[Cards667]

Have they announced the cable coverage yet? I had DirevTV Stream and watched on Fan Duel, but shortly after the season was able to get more and pay much less switching to Spectrum, which still carried Fan Duel. But now that doesn’t matter. I’d really like to not have to buy the Cardinals.tv and just watch them the same way I’ve been paying to watch them for 20 years and not have to pay more on top of my Spectrum I already pay for. I know I saw something about Spectrum having “Matrix Midwest” but it also said select coverage.

[Cards667]

Forsch, I couldn’t agree more. I’m not big on the return, I think Peete and Lemonjello are very overrated, and Ledbetter might not be very exciting but probably has a higher floor than Peete. Odd they are LH heavy, which leads to Donovan being more tradable and Nootbaar being mentioned a lot, but yet acquire 2 more LH hitters. Maybe I’m very wrong about the return, but if this is what the market was then I’m not sure it was worth it as much as I was in board with moving him fitter the right return to really boost this overhaul.

[Cards667]

I wad all for trading Donovan in the right package. I don’t know that this will be it. Jurrangelo Cijntje is very overrated in my eyes and why STL didn’t match well with SEA for this trade, I don’t like the prospects they’d be willing to part with. When I saw the Rays were involved I was very hopeful my Brody Hopkins prediction was going to happen, but doesn’t seem likely.

[Cards667]

I still think:

Donnie gets traded
Jo Jo gets traded
Noot gets traded
We sign one of Andujar, Hays, or Bader

1B- Burly
2B- Wetherholt
SS- Winn
3B- Gorman and Saggese
LF- Church or Andujar or Hays
CF-Scott
RF- Walker (sigh)
DH-Herrera

I’m in the same boat, and I know you said Crooks being traded, I think it should be Pages. Tampa’s trade for Lux may have squashed my latest idea of sending Donovan and Pages to Tampa; Nootbaar, Romero, and Prieto to Arizona with a prospect from Tampa and the Cardinals getting SP-Brody Hopkins and OF-Jamie Quinn-Irons from Tampa and OF-Ryan Waldschmidt and IF/CF-Tommy Troy from Arizona. I think to Donovan options are getting limited to mostly San Francico and Seattle, maybe the Yankees. I see a lot about Montes and Cijntje from Seattle and I don’t like either of them.
I like the idea of signing Andujar, but he would DH mostly for me to start the year and get some LF and 1B time. I want to see Harrera behind the plate again about 60% of the time and DH the other 40% letting Crooks have that 40%. Pozo has options and can start the year in AAA and if Herrera can’t handle the catching the go with Crooks and Pozo, until Bernal and or Rainiel are ready to get their chances in the future.
Something like
1. Wetherholt -2B (L)
2. Winn – SS (R)
3. Burleson – 1B (L)
4. Herrera – C (R)
5. Gorman – 3B (L)
6. Andujar – DH (R)
7. Church – LF (L)
8. Walker – RF (R)
9. Scott – CF (L)
Saggese- IF (R), Fermin- IF/OF (R), Torres-OF(L), Crooks- C (L)
But also why I liked the idea of adding a legit SP prospect like Hopkins in the trade for Donovan and also getting Waldschmidt who could move into LF or RF sooner rather than later and a guy like Troy who could take CF if Scott proves hes not an everyday player or if Gorman isn’t the answer at 3B, Wetherholt could shift to 3B and Troy and Saggese could get 2B and start shaking things out for the future of who is built around.

[Cards667]

Trade 1)
Arenado, Romero, and $18 million (paid 12/6) to Seattle for Comp B pick, OF- Korbyn Dickerson(A+), UT- Brock Rodden (AAA)

Trade 2)
Nootbaar, Contreras, and $16 million (paid 8/8) to New York Mets for 3B/1B/LF-Jacob Reimer (AA), SP-Jack Wenninger (AA-AAA), RP-Ryan Lambert (AA-AAA)

