lineup in my opinion.
Any thoughts?
For what they gave up, Mo gets an A/A+ for the deal for Goldy! Weaver and Kelly would have been the two most ideal “Trade chips” not really losing much for 2019 stand point.
What other prospects or MLB chips would you folks prefer they move for other needs?
1) Jose Martinez and one of the half dozen AAA OF’s or a Junior Fernandez type for Taylor Rogers is at the top of my dream list.
2) Gyorko has positive trade value and two years of control left, with Munoz and Wisdom as my preferred bench infield guys, he is simply a luxury that could be turned into a good prospect (I love Wisdom for what it’s worth and think he is the perfect bench corner IF bat). – Then use the money to get Britton, only projected for 3/33M. That seems light…..
3) CMart has to be gone due to the lack of giving a crap about playing baseball and would allow them to get a stud prospect or two and then sign Kikuchi or Keuchel to give us a LH starter
4) Fowler for whatever it takes to dump that contract, maybe even sweeten it with a prospect or two. I’d still love Brantley (3/45 is the MLBTR projection, that sounds like a bargain IMO) and Oneill can take over in LF or RF in 2020, if not it seems there are boat loads of OF prospects in Memphis that should be ready.
5) One or two of Gant/Ponce/Helsley for the best possible prospect that is in the lower levels but is “High Ceiling”
6) Several of the Memphis/Springfield OF prospects for the best possible prospect that is in the lower levels but is “High Ceiling”
Poll question: Name the last team that won a World Series without a true “Ace” and true “Middle of the order” bat?
Looked back at the last century winners and made me think of this…. these teams with “5 good starters” and “solid lineups” don’t seem to get it done.
That makes signing Harper (LH, RF, etc) and/with trading the excess and prospects for an Ace then building around that the key for a successful offseason.
Why would a team trading their best pitcher and bat want Wacha for one year? That would make zero sense for Wacha unless there is a third party sending someone to them for Wacha. I’m all on board for moving Wacha, but it has to be to a must win NOW team.
The thought/point of my trade idea was to clear payroll and 40 man spots for other additions, not add Simmons.
I still stand behind working out something for Kyle Seager with Fowler and more from the Cards going there way as well as adding Harper.
I agree Forsch, even if we had to sweeten the pot just a little, that is very close(not Hudson though). The reason they do it is simple, to win while they still have Trout. They fill 4 spots of immediate need with solid pieces and it makes them instantly better in 19 and better in 2020 with Kelly, the other pitcher, and Gyorko if they exercise the option.
Everyone is highly undervaluing Kelly in my opinion. He has continued to produce in AAA when he’s sent down, and the defense is advertised as great. Solid catchers with upside hitting tools are not easy to come by.
Angels and Cardinals trade idea.
The reason the Angels do this:
-Fill their 3B or 2B need
-Fill two SP spots that they desperately need
-Get a catcher with big upside vs what they have
-The biggest reason they do this is to fill in those spots and have a chance to try and contend while Trout is still there.The reason the Cardinals do this:
-Clear (4) 40 man roster spots
-Reduce payroll by $21M if they can keep the money SD is sending the Cards for Gyorko
-Adell is a top 25 ranked LH hitting prospect
-Maitan isn’t ranked, but has huge upsideCards trade – Gyorko (-$13M), Michael Wacha (-$8M), one of Ponce/Gant/Gomber and Carson Kelly to the Angels.
Cards get – Joe Adell (top 25 prospect, LH OF) and Kevin Maitan (huge upside prospect, SH, SS/2B)
Thoughts?
Cario, I would agree that Miles and Ozuna would be tough to sign after that, but Tyler O (Supersub 4th OF in ’18) should be ready to take over LF by then and pitching is so fluid the Miles situation can work itself out naturally.
Regarding CMart, and Corbin or Keuchel, I am a big supporter of breaking up the rotation and lineup for that matter, with at least one solid lefty. Also, and more importantly, having a bit of knowledge on CMart, getting a top 25 prospect back while they still probably can is a smart move. The guy cares as much about being a star pitcher as I do women’s curling.
Side note to my dream of Harper and Seager, if the pursuit of Harper fails, the LH power bat is still needed. Would CMart and Tyler O’neill get Kyle Tucker and a lesser prospect? Then they would have more than enough money to add one of Corbin and Keuchel, Seager and other pieces they see as fits.
I originally didn’t think there was a chance on this earth that Harper was a possibility, but this might actually be the time they do go above and beyond and make a big splash, he’s exactly what they need (LH bat, RF, MOTOB, power, high OBP, etc). Ten years is what it appears will be likely and they might have to over pay a bit. Would 10/350M get him to STL? Structure it from years 1-5 are at $40M and 6-10 are at $30M so that if he falls off it won’t cripple them entirely.
Also, I’ve seen Kyle Seager being a possible trade target, he had a rough 2018, but is still only 30, and hits LH also. A package of Fowler (which helps offset Seager), Jose Martinez (they need a DH), one of Weaver/Gant/Ponce and one of the project bullpen arms or a lesser prospect should get it done on their end.
Then, trade Gyorko, who I think with his contract, would bring back a much better than average BP piece or a solid prospect.
Payroll last year was around $160, with the new TV contract and their “Payroll muscle”, $180 could/should easily be the minimum.
$135M – Per COT’s which includes contracts, arbitration eligible guys and league minimums
-$16.5M – Folwer
-$13M – Gyorko
+$40M – Harper
$19.5M – Seager
$165M is what that would come out to, barely over what they spent last year. That would give them an additional $15M to either sign a very good BP piece or two OR trade Carlos Martinez for a top 25 prospect and top 100 prospect (minus $11.7M) and Wacha for a top 150 prospect (minus $8M) then sign Dallas K or Patrick Corbin.Carpenter, Dejong, Harper, Ozuna, Seager, Molina, Bader, Wong would be an amazing L, R, L, R, L, R lineup that is solid throughout.
Corbin or Dallas K.(5/90M), Miles, Flaherty and two of Hudson/Waino/Reyes/Gant/Ponce/Gomber/Weaver would be a top 10 rotation.
Add a couple of BP pieces and the payroll still falls under the $180M mark…..
Is there anything I suggested that isn’t actually possible? It won’t happen, but I can dream…..