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It’s pretty hard to predict a lineup for this group until the spring games wInd down. I think some spots will actually be won on performance. Or at least playing time to open the season. Urias makes it interesting. He could earn some pt if JJ or Gorman struggle badly. Church could definitely win an outfield position if he hits. Scott could transform his value if he can get his obp up enough to lead off. Anyone saying Wetherholt will leadoff is probably just looking at his college days. If he hits I see him hitting second. The biggest question for me is what happens with Noot if Church plays well?
It’s pretty hard to predict the remainder of Noot’s career too. Is he done? Can he still play the outfield if/when he returns? Is he a DH only now? We are sure he’s a short timer. Whether he has value going forward is TBD.
jj said:
One of the sites is the Cardinals.com, that reports Marmol spoke of JJ at leadoff, and the other players that Goold didn’t omit. The recent Urias article.
Apologies to 1982Willie and thanks to jj-cf-stl. It isn’t a direct quote, but Marmol must have said it.
Here is the link. https://www.mlb.com/cardinals/news/ramon-urias-contract-with-cardinals
IMO, it is very odd that out of one side of his mouth, Oli is saying that JJ has to make the team. While out the other side, he says JJ is a contender to lead off.
I still believe JJ batting leadoff day one has a very low odds of actually happening, at least in a sane world.
Goold isn’t as impartial as you are BW. He parses the info and writes his version.
You present your info straight up like you recieved it, as the Commish did. Hat-Tip.We are sure he’s a short timer.
Hopefully he builds enough value to flip him for something decent at the td.
MLB has the Cards lineup ranked at #26. Sounds about right. I’m thinking if there is a season in 2027, we might see some help. Names like Bernal, Baez, Levenson, etc should improve things. Plus there is bound to be a few surprises.
1. Nootbaar – LF (L) – if healthy and ready
2. Winn – SS (R)
3. Burleson – 1B (L)
4. Herrera – DH (R) – still would like to see him catch some
5. Gorman – 3B (L)
6. Pages – C (R)
7. Wetherholt – 2B (L) – I don’t see him not making the team, lead-off man quickly?
8. Walker – RF (R) – Hopefully the adjustments make a difference a moves his way up the order
9. Scott – CF (L)1. Urias – IF (R)
2. Fermin – IF/LF (R)
3. Church – OF (L)
4. Crooks – C (L) – Pozo?If Nootbaar isn’t healthy the leadoff spot is very, very muddy and maybe Wetherholt is there way before most expect. Church probably plays LF, with Fermin against LHP, and Torres making the team as the 26th man. With the signing of Urias, I think Saggese is probably bound for AAA, unless Wetherholt does start the season in AAA.
As for the back-up catcher, I would keep Crooks over Pozo, for the fact Bernal is probably the AAA catcher and they are both gold glovers who need to be catching and not DH. I’m still of the belief I would trade Pages and let Harrera catch 60% and DH 40%, with Crooks getting those 40% starts behind the plate and Pozo in AAA if Herrera can’t handle the catching load then it becomes Crooks job to prove hes the guy, with Pozo recalled as his back-up, with Bernal and Rainel in the minors keep pushing for the future. Especially with Urias on the roster now too, he could play 3B often on the days Herrera is catching and have Gorman as the DH.Noot can’t run and Ivan hasn’t thrown or started behind the plate, so availability has Ivan as the DH with Pages as the starting catcher, up to today. If they view Scott and Winn as leadoff types, then get them up there, sink or swim.
L CF scott
R SS winn
L 1B burly
R DH herrera
L 3B gorman
R C pages
R LF fermin
L 2B jj
R RF walkerI’d have Saggese in LF if he’d stick around. Out of sight, out of mind. The outfield carousel is alive and well.
1) Winn
2) Urias/Torres 2B
3) Herrera DH
4) Burly 1B
5) Gorman 3B
6) Saggesse RF
7) Velazquez LF
8) Pages
9) Scott CFBench: Fermin, Pozo, Church, Torres
Memphis: JJ at 2B, Crooks at C and Walker with Baez in OF
Springfield: Unfortunately, for now, Bernal stays for everyday PTI think there is a 95% chance Wetherholt opens the season in STL.
I like the idea of giving Scott a shot at leadoff if Noot isn’t ready. If Scott can become more proficient with his bunting he could become a modern day version of Vince Coleman.
We really need to de-clutter at the catching position.
1. Scott CF
2. Winn SS
3. Burly 1B
4. Herrera DH
5. Gorman 3B
6. Walker RF
7. Wetherholt 2B
8. Pages C
9. Church LFBench: Fermin, Pozo, Urias, Saggese
GScott, couldn’t agree more with the decluttering of the catching spot(s). The best value coming back and considering redundancy would be Crooks.
