May 22, 2021 at 8:11 pm #162038Cardinals27ParticipantPaid - Annual
Someone mentioned Jon Gray. That is an interesting thought. Although dealing with Rockies again will not go like the Arenado trade.May 22, 2021 at 11:07 pm #162084
Something tells me Colorado will not be trading with the Cardinals again anytime soon. The optics wouldn’t be good for them.May 26, 2021 at 12:40 am #162391Cardinals27ParticipantPaid - Annual
Another idea is to get Raisel Iglesias from the Angels, who should be willing to deal him. Perhaps Woodford for him? Valuable experience as closer and depth would be much needed.May 26, 2021 at 11:27 am #162429
I don’t see an Iglesias move so quick after they acquired him…
I wonder about a guy like Ian Kennedy, veteran but has been getting the job done for years now with little acclaimMay 26, 2021 at 1:54 pm #162442forsch31ParticipantFree
Iglesias will be a free agent after the season. Once the Angels are convinced they are out of the playoffs, he will be available. The downside is that he has a contract for over $9 million this year.May 26, 2021 at 6:17 pm #162492
Right, but by the deadline roughly 6mil will have been paid by the LAA.May 27, 2021 at 6:23 am #162509stlcard25ParticipantPaid - Annual
A little off topic, but is there a way for mods to remove tags from threads? Looks like some spammer got to this thread and put some very annoying tags onto the post. *Edit* Huh, weird. I dunno if Brian or Mike or someone got to them or if my deleting them as I did my response did the trick. Either way, glad there seems to be a way to rid yourself of them.
Also, on topic…Max Scherzer. Make it happen, Mo. It helps two issues because you then get someone like Gant into the bullpen, where he can be a real weapon. Then you can purge Webb. If you want a relief arm, perhaps Minnesota’s Taylor Rogers? He’s got another year after this one and has been pretty solid, although he has given up a couple of homers to lefties that have hurt his numbers there.May 27, 2021 at 9:58 am #162520
I would put Max Scherzer AND Brad Hand in the shopping cart. We need the Nats to stay in last place.May 27, 2021 at 10:26 am #162523stlcard25ParticipantPaid - Annual
I’m not sure if we could pull off both those two without losing a guy like Gorman or Liberatore. I feel like two separate trades may hurt less.May 27, 2021 at 6:42 pm #162543
Rodgers would be a great acquisition. With plans of moving Reyes to the rotation next season, Rodgers 22′ under club control fits well, as a proven closer should.
Five save opps in 50-ish games?!? We could put him to better use than that.June 7, 2021 at 1:15 pm #163418
I like the 1 stop shopping that the Twins might be able to provide. If we are going to lose something important I want to make sure we bring back things that are good, and hopefully fix more things
-Berrios is under control for another year and is a good 2 to Jack and fill in 1 for now
-Rogers is a beast of a lefty RP and also a solid closer, everything TMiller was supposed to be and is under control
-Kepler is under control until age 31 (6.5,6.5, 8.5, 10option), not a high average guy but has 30 HR power and is a lefty, can play all 3 OF spots and decent speed.
-Astudillo…well I love this guy his versatility and ability to MAKE CONTACT is unparalleled perhaps in the history of the game. He would be an immediate fan favorite (trust me, go look at his love), and his multi positional flex would allow him to pinch hit and still stay in the game so Yadi could stay in (protecting us from injury to Yadi). In effect he provides an extra bench player as we no longer have to keep the backup catcher in a glass box. Also, as my trade idea has in it Knizner he replaces Knizner on the roster with a competent backup catcher.
This would be a costly trade, but none of the parts would be rentals and all have enough upside to be worthy of losing big prospects.
one more good prospect (MNunez, Fletcher, Burleson)
We take on SOME money, but it is good money and nothing crazy (unless Kepler’s contract is too long), nothing that would even stop us from upgrading something else in the offseason (and might even allow us to focus on one thing instead of lots of moves)
Twins save a considerable amount of money for their payroll, and snag a ton of prospects in the process.
I even think my offer is probably way too light, and might require BAder or Thomas or a bigger prospect like an Angel Rondon, Jordan Walker or Maisyn Winn, or maybe even swapping in Libertore for Thompson. Also, losing Libertore could be mitigated by having Berrios to some degree. Especially given the climate for trades and the Cards desperateness
Oviedo and Thompson are no joke good prospects, and will be cheap for the Twins for a long time. Knizner slots in right now with Garver out and maybe allows them to use Garver as DH more.
This a trade of young upside over established solid but unspectacular not young and not old vets. You know what you are getting with Berrios, Rogers, Kepler and Astudillo. Maybe there is a little upside in Berrios and MAYBE Kepler can be the .250 hitter instead of the .220 hitter. But these guys have been doing what they do for a while.
It would be a blockbuster, and cut our farm way down. BUT it would provide more than rentals and gives us a nice at minimum 2yr run with solid players and allow in the offseason Moz to find a way to afford Max.
