Trade Ideas/Acquisition Ideas/Non-Cards Rumors – 2021-2023

Home The Cardinal Nation Forums Open Forum Trade Ideas/Acquisition Ideas/Non-Cards Rumors – 2021-2023

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  • #220348
    jj-cf-stl
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    What we could receive in return for PDJ or O’Neill is of little concern to me. PDJ is a FA-to-be with a 2mil buyout and O’Neill is a Non-tender candidate.

    The roster needs to move on from PDJ, O’Neill and Yepez, opening DH for Walker, Winn as the 3rd MI when ready and LF for Donovan.

    #220349
    jj-cf-stl
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    There is a discussion to be had on Donovan or Gorman at 2B going forward, the other playing corner OF or DH. They both need to start over O’Neill.

    If your choice is Donovan at 2B, because it’s higher on the defensive spectrum, and he’s a better 2Bman than Gorman, it’s logical.

    What that leaves us is two 3Bmen and a 1Bman for two positions; a corner OF and DH (Gorman, Walker and Burleson). Gorman may be the best outfielder of those three, I don’t know, but he needs to start Vs both righties and lefties somewhere.

    #220365
    gscottar
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    As Mike mentioned this roster has way too many duplicate players. It needs to be thinned out.

    Candidates include:
    O’Neill
    Burleson
    Yepez
    DeJong
    Edman
    Donovan

    The only one of that group that I would feel strongly about keeping is Donovan. He is just a winning type player and can play 2B or LF more than adequately. Carlson might have a little value remaining because of his prospect pedigree but we really don’t have anyone else who can play CF daily so I would keep him.

    As for the pitching, the question isn’t who you would trade but who you would keep. Frankly I don’t think there are any untouchables nor are there many who have much trade value. Montgomery might have some and maybe Helsley or Gallegos but that is about it.

    #220367
    1toughdominican
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    I’d place O’Neill, Burleson and Yepez in one category of duplicate players and Edman and Donovan in another entirely different category of duplicates. And in my view, DeJong’s name belongs in a category all to itself of which I’m not entirely certain what the descriptive term for that category would be unless it was simply a waste of time and effort. The first three names I’d term as OF bats with occasional and inconsistent power with one of those OF’ers possessing a nice glove. The last two names I’d term as versatile MIF’ers who both possess nice gloves with the proven potential to be top of the order table setters. I’ll also say that the fact that DeJong has received a reasonable amount of playing time this season is a clear illustration of just how confused and convoluted the ’23 Cardinal edition has become in regards to retaining anything that vaguely resembles stability or definitive roles in the area of position players. He should have been gone over the winter.

    #220372
    LACardFan
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    The last two names I’d term as versatile MIF’ers who both possess nice gloves with the proven potential to be top of the order table setters.

    I fail to see why you believe Edman is a “top-of-the-order table-setter”. He has a career .321 OBP. This year, it is .304.

    He should have been gone over the winter.

    Yet he has a .382 OBP so far this year.

    So, in your mind, a .304 OBP is top-of-the-order and a .382 OBP should not even be on the team.

    #220375
    1toughdominican
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    Well LA, I’m certainly no arithmetic genius, so I have to keep things simple, and the simple fact is that over the course of what could be termed 3 full seasons, Edman crossed HP an average of 92 times a season. Now, I know that everyone’s entitled to disagree, but I happen to believe that runs are still important…

    #220379
    1toughdominican
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    And yes, LA, in my view the guy with the .382 OBP should not even be on the Cardinal team. Not even during winter…

    #220380
    since1948
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    I, too, would never trade Donovan. I also think Edman brings more to the team than the others you might list. Gorman is a keeper, Walker is a keeper. Of the other possibilities, they would not come back to haunt, but salary and control might be advisedly applied.

    Minnesota has a weak hitting outfield. It seems to me that adding a strong bat who can play decent OF would help them more than losing one of their many strong relief pitchers, era less than 3. An even trade, money for money, control for control, would help both clubs.

    St. Louis is not out of the race, far from it. They are currently only 5 games out of a wild card, 7 games out of the lead in their division.

    #220381
    1toughdominican
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    I agree, 1948. Eddie’s undoubtedly the trade chip that would bring the highest return of all the position player pieces that I’d guess the Redbirds would be willing to part with. He’d be a nice centerpiece in a package wrapped up and adorned with Johnny’s bowtie…I’ll add that there’s without any question a multitude of both contending and noncontending teams that would love a chance to have him. If he goes, I hope he goes to a winner.

    #220393
    jj-cf-stl
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    One last thought on O’Neill and PDJ. They are using 14mil of this seasons budget. Bring them both back next season and they’ll use at least 20mil.

    #220520
    Cardinals27
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    I don’t believe in selling low. But a PDJ trade value could be at an all time high, but it may be best to use him as depth this year, and deal him this off season, or buy him ou. I see no reason to deal Yepez or O’Neill unless they are part of a multi player deal for a good starter.

    #220635
    since1948
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    There are a few teams still thinking they might compete for a post season slot with whom the Cards could make a mutually beneficial trade. I look for teams who have excellent relief pitchers they could make available, teams whose overall ERA is in the top 10 overall…and who have weak hitting outfielders.