Trade 3)
St. Louis Gets: OF-Ryan Waldschmidt (AA-AAA)(AZ), 2B/CF- Tommy Troy (AAA)(AZ), SP-Brody Hopkins (AA-AAA)(TB)
Arizona Gets: 2B- Donovan (STL), IF-Prieto (STL), SP-Baz (TB), SP- Pepiot (TB)
Tampa Bay Gets: C-Pages (STL), OF- Koperniak (STL), 2B-Marte (AZ), Comp A pick (AZ)

Sign- DH-Miguel Andujar (1 year/$3million), RP-Luke Weaver (1/$2), RP-Justin Wilson (1/$1.5), RP-Drew Pomeranz (1/$2)

1. Wetherholt – 2B (L)
2. Winn – SS (R)
3. Burleson – 1B (L)
4. Herrera – C/DH (R)
5. Gorman – 3B (L)
6. Andujar – DH(1B/LF/3B) (R)/Crooks- C (L)
7. Church/Fermin/Saggese – LF (L/R/R)
8. Walker – RF (R)
9. Scott – CF (L)

Saggese – IF/LF(R), Fermin – IF/LF (R), Torres – OF(L), Crooks – C (L)

Liberatore(L), McGreevy, Fitts, Leahy, Pallante

Kent, Pushard, Pomeranz(L), Fernandez, Svanson, Wilson(L), Weaver, O’Brien

I don’t know if Kent was awarded a 4th option year officially or not so I went ahead and put him here. Obviously, Pushard is Rule 5 pick and would have to be kept on the active roster.

In AAA:
Troy plays 2B and CF. If Scott isn’t the answer in CF then Troy can start getting looks. If Gorman isn’t the answer at 3B then Wetherholt can shift to 3B and Troy and Saggese can get looks at 2B while also being Utility.
Waldshmidt and Baez are both RH hitters and can start making their case for LF spot and possibly RF spot to if Walker doesn’t show improvement.
Pozo available to C depth, Bernal keep progressing hopefully. If Herrera can’t stay behind the plate at least 60% of games then give Crooks more time with Pozo recalled for depth until Bernal is ready to get a look to compete with Crooks.
Have Roycroft, Raquet, Graceffo, Granillo all on the 40-man for the shuttle back and forth, possibly Hence too if he can be healthy.

2026 would be a rough year, figure some things out, and have depth from A+ all the way though AAA to keep progressing and building from within to be ready to call upon a few for 2027 and more for 2028 and hopefully be competitive in 2028.

[Cards667]

Pages isn’t bringing a bag of cracker jacks back.

I think his value is pretty good, probably higher than Nootbaar right now. Would bring back by himself more than a lot of the other names we’re all mentioning here as “tradable”, other than Donovan.
Crooks could fail, just like every other prospect. But hes hit at every level and hes highly regarded behind the plate. I give him a chance and if Bernal and or Raniel over the next 2 years prove they are the real deal then Crooks is either easy to move on from, a good trade piece, or makes one of them a top prospect trade chip to load up an area of need.
I think Church is a 4th OF, he’s bringing back little, less than Pages. And I’m not sold on Scott at all. He has good defensive value. But guys with speed as their number 1 skill is tough. They have to be on base to use that skill and they are 1 leg injury away from losing a half step that no longer makes them relevant at all. I know pitching at the MLB and AAA level is pretty thin, they do have some promising arms as you go a bit deeper. But they did with Hence too and he can’t stay healthy. But this OF could be a mess. I understand wating to get a look at Torres, but let’s not forget hes 5’7″ 165, 28 years old, and was signed out of independent ball.
If, and big if, they can move Donovan, Arenado, Contreras, Pages, maybe Nootbaar (but who knows if they have Nootbaar when he’s available) you’re looking at
1. Wetherholt – 2B (L)
2. Winn – SS (R)
3. Burleson – 1B (L)
4. Herrera – C/DH (R)
5. Gorman – 3B (L)
6. ??? – DH (R)/Crooks – C (L)
7. Church – LF (L)
8. Walker – RF (R)
9. Scott – CF (L)

Saggese – IF/LF (R), Fermin – IF/LF (R), Torres – OF (L), Crooks – C (L)
Still a lot of LH redundancy, Prieto and Koperniak on the 40 man in AAA LH also, and a very questionable OF.

