Forum Replies Created
-
Posts
-
the thing is…people are trying to find reasons to show Yadi is declining to further the agenda that:
-the front office is dumb for giving him an extension
-the extension itself is terrible
-Yadi should be dumped because he is old
-Kelly should be playing more at the expense of Yadi’s timeI just dont see enough evidence (or even a little) to prove he is declining in any way, and if it is it is marginal and still puts his worth higher than any other available option internally or externally…
ha!
I didnt even think about that Brian…i guess i kind of just assumed during September all that stuff went out the door…
thanks for clearing it up!
Matheny isnt going anywhere this offseason…sorry folks…when the Gms didnt give him anything at the trade deadline to help fix the issues and forced him to lpay youngsters that was basically afree pass on the results for this season
which…will still probably be top 10 level in the league despite everyone postings as if this team is terrible and in the gutter
Arent the Cards 2.5 out of the Wild Card? even with no help from management…even with a AAA roster some nights…even with 2 of the 5 starters from the beginning of the year not in the rotation and the first closer washed up or hurt and the second one gone to TJ?
If we arent going to blame the players for losses, and only blame the manager…then shouldnt we blaming ,or heaven forbid give him credit, the manager for all these wins with a AAA roster?
Show me the AAA roster that the Indians, Astros, LAD, Cubs, Nationals, Red Sox, DBacks are playing with…all those GREAT managers and their stacked lineups and major trade acquisitions have nothign to do with it right?
People bash the manager…then go in another thread and bash the players yet dont see a link…this team was supposed to be done after the first month…yet here they are with 1 week to go and STILL despite all the painful losses and poor play and bad decisions and angst from the fans…right in the mix for the playoffs with meaningful games to be played all the way out
managers decisions matter, but players play and team make up matters too…we basically are playing a AAA team with a few MLBers sprinkled in for most of the 2nd half and we are still doing well… you start the season like that and expectations woudl be abysmal…yet with ours we are right there…
all people seem to want to do is BLAME someone…you can identify problems with players and coaches without firing people and DEFINITELY without NOT giving credit to what they have done that is good…living in such a binary way just isnt baseball…wins and losses are added up at the end of the season, but just because you come out sometimes in the red doesnt mean you didnt do good things along the way and that they cant be addressed
i totally agree…thanks for bringing this up… can we get some clarity on it? i was looking on the bench last night but couldnt see him when i remembered to look..
it woudl be weird to not bring him up…he played fine and another bat for the bench and pinch runner is worth it…. he’s a switch hitter…even as a decoy to waste for switchign a pitcher around or getting a pitching change is worth the miniscule money it costs to bring him up for another week
if the Rockies lose hold of that 2nd wild card and us with 3 still against the Brewers …we could once again control our own destiny… i’d be fine with the BRewers aND the Rox freefalling to help, but the Rox losing is the big deal right now…without that nor us or Brewers have a shot
Rox get Padres and Marlins then LAD
Brewers get Cubs, Reds, Cardinals
Cardinals get Bucs, Cubs, Brewers
Cubs…though they have a cushion….get Brewers, Cardinals, RedsReds are our friends right now (after tonight)
Rox have seemingly easy games…but they are definitely scuffling…thsoe last 3 against the LAD might not be hard either as LAD has nothign to really play for and might want to rest up…
Cubs’ cushion is good, but they could lose hold really quick by losing to the Brewers which they have done very recently…though they seem to be trending up unfortunately…if they go cold the next 7 tough games against us and the brewers…they may have to fight to get in with those Reds games…
the fact that the Brewers and Cardinals finish the year against each other helps the Cubs for the division even if they scuffle over the next 7there are 11 to go finish the series against reds tonight…but then 3 series…Wild Card is within ONE series…
the division is 5 games for us and 3.5 for the Brewers…so this weekend sewt with BRewers and Cubs should be crazy….Brewers see it as their last shot at the division and the Cubs probably feel that too…btu not as much as the BRewers i’d think…
Cards have a nice chance to win tonight…then hopefully deal with a Bucs team that seems to have lost it’s fight… a sweep woudl be great…but 2 of 3 would still be ok..
this is about as tight as it can get folks….and very exciting…so many scenarios
where is the proof that MOlina is better rested than not? where is the proof a rested Kelly is better than a playing all the time Molina?
show me the stats on his major decline defensively…and show me the stats that show Kelly would be any upgrade over him in those starts..