Jack, Max, Berrios, Hudson, Mik……..Reyes/Libertore
Hicks, Rogers, Gallegos, Helsley, Genesis, Gant, Ponce, Whitley/Woodford
Anyways…my trade is definitely off… (BAseballtradevalues has us undergiving by 40ish…though it has Kepler’s value really high and AStudillo’s too so i think it is a bit off..but still weighted for Cardinals too much in my proposition) but the basic tenant remains… closer, frontline SP, Lefty masher, and for me a replacement catcher with versatility…that solves a lot of concerns and should get us back to the playoffs and maybe get back some injured folks for a big push. All while not sacrificing talent for only THIS year.
revised for baseballtravevalues to make it work:
eek…that’s a lot…that would hurt…but i do think this site is not exactly right and there are discrepancies…still…June 13, 2021 at 8:05 pm #163908ThegreyghostParticipantFree
I’m not sure I would want this front office making any desperation trades at this time, the best thing to do I think would be to clean house in the front office and start fresh next yearJune 13, 2021 at 9:10 pm #163928Card4EverParticipantFree
If the Cards keep playing as craptastic as they have been lately, do they sell at the deadline, and who could the sell that would bring value back?June 13, 2021 at 10:45 pm #163932LACardFanParticipantFree
who could the sell that would bring value back?
We need Andrew Miller to pitch the rest of the season like he did this week.June 14, 2021 at 9:59 am #163955
If the Cards keep playing as craptastic as they have been lately, do they sell at the deadline, and who could the sell that would bring value back?
I don’t think the Cardinals will be sellers because their schedule is about to ease up so we will probably stay close enough to Milwaukee and Chicago not to sell. But if they did want to sell they really don’t have much that other team would want.
They wouldn’t trade Waino or Yadi.
Expiring contracts like Carp, Mikolas, CMart, Kim, and Miller wouldn’t bring back much due to money owed, injuries, and poor performance. Maybe a Class A lottery pick.
DeJong might fetch a decent prospect but he is hitting under .200.
Goldy won’t be traded because the Cards would have to pay down some of his money owed.
Edman, Carlson, O’Neill, Cabrera, Gallegos, and Reyes would have trade value but those are the kind of players the Cards would want to keep. They are cheap and relatively productive. I just don’t see them being sellers.June 14, 2021 at 3:13 pm #1639841964cardsParticipantPaid - Annual
Agree with most everything you laid out there gscottar. Another approach would be to start getting ready for 2022 and 2023. That is, play the guys you want to find out about (the following is not an all inclusive listing of thoughts).
1. Sosa should see regular playing time. He should start at 2B if Edmund is going to play in the outfield. He should play short and third when Arenado and DeJong need a day off.
2. Plan of giving DeJong at least four to six days off a month in an effort to provide more rest in an effort to improve his overall performance.
3. Send Williams to Memphis to get as many 3A ABs as possible. See if he is salvageable or not. I would bring Dean up to replace him. I know he is not a LH but the team is not getting much production out of Williams.
5. Relegate Carp to a bench roll.
6. Leave Oviedo in the rotation the remainder of the year.
7. Move Gant to the bullpen and replace him in the rotation with Woodford. You find out what Woodford is capable of and you strengthen the bullpen.
I am sure others will have thoughts that top these.June 14, 2021 at 3:54 pm #163986
I like all of those ideas. Austin Dean isn’t talked about much but his injury really came at a bad time. Playing time in the OF opened wide up and he got hurt. In fact he may still be on the IL. I like his bat a lot more than Williams, Thomas, or Nogowski.June 15, 2021 at 10:47 am #164027
I agree about Dean getting a shot, though I am liking Sosa’s bat a bit more than Dean’s so, Edman in RF is my preference.
If I am Moz and Girsch I am thinking about moves that help longer than this year, because in the offseason there is a lot of money leaving but also a lot of spots that need to be filled. Money alone can buy you some, but a trade NOW when we really need it could be exactly what we NEED to do.
I think we need a minimum of one impact SP, and RP right now. Maybe a flier on another SP too. We also need another bat (probably OF).
I am on 2 trades:
Berrios + Rogers
Merrill Kelly + Peralta
Other than Peralta they all are able to be signed through next year for reasonable amounts. And to be honest, re-signing Peralta for a 11yr deal with option (yes even at his age) might be a smart move as we are still lacking depth in the OF that is close enough to help.
Here is how i see it:
Kim = Hudson
Waino = Berrios
Cmart = Kelly
Miller = Rogers
Carp = Peralta (lefty rotation/matchup starter/lefty bench bat)
Berrios is high enough quality combined with Hudson and the coming of Libertore to fill out the top end of a rotation.
Question is always what it takes to acquire these guys, but I think there is a deal to be made with the Twins…probably hurts a bit more than we’d like but Rogers and Berrios are serious players. The DBacks have made several deals with us in the past and i think they know our system and the potential of it so I think they’d be much more apt to make a deal than let’s say the Marlins or Rockies.