[Cards667]

Church and Crooks are trade bait in my mind since they are highly redundant

I think Pages should be moved before Crooks. Pages value is high. Let Herrera have another shot at Catching 60% of the time with Crooks getting the other 40% and let Herrera DH those days. If Herrera needs to go back to full time DH then Crooks gets a shot at full time and Pozo backing him up and Bernal in AAA awaiting his chance at getting time with Crooks or over Crooks.
As for Church. I could see it. But also could see LF being quite the “black hole” this season. I think as is stands now Burleson will get time out there and some at DH. But if Contreras is moved, Burleson takes 1B where he belongs. Church I think is first up in LF, assuming Nootbaar isn’t ready or not with the team. And LF could be a Church, Torres, probably Fermin getting time out there and hope Baez wasn’t a flash in the pan and can develop to get a chance by 2027 in LF or possibly RF if Walker can’t prove he can take steps forward.

[Cards667]

Seattle is looking for 3B and LH RP help.
I say Arenado, Romero, and $16 million (11 in 2026 paying half of what Colorado isn’t and 5 in 2027) for Comp Round B pick, A-A+ ball OF Korbyn Dickerson, and another minor leaguer around Dickerson’s value, which isn’t super high.

Then get serious about who’s making the offer you can’t refuse for Donovan. And if something comes along for Contreras, Pages, or Nootbaar you can’t pass up do it. I think Nootbaar needs to be traded, but the injury makes me worry the return isn’t what it would be, being this injury has kept others out over a full season. But if I could swap Noot to the LF needy Dodgers for River Ryan I’d do it quickly.
I think Pages value is as high as it’s ever going to be and with Crooks and all the catchers in the minors it makes sense. Herrera wants to get behind the plate again and I’d open the year with Herrera part time C and part time DH with Crooks and if he becomes full time DH then Pozo was re-signed as depth until it’s between Crooks and Bernal for now.
I think Cleveland is probably the best match for Donovan. They are always watching money and Donovan is affordable, 2B is a need, and they have prospects to make it happen. Contreras could make sense going there too, if the Cardinals covered enough.
I read somewhere the Cardinals were interested in LH RP Yuki Matsui when he came out of Japan and they could possibly take a flyer on his “bad contract” to help off set one of their bad contracts too if they were to match up with San Diego on something.
I don’t know how they would match up with Atlanta but they have some arms I really like for not having a highly rated system, including Luke Sinnard. He’s not a highly touted prospect coming back from TJ surgery last year, but he’s 6’8″ with mid 90’s fastball and good breaking stuff all generating good K numbers with solid control.

[Cards667]

In four years, Houston went from the #9 to #30 payroll. That’s payroll-shedding at its most extreme.

Yes they were shedding payroll, but it wasn’t the main focus. They still took on an expiring bad contract or 2 in that time to improve prospect return. The main point I was making is this isn’t a “tank” for the purpose of getting top 5 draft picks the next 4 years as they did. It’s about shedding big contracts the ownership doesn’t want to pay and being cost effective and building a deep minor league system.

You say “the minor league system is very sub-par.” This is as accurate as the Astros payroll observation. The Cardinal farm system is distinctly above average right now. Fangraphs has them #2 in the sport, which is too high by perhaps 5-7 slots. But it’s good-to-very good. Link: https://www.fangraphs.com/prospects/farm-system-rankings

Ok, how about the system has no MLB ready prospects and is bloated on a lot of lower level guys. Weatherholt is MLB ready, LH hitting 2B that makes Donovan more of a redundancy. The pitching is thin with lots of injury and question marks. I wouldn’t say the syetem is good, average at best, with the potential of being good if a lot of these low level guys prove they are legitimate prospects, Baez isn’t a flash in the pan prospect. Gorman and Walker aren’t going back to AAA and they have no value right now. 2026 and 2027 are developing at the MLB level and who’s being built around and who moves on. Accept the fact St. Louis is a smaller market and the way of business isn’t going to be aging veterans or large contracts going forward they will do little in free agency. This administration will want a strong system with multiple guys able to shuffle back and forth to AAA, and trade guys approaching free agency when they have high value and have a system ready to replace the guy. Building from within and being cost effective.