Yadi is fooling father time…and until i see him show he isnt i am going to leave him as is…
i watch every game and every pitch…all i see is one of the best catchers in baseball now and ever playing ELITE level defense and game calling combined with top 5 level catcher offense if not higher. Kelly has shown ZERO ability to be elite in ANY regards, and Molina’s age has not shown any MAJOR signs of contributing to lower level offense or defense
last year was a sign perhaps…but then you haev this year…and maybe the signs go away
i like having Kelly…but whatever Molina is doing is working…you can beat father time until you cant…and until i see it i dont believe it…
we are all so spoiled it is sickening…go watch other catchers in the league play….
Posey, Contreras, MAYBE Realmuto, Perez if healthy…have sticks that compare… defense wise…POsey, Contreras, Barnhardt, Pina have good gloves maybe in the same caliber…
also…Yadi cant make up for PItchers not keeping runners on…and even so he still DOES do that…does he have Contreras’s arm….no but no one does…so if this is all comparing to Contreras then what is the point…steals against the pitcher arent on anyoen but the pitcher…
i like Kelly a lot…but i havent see anythign but AAA stats to show he can play in bigs…and there are lots of AAA players that look great that dont translate…no matter how much we want them to
in THEORY i say sit Molina more..and when Yadi is hurting i probably want that to happen even more…but if he is healthy then Yadi shows tells me when he needs the time…once a week-ish…unless he declines heavily somewhere dont mess up what is going well
disagree…fine…but telling me I dont watch the game pitches is disrespectful…his agility seems just fine back there…show me where you dont see it…and if it ot running out groundballs to 2nd base…well that isnt really defense…and for every time i see one from him i can show you a hundrerd other players and catchers who do the same thing
i watch the games and the pitches as much as anyoen else…and i see plenty to say not only is MOlina performing well, but he is elite level and whatever rest he has needed this year and whatever plan they have had for him…it is working…call that the fountain of youth if you want…and he did find it…
there is a lot we can do to get back in the hunt… win games…
we have 3 head to head against the Brewers
4 against the Cubs…
ROckies have to keep winnign too…
none of those teams are going to win the rest of their games… we probably wont either…
it is a long shot, but all we have to do is keep winning games…if we stop doing that…then we have no chance…which is pretty obvious…but if we keep winning we still have a shot..
If the Rox lose 3 in a row..the Wild card is up for grabs..if the cubs lose 3 the Central is up for grabs.. really..there are abuot 5 games before the Cubs and Brewers series…if we can win those and the Rox or the Cubs can go 2-3 we are still in it…and that’s without craziness happening..
yeah we dont control our destiny right now… but that doesnt mean we dont have a chance…and it isnt even that big of a mathematical impossibility…it is tight…losses are bigger right now…but we arent close YETto being eliminated by anything approaching winning out and everyone else losing out…
People have been trying to find reasons all year to give up on this team…from the beginning of they ear all the way through every up and down… just give up already if you are tired of it… I wait all winter to watch baseball…and I am going to take advantage of every game i get…and root on my team all the way the end…and HOPE for the best and not give up on them…and even whne/if they are eliminated i will watch any other games with excitement too..because i look forward so much to baseball and not having it sucks…so i will enjoy what i get….not because i want to see wins and championships but because i love Cardinals baseball….
give up, move on if you want…that is all on whomever…and everyone has their own reasons to do so or not…that is on them… but giving up now if you have been in on them all year seems odd since this has been how they have been all year…
we did win last night…in tough grind it out clutch game…where the veterans bailed out the team more than the youngsters…
i look forward as much or more than most people but i dont hate this team, i think it is an odd team, and not what anyone from management or the players or media or US anticipated…. but it happened…and they are still in it whether you like HOW much they are in it or not…
i know fans of other teams who hate Cardinals fans not because they hate the Cardinals..but they hate the fans because they believe they are spoiled….winning seasons are a big deal to LOTS of clubs…2nd and 3rd place finishes are big things to feel good about.. having a CHANCE even a small one warrants HUGE excitement…having a Gold Glove, HOFer who is playing well would be a thing to cherish and cheer for instead of finding ways to denigrate him or push him out the door…and i have to agree with those fans… we ARE spoiled…
true our expectations are higher…but you dont have to have high expectations without appreciating what you have in front of you….many people in their frustration with results forget the value of what this team and organization has achieved right now…THIS team is not terrible…it is basically a top 10 team in baseball, which means they might miss out on the playoffs…but it doesnt make them NOT a top 10 team…and DEFINITELY not a terrible team by any standards…
yeah we have some issues…but more than half the league woudl LOVE to be in our position right now…
do i want the Cardinals to win…yep…do i like it when they lose? nope…do i get more upset abuot stupid thigns that happen than i should? yep….but why does that frustration have to lead to stop watching or giving up on this team or talking about the players in such a way that makes them come across as worthless….this is a good team…not as good as we want..or what we or anyone expected…but they are going to end up a top team regardless of the playoffs…success isnt black or white…it’s gray…baseball fans of all types of fans should know this and embrace it..
