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..umm.. Duh… But it indicates he can do some things.
This guy or brett cecil for the money?
Mikolas probably wins. Less money and he can probably at the very least get people out for an inning.
…and cecil might still end up being worth it.
…and before you say it nate… I am asking “where’s the beef?” too. Little signings like this can be a positive but well… Yeah.
Welcome him because he can probably help. Today is for him. Stanton or whoever (it had better be someone or several someones) won’t happen for a few days.
The giants farm is abysmal. The top four prospects… Not sure how many crack our top 20. I’d have to look but it is pretty bad.
First impression? Imo wacha by himself might be worth those four. Just saying.
Honestly if he can pitch that well in japan he can pitch here.
People have bad first impressions it happens. Seems solid for the money involved.
Yep, much better comp. Forgot soriano.
If he sticks at short he is very solid. If he cant… And the down years could be diaz or grichuk nasty just like soriano.
Fair on the nomar comparison. Nomar also hit for higher average.
His defense was abysmal though..
It was the closest comparison I had. Dejong probably has more power but less discipline etc… point is he COULD be very good… Or he could flame out. Selling high would be understandable.
Diaz just had no place on the roster. You can argue why and what we can do to not let it happen again but they were really stuck.
Heck, almost nobody has mentioned greg garcia either. I’m not sure if diaz even with touches the bigs this year barring a rash of injuries.
For those of you who think we shoukd have gotten more… Here you go.
Remember jeff conine? World series and all star game mvp. Decent career really.
His trade value for most of it? Next to zero. Probably a bit more but still. He even got traded to prove my point.. Look it up.
I will also say I have a soft spot for conine that has everything to do with meeting a very genial man at crossroads mall in omaha when he was at aaa for the royals.
Anywho…
Contrast that to a guy who was the last or next to last pick on a bloated all star roster who swung at everything to the point that he got sent back to the minors. Where he still proceeded to swing at everything but got away with it because he was at aaa.
Diaz. Had. No. Value.
None. Nada. Zip. Zilch.
Now, if you want to argue that we should be selling when their value is high on players like diaz and gyorko then I will agree in principle. But this trade is yet another consequence of choosing to stagnate the roster before 2017. We arent done yet imo either.
Fyi, this year’s sell high on mediocre list off the top of my head :
Fowler : this albatross has nowhere to go in value but down. Way down.
Gyorko : I am split on this one. Depends on other deals. He gives enough value that keeping him is ok.
Dejong : he could grichuk/diaz or he could learn to take even a few walks and be nomar garciaparra. With better defense. I am willing to chance that and hold bit if they deal him I understand.
Yep. It is dumb.
1. We needed a 40 man spot for some kind of move. Doesn’t really matter what… But I’m assuming it is for stanton or another big bat. Which we need. Badly.
2. Dejong, sosa, and edman in the upper minors or bigs at short. Wong, gyorko, and seferina at second. The word expendable comes to mind. And don’t think other teams don’t know that which drives whatever value diaz had waaaaay down. It is called roster pruning for a reason.
3. We get a high end lottery ticket who struggled. Maybe we can fix him in which case we just got a guy like bader with a better arm. If not, we needed the space.
.. But yeah… It was stupid. Or something.
P.s. Blackhillscard — Midwest league aint much better than the fsl… Look it up. Peoria is a frickin tomb to hit in… Not sure about lansing. It is why I will give a guy like carlson major points for surviving that league at 18.
That is your right of course…
The fact that he plays good defense and plays center where less offense is necessary is of course irrelevant.
The fact that he played in the offensively challenged midwest league couldnt have suppressed anything. Nope. Or maybe he needs new contacts like pham did.
Ignore the fact that half of second rounders make the bigs.
Nope… No talent there at all just strikeouts. Nevermind that diaz was never going to get much because other teams could look at our roster situation and do the math. Just concentrate on one stat and throw a tantrum. That’s a smart way to make decisions.
Lower end or so.
But considering that our top 25 would make an absurdly good aaa team that isnt saying much bad about him.