[Cards667]

As I and others have mentioned, tanking won’t work like it did for the cubs and Astros, because due to CBA changes, the tanking team does not get the same budgetary advantages as before. It won’t work

This isn’t at all about “tanking”. Yes those teams purposely were bad but in doing so would also trade for players that were on bad contracts and take on the money to get more prospects back in return. Like if the Cardinals were to trade Donovan to the Phillies and take on Castellanos in the return to boost the prospect package even higher. Houston did very little to she’d money during their tank. You keep saying tanking, as you’ve mentioned and it’s absolutely not a “tank”.
Donovan is 28 and only controlled for 2 more years. This team is not going to be a legitimate competitor in those 2 years. The minor league system is very sub par. Trading Donovan now is his highest value and a chance to bring in legitimate prospects to help that. Not a current “ace” or #2, but maybe a future. May not work out, but it’s their best chance. Same with Romero talk. He’s not bringing the same package but he’s a free agent after the year. Same with the Nootbaar talk. Only 2 more years of control, but his injury complicated it. I’d trade Pages too, his value is high and the 1 thing the system does have some promising talent is catcher. Trading Gray and probably Arenado and possibly Contreras is about getting as much money off the books as possible and opening a chance to look at guys to see who’s being built around and who’s getting replaced. The DeWitts are tired of paying big contracts and getting a middle of the road team. They don’t have the money to pay multiple big contracts and the front office people they have brought in have worked for organizations who were required to build off of limited budgets and building a cost effective roster. Donovan is good, affordable, and 2 years of control with defensive versatility making him wanted by all. I like him too, but he doesn’t fit into the 2028 and beyond plan when he gets expensive if they can keep him at all. They have too many LH bats and the most likely replacement is LH too.

[Cards667]

Right now, they are “supposed” to spend 150% of those revenue

That doesn’t seem right.
Team A: Slightly bigger small market receives $50 million would be required to spend $75 million. $25 million of own money.

Team B: Small market receiving $100 million is required to spend $150 million. $50 million of own money.

So, these small market clubs are receiving $270 million per year without doing anything for themselves.

Not doing nothing themselves. That number includes the 34% they put in too. I get the point. But everyone is paying into the pool.

There is a huge market advantage to certain markets. And allows them to be very active in free agency and extending players contracts. Then there are the other 20 teams that have to be financially responsible. The Cardinals aren’t in the teams that have money for sure. The DeWitts own a business and want to be financially responsible and cost effective. And I don’t blame them one bit.

[Cards667]

LACardFan couldn’t disagree more. The DeWitts have been “crying poor” munch longer than that. They have said for years baseball isn’t a profitable business, and it is a business. There are major expenses, players making crazy money, many many coaches and front office personnel, and thats not even all the “small” departments like marketing and tickets and the people who run all those offices. Even the Cubs owner has said “with what money” when fans have cried for them to spend more on FA like the Dodgers and their market is substantially larger than St. Louis. “Welfare for billionaires” that are expected to compete in a game with the ones paying the welfare are making 10 times what they are. I’ve said before I like the open market side of baseball, but I think something has to be done with the financial disparity of the top 8-10 over the other 20. I think if a team is receiving revenue-sharing their payroll has to be 100% of what they receive + a number based on market size. But something needs to be done to bring the top down to the field, but placing a hard cap on them just means those owners are profiting more. So the luxury tax system could be reworked.

[Cards667]