give up…dont giver up…yell and scream or dont…that’s all on whomever…but it doesn’t hurt to take a step back and look at the grand scheme of the league and baseball to get your bearings…
this is NOT in response to any one post or poster…
Sure seems like Yadi playing all the times provides us with pretty good performance and results…. there is no proof a “rested” Yadi provides us an more value and performance than one that plays as he has forever. Yo ucan project him to slide, but until he does whatever he is doing is working and if that is playing 99% of the games, so be it.
man…very demoralizing… had very good chances in at least 2 of those 3 games… hitting just disappeared…
season isnt over…will take some help…but it’s baseball and the rest of these games still matter
GO Cards!
ridiculous display of unprofessionalism by LAckey yelling at the ump during the play…
missed calls happen…to us and against us… frustration is understood but total disregard for decency in the game is inexcusable
ive seen Yadi and plenty of Cardinals get ejected and yell etc and i dont like that either…but DURING the play..that is just unacceptable…
looked like a strike to me and everyone else…and if you are that mad he should have gotten ejected after that call… but he didnt.. HE pitched the next one and gave up the hit.. NOT the umpire… if he isnt confident enough to get one more strike on the opposing pitcher he shouldn’t be pitching
i think if we get swept…it’s not gonna be likely the division comes to us…however it wouldnt be impossible with the way the last week lines up with 4 against the Cubs and 3 against the BRewers
as for the 2nd Wild Card…nothign is written in stone…Colorado has shown they can win against anyone and lose against anyone…Brewers too…and for that matter US too…
getting swept to me doesnt eliminate us but it woudl tough to come back from…nto just mathematically but also the sweep woudl kill any kind of confidence the guys have right now…
shoudl be crazy though
and at the end of the day whether it is the playoffs, world series or whatever…we love watching baseball games that have a sense of mattering…and we are right there…we control our destiny and they can feel it… should be fun..and regardless of the outcome it will be intense…playoffs or not this last push to he playoffs will be entertaining and interesting
Go Cards!
hmmm..
Carp
Bader Pham still not quite right)
DeJong
Jmart
Molina
Wong
Grichuk
Sierra (if he is there in time)Pham is definitely hard to figure out value for.. i think there are plenty of caveats that any other gm could bring up that might be true but still dont change the fact that he has performed as well or better than most other OFers…
ultimately i think we will keep him, perhaps using our OF depth as a fallback option if he diminishes…
i was thinking the other day about how to value Pham if i was given the opportunity on another team to acquire him…lots of flags, but the production is real and dynamic…i was trying to think what type of player i’d deal for that?
what i ended up thinking was a fallen top prospect with potential upside but a faded prospect rating….maybe a guy like Profar….PEraza from the Reds?? I;d wonder if a guy like Healy would match up
and even after that I still didnt know if i would WANT to deal Pham for anyone like that if i were the Cards…
Way i see it…we hold him, and worse case scenario he fades back into the 4th OFer we all figured his role and future woudl be…which is still pretty valuable…best case scenario we get a dynamic hard nosed player for a few more years…
interesting move…i’d think an extra 2b plus rf lf switch hitter would be more valuable right now than a speedy CF that doesnt really steal bases
not sure what the point of this move is…Valera didnt look lost out there when given the chance
4th in DEF WAR 1.4 (behind Barnhart, Pina, Castro)
2.4 WAR (9th overall..4th in players with more than 400 ABs)maybe he had a bad year last year..recovering from hand injuries
but this year he is right back up at the top of his defensive game and his offensive game is still shining brighter than anyone could have dreamed when he came up
watch other games, watch other teams…the combination of offense and defense we have with Yadi is not matched anywhere else
Posey is great too… but most the other great defenders have little to no stick…and their defense still might not be as good as Yadi…and the big boppers of Sanchez have problems with their gloves
and they all run slow outside of Realmuto, but even Posey isnt quick either…they all jog to 1b
Wow. Not even one extra post?
Winning by 5 and super clutch Yadi. Wacha shining.
Why no posting when we are doing well? Unfortunately it is to be expected huh?
Everyone must have to work this Sunday I guess. But people posting on other topics. Guess just no room for angst or evidence of their pessimism in this game so far.
Team is playing well right now with the youngsters really sparking them.
Even if we can’t finish this game off it’s been great so far. But I’d guess everyone would show up if something bad happened.
Regardless, it’s all exciting right now. Every game matters and everything is within our grasp
Go Cards!