…And yes, I realize that we pretty much had and will have again an absurdly good aaa team. That was kinda my point. We have an absurd amount of depth and if he finds his stroke he will fit right in with the rest.
No… It was after that.
Right before I posted saying it was gone. It disappeared so I said something.
Ill repost it differently but well… My brain is gone at midnight lol
Sosa, edman etc are close enough that even if dejong doesnt pan out we are fine long term. If he does, then diaz is not playing ahead of wong. At that point, he is taking a roster spot we can better use elsewhere.
So what is he worth? It is worth nothing because other organizations know we have no leverage (same as adams). You get a high end lottery ticket for that, you win… Because the alternative is getting nada.
I was stream of consciousness thinking it could also have been a trade just to clear the pipeline a bit… The organization seems to have learned the lesson about trying to hold onto every one — recipe for failure.
You have to prune, reload, and then push forward.
Having said all that about it not being a trade precursor… This would mean to me they would be more willing to trade sierra, bader and/or arozarena… Because he fills a similar niche if he hits.
Yes. I replied to the people saying that this is pruning…
Agreeing.
Also pointed out some other stuff about our organization ss depth and how woodman can play good d.. getting a lot high talent lottery tickets pays off etc.
/shrugs… Cant remember all of it at this point but I definitely said some more.
This trade probably also indicates there are some fireworks coming. Sure they could stop with this deal but I doubt it…
Same type of trade as matt adams. Go get a high upside high bonus guy with power who is decently far away and might have the light turn on… But maybe had an off year.
If you make five of these trades and one works out you look like a genius. Individual trades could seem pretty stupid though.
I like the trend… But people are wondering what they’re thinking without looking at the bigger picture.
Here’s a hint. Yepez, O’Neill and now woodman. What do they all have in common.
Hint: talent and in most cases power.
All it takes is one of the three being a three or four time all star and the cards win those deals cumulatively… Hands down.
We are basically flipping average players for lottery tickets with high upside. Play enough and odds are you win.
It is also how you keep long term depth when youre going to start flipping outfielders.
At this point it would be par for the course. Hard to get worked up when they do the same thing every winter and say “the guy cost too much”… Even if they are right more often than not.
I will say what I said from the start — this makes no sense if they keep carpenter. None.
Has nothing to do with wanting mediocrity.
Has to do with wanting incremental improvement… On top of the large ones.
I want stanton. I’m indifferent on morrison but I can see the logic… Thus I will say something positive.
Nothing more nothing less.
If stanton is our entire offseason I will be extremely disappointed. Even if we get stanton we have to probably dump fowler and others. That outfield is crowded.
Nate’s answer to everything is to go give away the farm or 300 million for the best player du jour.
Not practical even if he does have a point that they really do have a tendency to do nothing repeatedly.
You notice that every player he mentioned is pretty much the highest paid guy available?
Morrison makes sense if they trade carpenter for stanton… Or similar. That’s the best I got. For all I ripped on carpenter this last year he was an above average 1b…
I think a platoon with morrison and martinez (even if he regresses a bit) could do just as well if not better.
That’s actually saying a lot…
How about a different direction (inspired by the logan morrison thread)?
Carpenter, flaherty, knizner and someone else for stanton and another big leaguer of some kind. They can then deal carpenter for more prospects. With his contract should be fairly easy.
/shrugs
What can I say… Had a moment. Not sure if it was good or bad.
As much as I agree with nate’s cynicism in this particular case… I will always bring up 2011 and his relentless negativity… Followed by about three seconds of “oops, I was wrong”… And back to the negativity.
To be fair… He did apologize at the time. Then went right back to the negative.
It could end up being a one for one…??? interesting if so.
unconvinced that would get it done but who knows…
(As always) I still stand by the assertion that his contract is cheap… No matter the sticker cost. One great year and he shoves a very good team into a world series contender. Players like they are worth every penny and then some… Especially to a team with no shortage of very good players but no great ones.