    The most obvious one is the Mariners. They are is the weakest part of their batting order and overall they are 27th in batting (OBP + SLG). Their pitching, however, is 4th best in baseball, based on ERA. In their bullpen are several relievers with ERA under 2.00…Topa, Murfee, Gott and Speier.

    A simple trade of O’Neill, for one, for any of those arms would benefit both teams

    #221732
    CardsFanInChiTown
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    If the season ended today, would Paul DeJong’s option be picked up? The difference of the buyout ($2m) and potential salary ($12.5M) is only $10.5M which is slightly above the value of 1 WAR.

    I never thought I’d say this, but as of today I’d say yes.

    Thoughts?

    #221733
    jj-cf-stl
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    If it ended today I’d say yes, they’d pick it up. If he continues his 2023 as is, up to the deadline, would you trade him or keep him?

    #221742
    CardsFanInChiTown
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    JJ, my answer to that is 100% dependent on O’Neill and Carlson being back. As well as the return in the trade, no longer is he just a salary dump.

    I don’t see Winn being ready 4/1/24 personally. So they need 2 out of DeJong, Edman and Donovan….. with O’Neill and Carlson back they would not have to use them in the OF.

    Side note, I do think Yepez and Burly would have MUCH better numbers if they played everyday.

    #221748
    gscottar
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    I would say no they wouldn’t pick it up but it least it is debatable now. Kudos to Paul for making it debatable. That doesn’t mean they couldn’t bring him back next year though. Pay him the $2M buyout then offer a one year $7M deal and see if someone else wants him more than that.

    #221749
    Oliver
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    The problem with Yepez and Burleson is that they don’t have a position. So they are not going to get regular at bats. I am not high on either but prefer Burleson. Yepez can’t play defense to save his life.

    #221750
    gscottar
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    Neither can play defense. The only regular position for Burly and Yepez is DH but that is now locked down by Gorman and Contreras, which is foolish.

    #221869
    since1948
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    Cards problem is not hitting. They are, overall, quite good at scoring runs. Call me Mr. Obvious.
    The problem is pitching. Even if the hitters manage to squeak us into the playoffs, facing the opponents best pitchers is not, has not been, the way to advance.

    Any team having more than adequate pitching will be reluctant to part with any arms. Can’t blame them, as you can easily track one team after another where the staff deteriorated over the course of the season due to injury. you sort of figure that about a third of your contracted pitchers will be recouperating or rehabilitating at any given time.

    Most GMs look at the roster and ask themselves if they can count on the team getting into the playoffs with the current roster, then, at deadline, try to tweak to get one or two people who will give them the best shot in the playoffs. You don’t go after a #4 pitcher at deadline, you look for a 1 or 2 man, starter or reliever. If you are really serious, you take on a FA coming up banger or pitcher.

    So, how does Moz address the pitching problem? I think he has to look for the hitters to get the team into a position where the playoffs are likely, then make the big adjustment, to get a #1 or 2 starter and another stud reliever.

    #221870
    since1948
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    Why was Libertore used in relief this week?

    #221876
    gscottar
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    Why was Libertore used in relief this week?

    In general it was because we foolishly went to a six man rotation during a stretch of 19 consecutive days with a game, therefore, depleting our bullpen. However, I think the specific game he was used was a blowout so he really wasn’t needed. I guess they considered it the day he would throw in between starts.

    #221877
    gscottar
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    Cards problem is not hitting. They are, overall, quite good at scoring runs. Call me Mr. Obvious. The problem is pitching.

    This is true although I would argue that one of the reasons our pitching was so bad in April is that we were using a totally inadequate defensive outfield. That has been somewhat corrected but Burly and Yepez should still not be used out there.

    I don’t like our chances of landing an ace in a trade or free agency. We just never do that. Either the prospects asked for will be considered too high or the contract asking price will be too high. A more likely scenario is Mo going after more middle of the rotation starters or perhaps a number 2. Bieber and Sale could be targets but Cleveland and Boston are most likely not going to be sellers in my opinion.

    The White Sox, however, should be sellers. They are going nowhere this year. They have guys like Giolito, Cease, and Lynn who could be available.

    #221880
    stlcard25
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    Philadelphia could be thinking of trading Nola if they can’t get it going, too. He’s the guy I’d probably take over them all if I knew we could get him signed for next year and beyond.

    #221882
    blingboy
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    There are a lot of click bait articles out there with enticing headlines and zero substance. The once legit SI is especially egregious. “Linked” means some pundit thinks the Cardinals will be a good fit for some good starter, whose present team would have a use for something the Cardinals might potentially offer up. It would be great if SI would resort to actual sports journalism to attract readers.

    #221883
    CardsFanInChiTown
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    Pitching (playoff pitching) is obviously a major weakness with all 3,4 and 5 starters currently. Who would even start game 1 of a playoff series?

    Giolito (FA end of year) and Bieber (FA after 2024) are the two that could be available and would be an actual upgrade.

    Cleveland definitely needs OF bats which is why I think they might match up well with the Cards. With Giolito a FA after the year, I hear rumblings here in Taxville, USA that the Sox are going to move him. I don’t see Cease getting moved since he has 2.67 years left.

    As far as relievers go, Aroldis Chapman would sure be a nice back end of the BP guy.

Viewing 25 posts - 1,751 through 1,775 (of 2,445 total)
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