Catcher hitting stats
2nd in average with more than 400ABs
2nd hits
4th runs
2nd RBIs
1st SBs
10th HRs.993 fielding percentage
Seems like his hitting is not just average compared. Seems like he is proving worth for his money
I love that people complain about Yadi not running full bore to 1b on groundouts yet they tell and scream about how Yadi how they hate that he doesn’t get enough rest.
Can’t find a good argument about his production being down? Just go with the not running out pointless groundouts and you can feel better right?
My reasoning for making the link of Carp being worse is that I think Jose is worse than Carp…thus degrading 1b…if it is to acquire an upgrade somewhere else great..but we degrade 1b
i get your ideas though…i just dont think anyone will value Carp high enough to make him worth dealing after his down season this year…even if it is injury related…
as for your latest ideas:
sign me up, if we could pull that off…THOUGH I would say that trading for Yelich and Simmons/Bedrosian is going to be VERY expensive in terms of prospects so i am not sure we could pull of TWO big trades like that without severely hurting our depth or forcing us to invest in FA’s to fill gaps
i do think we need to add a backup catcher to that list though…unless we really plan on Kelly playing 1 game a week for the next 3 years
Any team will want Weaver and Flaherty if they want a ready to go young pitcher…and both the Angels and Marlins would want at least one ready to go AND probably one close in deals for their superstars, the Angels need hitters too and we could help them with that but the Marlins need pitching mostly nd know the value of Yelich…and i dont think they take on salary to move him and have no reason to sell him cheap in any way
-Simmons Bedrosian deal, we MIGHT be able to swing Diaz + Wong or Gyorko + Flaherty +another at least but i see no reason they’d want Carp with Pujols and Cron there…eating up 1b and DH……or you coudl throw a deal like Kelly _ FLaherty at them with DIaz and maybe that woudl stick…they might have SOME interest in an OF so that coudl help
-Yelich deal…we could mightbe able to keep it low cost if we had Weaver available…but if not I dont think Hudson + whatever will entice anyone unless they really want Kelly…theyd probably want a replacement OFer too…but it wont be Fowler or Pham or Piscotty…probably not Grichuk either… Bader is probably the high value guy and Sierra is close
nevertheless if we add:
Simmons at SS…we need to move at least one MLB infielder if not two
Hosmer at 1b we have to move at least 1 more MLB infielder
Yelich we have to move at least 1 MLB OFer
Lynn forces us to move one of Wacha Weaver Flaherty..and if only to AAA then we still need 40man space
BEdrosian and Nicasio are two more RPs…they replace Oh and Duke on 25 man…so that plays out well and Rosy’s spot is taken by a youngsterto make it all work I might see: (if it all worked out in our favor …which it will probably not)
Simmons and Bed
for
Diaz + Kelly + PIscotty + Hudson + ArozarenaYelich (they force Dee Gordon into the deal to save money)
for
Flaherty + Bader + Wong + Tuivalalathen add the guys you say we add and you have:
-Cmart, Lynn, Wacha, Waino, Weaver
-Nicasio, Lyons, Bedrosian, Cecil, Bowman, Brebbia, Sherriff
-Carp(2b),Pham, Yelich, Hosmer, DeJong(3b),Fowler, Yadi, Simmons
-backup catcher, Garcia, Gyorko, JMart, Grichukis it a better team?…probably…
As for the players to consider moving…
my untouchable list is:
Reyes, CMart (value and upside is way too high to move either of them)Guys that won’t be traded for various reasons:
Yadi, Waino, probably Fowler and Carpbut that’s it
I like all the other players, but i think we have the depth to move around several pieces to get what we want and still have a good system and have good depth
im babbling..
So you are thinking Carp is worse than Jose at first? overall? defense and offense?
i dont… JOse has been hot… i like him but Carp still has major value and his on base skills are still top end even with a bad shoulder…
if Carp is hurt and has been hurt all year and you can drop SOME of his production due to that injury then I think you have to assume Carp is better than eh is this year…and even this year he isnt terrible… maybe he isnt a #3 hitter but he is still a very good hitter and probably better when healthy
Jose just doesnt have a track record that makes me want to throw away Carp to invest in…and whiel throw away isnt what you proposed..as a means to upgrade another position… if you upgrade another position by downgrading another what have you really gained? other than a little bit of money…
why not move someone else from a position of depth and not downgrade anything?
If Jose is so good why not trade him instead?
agreed… his productions is steady, and the drop in defense everyone seemed to have felt last year seems to be an anomaly as he seems to have regained his prowess this year
yeah..we will be paying for an older player, but he is consistent, effective, a good model
the argument that it is bad seems to me to come from folks who just see Yadi as a means of blocking Kelly… who for all his potential cant touch Yadi in any aspect of Yadi’s game yet