By the time the Cards are contending Bernal and maybe even RR will be ready.
2ndly, I’m hoping they just move Herrera to LF to “save” his health for the plate.I don’t understand how a guy who can play 2B, 3B and CF, and even be 3rd catcher, who had a .441 OBP and .905 OPS in Memphis get more love…..
Torres for Cards allstar in 2026!!
Right now guys are hitting against a lot of pitchers who will go back to the minors. Check back towards the end of ST before writing it in ink.
If you quit looking at our other roster positions, catcher won’t look so cluttered. Our catcher position depth just looks cluttered in comparison. This is the depth we want at every position and there is no logjam today. Rinse and repeat 25′ at catcher. Go back where you were and continue to develop.
Just to clarify, if we have a catcher logjam, it is not of ML catchers. Pages and Pozo both OPS+ 78 last year. If serviceable is the standard, OK then, but where does that get us? 80 wins year after year? We need to develop difference makers, not serviceables. The others are hopefuls who so far are good in the minors. I think Crooks is next up for a good long look. Then Bernal. We will see how it goes with A ball guys. Guys get better, guys plateau. guys get worse. Bottom line, don’t count your logjams before they are hatched.
Bernal, Rodriguez, and Crooks aren’t guys I would be willing to part with until at least one of them proves to be an above average ML catcher.
Quit counting Herrera at catcher and theirs no clutter, just a promising bunch of guys who need to continue to develop where they are. Ivan is eliminating himself from the competition, last season and currently.
For a team who is so desperate for better quality players at several positions it would make sense to me to cash in on the one position we have depth in.
Right now Crooks, Bernal, and Rodriguez are all perceived within the industry to have a bright future as a big league catcher. Trade one of them before they prove otherwise.
I agree we would have to trade value to get value, and trading from an area of organizational depth makes sense. Mo became gun shy about that, for good reason. So far Bloom has just offed guys with expiring control, so we don’t know how he will be with trading value in areas of surplus for value in areas of need.
On most positions I agree GS, but not catcher, not now. Catchers get hurt a lot.
Trade Crooks, followed by a Pages injury this month? That’s a heavy workload on Doc Pozo, so we make a backfill acquisition, to prevent rushing Bernal if Pages loses significant time.
Ivan caught 101 IP of our 1432 IP thrown last season. The catchers are seperating themselves. There’s very little Sho-Me in Ivan’s catching role.
Mo and Oli managed the catcher position correctly last season. From Contreras to 1B, to Crooks debuting. There is the correct depth for the Crooks decision not to be rushed, again.
The box score this morning says Herrera started a ST game at catcher yesterday. He must be cleared to throw thru.
1. Nootbaar – LF (L) – if healthy and ready
2. Winn – SS (R)
3. Burleson – 1B (L)
4. Herrera – DH (R) – still would like to see him catch some
5. Gorman – 3B (L)
6. Pages – C (R)
7. Wetherholt – 2B (L) – I don’t see him not making the team, lead-off man quickly?
8. Walker – RF (R) – Hopefully the adjustments make a difference a moves his way up the order
9. Scott – CF (L)Lol. If, after all this time, Walker and Scott are batting 8 and 9, respectively, isn’t it time to give some other guys some MLB at-bats? Likewise, Gorman. It’s official, we’re not trying to win, but rather, rebuilding. I’m not saying we should give up on these guys, but if they don’t come out of the gate looking like Musial, or at least Brock or Flood, we should cycle some other guys through the lineup.
You realize Walker is still not yet 24 and Scott is only 25. You have pretty lofty expectations of the young guys it seams. I’m not sold on either, but they deserve a shot to prove themselves. I’m hopeful Walker can become a productive hitter. I’m less sold on Scott, I don’t have high expectations of a player who’s only true elite skill is speed, but maybe he can develop into a serviceable CF. They have been getting Saggese work in LF and CF. I think he could become a super utility and playing a lot and all over the place, especially vs LHP. It’s looking more and more likely Nootbaar won’t be ready for opening day, though I read he remains hopeful. But the leadoff situation gets really complicated without him. I’m not a fan of Herrera hitting leadoff, like they’ve done in spring. I wouldn’t be against
1. Wetherholt – 2B (L)
2. Winn – SS (R)
3. Burleson – 1B (L)
4. Herrera – DH (R)
5. Gorman – 3B (L)
6. Saggese – LF (R)
7. Crooks – C (L)
8. Walker – RF (R)
9. Scott – CF (L)Urias – IF (R), Fermin – IF/LF (R), Church-OF/Torres-OF/2B (L), Pages – C (R)
And a time or 2 a week get Herrera behind the plate, Gorman at DH, and Urias at 3B.
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