There is a LOT of money in sponsorship. Just take a look at how much signage is around every professional sports venue, especially MLB stadiums. But, if attendance is down then the viewership of that signage is down and when those contracts are up for that signage then the new selling cost of that signage is going to be lower. So, that money may still be there now because of a contract, but in the future could be much lower. So there is probably current money to send with Gray or Arenado and such, but the futures could be lower.
As for consessions, a lot of that isn’t controlled directly by the Cardinals. They have a say for sure, but a lot of that space is leased out. Then that company is the one paying those employees and the costs. I’m sure there is a contract there also and a licensing agreement with the Cardinals logo printed on the stuff. It wouldn’t be cost effective at all for the Cardinals to be in the “restaurant” business and leasing that space out is much more controllable income. And again, lower attendance is going to mean lower sales for those companies and effecting the leasing cost of the space.
But anyone who thinks St. Louis isn’t a smaller market can look at the numbers the last few years. Sure the team performance hasn’t been great, but the cost of staying alive has skyrocketed and the disposable income in smaller markets just isn’t there for the people. I’ve said before, I live 2.5 hours from St. Louis, and considered “in the St. Louis market”, and for 15 straight years my family vacation every summer was the Cardinals-Cubs series in July. Come in Friday afternoon check into the hotel and go straight to the game, Saturday was Six Flags or Grants Farm or whatever, then the game, then go to Sundays game and head home. Usually would make our way over at least 1 other time for a game. Even after I got into high school and older I would find my way to at least 2-3 games a year. But I haven’t attended a game in over 5 years. The cost of getting to St. Louis, possibly a hotel, then the cost of attending the game is just not worth it regardless of the quality of the on field product. Larger markets with higher immediate population and a higher number of higher incomes (LA/NY/Chicago) are going to have less of an impact. The markets like St. Louis, Cincinnati, and such are going to notice it more. People have said St. Louis is a larger market because they have such a sprawling fan base going back many years. But I think the lack of disposable income this sprawling fan base, including me, that used to be making trips to St. Louis just don’t find it justifiable to spend the money doing any more. And the ownership knows it and sees the future and spending money isn’t going to happen. It has to be about investing in minor leagues and controllable players and having a cost effective roster. And if that means the roster the next few seasons is sub $100 million then so be it. The cost of what’s on the field has nothing to do with me watching or being a fan. They have to build a sustainable business model and where they are now isn’t, which is how they’ve come to hiring the people they have who came from organizations (Tampa Bay, Cleveland) who have had to build success on the same model. The problem is for something like 18 of the last 20 World Series winners have come from a top 9 payroll and I don’t foresee a future where the Cardinals are able to afford that. Which comes to the 2027 CBA and what happens there and if we even have a 2027 season.

[Cards667]

I don’t mind taking a look at Leahy as a SP in 2026 at all. McGreevy, Liberatore, Fitts have a little more leash. Leahy take a look. Pallante on a shorter leash. If you don’t like what you see with Leahy and Pallante as SP in 2026, they have proven to be serviceable RP and hopefully out of Mathews, Henderson, Mautz, Hansen, Doyle, Hence (Health?, is is treanding more RP now?), Roby (Health? Going to miss all of 2026, maybe RP now too), Hjerpe (Health?) make strides to work their way into getting their shot at SP in 2027. And that’s just the top names right now. See how things shake out, who else could be added during trade this off season.

[Cards667]

I’m saying the $20 million isn’t spent, I’m fine with it. Along with whatever else is saved in trades. If they have the lowest payroll in baseball this year, so be it. Get the system rebuilding that’s goal #1 for 2026. Go with a young roster playing to prove they belong and are a piece that needs to stay for the future. Start weeding out whos not staying, who is redundant and can be moved to fill other holes. Bloom needs to tell the DeWitts to invest any money saved the next 2 years because he’s coming for the money plus some in 2028. And I don’t see them signing a SP at all. McGreevy, Liberatore, Fitts, Leahy, Pallante will be the 5. Mathews, Henderson, Mautz, Hanson, Hence, maybe another from a trade are all possible as the season goes on and see whos healthy.

[Cards667]

I am so sick of this small market stuff. If anything, the cards have one of the biggest markets geographically speaking. They have fans covering at least 6 states. Their franchise is one of the most recognizable in all of sports. If the front office is truly convinced that they can’t compete with the likes of la or ny, etc, they should quit the majors and become a triple a club. That’s the team they’ve been playing with over the past few years anyway!

Market size rankings for the CBA in 2022.
235 – Yankees and Mets
180 – Dodgers and Angels
120 – Cubs and White Sox
115 – Blue Jays
111 – Giants and Athletics
110 – Phillies and Nationals
102 – Red Sox
99 – Rangers
97 – Braves
92 – Astros
87 – Mariners
79 – Twins
76 – Diamondbacks
74 – Rays
73 – Tigers and Rockies
69 – Marlins
68 – Baltimore
62 – Guardians and Padres
58 – Cardinals
56 – Pirates
55 – Royals
51 – Reds
50 – Brewers

Clearly the Cardinals can’t compete with NY and LA. And the problem in baseball right now, i love the “free market”, but LA and NY are significantly larger than the rest. Then the next 7 are still pretty large. Then the rest I’d say are pretty “competitively equal”. St. Louis isn’t anywhere near a large market, if they were the Rams wouldn’t have left for the LA money either.

[Cards667]

The Cardinals are NOT in a rebuild. They have Winn, Donovan, Burleson and Herrera. Get free agent pitching.

They are though. The new front office says they are. DeWitt’s want a cost efficient roster that they clearly don’t have. There’s a reason front office personnel was brought in from the likes of Tampa Bay and Cleveland. They want teams built from within on a lower budget that is easier to sustain. The big contracts are gone, they aren’t going to spend big money on aging players, and they for sure aren’t going to spend money for the 2026 roster on top free agent pitching. Anybody who is within 2 years of free agency or on a big contract is very susceptible to being traded and rebuilding a very weak minor league system. They should have done it 2 years ago and most likely would be on the upward swing, but they dug a deeper hole trying to hang on. Now they have bloated, hard to move contracts, on a roster that isn’t winning with a AAA team that is far from providing immediate help. They have to move people, probably people you don’t want to see go and get the system rebuilt so the team can hopefully compete by 2028, but could realistically be 2030. Just the way it is. It’s not easy to accept as a fan, but to the DeWitt’s its still a business and you can’t sustain a business losing money and paying big money, in a bottom-middle market, for middle of the pack performance. I think they try to build around Winn and probably Herrera. Burleson, hopefully, but depending on what they can get done with Contreras or Nootbaar with his injury, it could be a hard decision they have to move Burleson to get anything significant to the development of the team. But I think Donovan is their best and easiest trade chip right now and will be traded. They want to reduce the redundancy and trading Donovan moves a LH bat they seem to have many of right now, but probably replaced soon enough with another LH bat in Wetherholt.

[Cards667]

The Cardinal Way is now as a feeder club for MLB.

Yes, until they can build their own feeder clubs up to provide quality big leaguers that can contend.

[Cards667]

If I was betting on this, I would obviously take the Dodgers, but I’m sure I’m not alone in rooting for the Blue Jays.

I’m rooting for the Dodgers. I hate the payroll advantage 3-4 teams have, but the Dodgers have built a fun team to watch. Yankees and Mets have the same monetary advantage and haven’t built it. And I can’t root against Tommy, Kike, Freddy.

I saw something earlier and it may not be exactly the right numbers so don’t hold me to it exactly, I’ll try to find it and confirm again, but 13 of the last 15 world series champions have come from a top 9 payroll. 2017 trash can Astros were one of the outliers. Money has become a huge issue in baseball with those who have, have a lot more than those in the middle, and those at the bottom are closer to the middle than the middle is to the top. Which is why I say the 2027 season will be lucky to happen. Players don’t want to cap their earnings when most aren’t seeing the super high dollars until they are 30 and ownership of 20-24 teams is tired of the other 6-10 having a significant money advantage that the current tax system doesn’t even phase them to pay.

[Cards667]

Dodgers sweep. And then there will be a lockout in 2027 as ownership will be demanding a salary cap to prevent teams from being able to buy championships.

[Cards667]

I’m not sure how much interest the Dodgers have in Arenado. They have a $10M option on Muncy.

I agree I think their interest in Arenado wouldn’t be high, but a guideline of how they are going to have to get things done if they want to move some of these contracts and start over. I think Gray is very tradable, but the Cardinals are going to have to eat around $15-20 million to make him tradable. 1 year of Gray at $20-25 million is tradable, but hes owed $35 and a $5million buy out. So you eat it, or find someone needing catching help and tack Pages with him and probably still have to eat the $5 million buy out.

[Cards667]

I would rather trade one or two of Contreras, Noot, or Donnie for pitching.

Agreed, but I think we will see them probably package some guys together to get out of the money as much as possible. Like along the lines of,
Arenado, Nootbaar, Romero and $20 million to Dodgers. Muncy to Houston. Cardinals get 3 prospects from Dodgers and 2 from Houston. They won’t be the highly touted guys doing this, but it saves them money. Could take a chance on getting a guy like River Ryan coming back from TJ surgury and 2 prospect arms from each. Houston needs a LH bat, Arenado will accept to the Dodgers and they get a LF better than Conforto for sure, and as a bonus everyone gets to go “home”. The 3 to LA are from Southern California and Muncy is from Texas. Didn’t mean to do that but when looking them up I noticed it.
They could do along the same with Gray and Contreras with Donovan and Pages. Using their value to off-set a lot of the money. The thing I really don’t like doing it with Donovan is he is by far their highest trade chip and they wouldn’t get the same return as just trading him alone, but if getting out from under the money quickly is a priority then it’s how I think it gets done.
I will also say Cleveland lack of offense has me intrigued as Robert Cerfolio knows their system well and has a relationship with them and Contreras could be appealing to them. And again maybe a 3 team thing where the Cardinals could send Gray to somewhere, they send offense to Cleveland with Contraras too, and the Cardinals getting prospects from Cleveland.

[Cards667]

There’s no such thing as a team that is better than it’s W/L record. It doesn’t exist. Not anywhere at anytime.

I disagree. You can look at run differential for instance as an easy indicator. Tampa Bay has a 75-78 record with a +52 run differential and the Cardinals have a 74-79 record with a -58 run differential. That is 110 runs different favoring Tampa Bay, but only 1 more win. Tampa Bay is better than their record indicates and the Cardinals are worse than their record indicates. Using Baseballreference Pythagorean W-L it says the Rays should be 82-71 and the Cardinals should be 71-82.

[Cards667]

I like Burly’s bat but I don’t like his OF defense and he is blocked at 1B by Contreras and blocked at DH by Herrera so I could see the Cards trading Burly, Gorman, and Walker for pitching.

I hope they keep Biscuits and let Herrera catch, Can convince Contreras to accept a trade at the deadline and then can move Biscuits to 1B and Herrera can go to DH mostly with some catching and maybe learning some 1B too. Open catcher to Crooks and have the organizational depth they have to trade from there to get what’s needed.

[Cards667]

Personally I think Bloom will make 2 big moves. Arenado, Nootbaar, Romero, and cash to the Dodgers for some prospects. Then will also move Donovan for a haul of prospects. The rest of the moves will be minor trades and non-tenders of Roycroft, Siani, Munoz, King, and probably Alcala. And then they will sign a cheap LH relief pitcher. And we’ll see

1. Wetherholt – 2B (L)
2. Herrera – C (R)
3. Burleson – DH (L)
4. Contreras – 1B (R)
5. Gorman – 3B (L)
6. Winn – SS (R)
7. Church – LF (L)
8. Walker – RF (R)
9. Scott – CF (L)

Saggese – IF (R), Fermin – IF/OF (R), Pozo-C/1B, Pages – C (R)

Prieto, Koperniak, Jordan, Crooks all on the 40 man and awaiting injury to get the call.
Yes I think Herrera has to get back behind the plate and they will carry 3 catchers because I expect Herrera only catches 3 games and then will DH 2 games moving Burleson to LF.

Gray, Liberatore (L), McGreevy, Pallante, Mathews(L)
Leahy, Graceffo, Thompson(L), Granillo, Fernandez, ???(L), Svanson, O’Brien

With a long list of question marks of who gets the call when O’Brien gets hurt. Maybe Hence, Robberse, Naughton are healthy. Maybe they sign 2 cheap RH arms too and use Granillo and Fernandez going back and forth to Memphis as needed.

But I expect it to be a lot of the same as this season and hope they can get good play and convince Contreras and Gray to waive their no trade clauses at the deadline to move on and totally start over and keep trying to build the system up to compliment whatever they determine are the keepable pieces off the roster. I said before they could contend by next season if they had fully tore it down and started the rebuild last off season. With what they have done I think it will be 2028 at the earliest before they are contenders and if they don’t sell off this off season, and convince Contreras and Gray to go at the deadline, it could realistically be 2030 before they have a contending group.

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