Kelly is no world beater but he will eat innings. Peralta is the kind of guy we can acquire right now, he is too old to require much and the DBacks are going no where so saving some cash would be good.
Peralta + Kelly
Yepez + Ponce + JWilliams
They get a cheaper replacement for Kelly, a decent lottery ticket in Yepez, and a lefty OFer that is younger than Peralta who in their house might be a a bit more productive.
Berrios and Rogers will hurt, both are big time tickets for any team and the Twins know they can hold them to get whatever they want late. So this is going to hurt, but i think the Twins know the value of quantity over big name recognition. Still it will take something impressive to get them to move NOW, when we need it.
Still I don’t want to move Gorman, Herrera, Libertore…and hopefully not Walker (we just need as many hitters as possible)
Berrios + Rogers
Thompson + ARondon(or Oviedo if they value him higher) + MNunez + Burleson
(i would personally try to get Astudillo for Knizner if possible and maybe it could help tilt the scale)
I am not sure this is enough to get them to move, so maybe it has to be something like:
Walker, LThomas, Whitley
It all depends on who they are high on, but these are not rental prices…these are 2 years prices so we have to remember we can fill some of the the losses to the farm from the 2 new drafts that will happen
21 would have it’s reinforcements
22 would be pretty set, barring a lefty hitter for the OF (like Peralta)
Jack, Berrios, Kelly, Mik, Hudson….. Libertore, AReyes, Oviedo
Hicks, AReyes/Oviedo, Gallegos, Rogers, Gant, Genesis, Helsley, Junior etc.June 16, 2021 at 9:25 am #164103
I like David Peralta for the Cardinals. He doesn’t move the needle a lot but would be a nice complimentary piece. I would view him as an upgrade over Justin Williams. I would send Elledge and Hurst to the Dbacks for him and if he does well the rest of the year you consider a one year deal for 2022. If not, you don’t.
As for pitching I think I would wait until the offseason to go after Scherzer. Assuming he comes off the IL soon I think the asking price for him will be prohibitive. In the offseason he will only cost money. A guy I would look at is Andrew Heaney of the Angels, assuming they are sellers. He is a rental but shouldn’t cost too much. Like with Peralta if he does well you try to bring him back next year. I would send Ponce, Seijas, and Romeri to the Angels for Heaney.
These two moves wouldn’t be huge for the Cardinals but they might be enough, along with our injured players coming back, enough to put us in the playoff conversation in September. Then go big in the winter.June 16, 2021 at 10:37 am #164111
I tend to agree about Peralta…solid 4th OFer to rotate for injury and handedness specialty
I am trying to look at teams that are possibly looking to deal now, I like Heaney but i think the Angels are pushing not flailing
I like Scherzer but i am not paying his price for this year…maybe in the offseason…but even then he will be a bidding contest even at his age.
To me I am looking at KC, Minny, TEX, ARZ, DET, SEA…I like PIT but intraleague rarely seems to happen
then i think about combo deals…instead of trying to deal with too many teams and deals
and hopefully more than a rental
TEX is intriguing with maybe Kennedy and Gibson and maybe Gallo
Minny…obviously as i said above
Det…maybe…Boyd just hit injured list…
KC has some starters..
SEA…Haniger and some mediocre starters…maybe Flexen?
Merrill Kelly and Peralta deal..
find one more starter independent…
Getting 2 starters now…could allow Gant to move to pen…or Kim…or even Oviedo or Cmart
To me Merrill and Berrios move the needle for the rotation and bolster the pen
adding Rogers moves the needle in the pen and with the help from the rotation of whomever moves into the pen creates much better roles and an imposing pen
Peralta as you said is a good complementary piece…but Haniger is a strong option too if he coudl come for a decent price
At the end of the day i dont think they can survive to the trade deadline or injury returns… it would be a hope and prayer for a wild card spot and that would depend on the injured coming back truly healthy and performing
Losing Jack should have been a really big wake up for the Cardinals…it truly exposed their dependency on having a stopper…Waino is our Ace now and that is very uncacceptable as organization… Mik was no guarantee for health, Kim for effectiveness, Cmart for anything, Waino, for age, Gant etc….that is not a responsible way to go into the season… we need a big time #2 every year…
Don’t wait…actJune 16, 2021 at 11:02 am #164114
It does make sense to focus on teams that are definite sellers, which the Rangers are. Gibson and Gallo would check off two boxes for the Cardinals and they are both controlled for 2022. I imagine the asking price would be rather high to get both of them. Dahl would be cheaper but he may not be much of an upgrade over Justin Williams.June 16, 2021 at 11:16 am #164115
Miami also has some pieces of interest, 3 OF’s and 3 pitchers come to mind.
Corey Dickerson, currently on the IL.
Anthony BenderJune 19, 2021 at 5:06 pm #164395
In the off-season I strongly advocated for the Cardinals to sign Adam Duvall and I wish they had. He still doesn’t hit for a high average but he is crushing the ball power wise. Hit his 16th HR of the year today and his on a very cheap one year deal.June 21, 2021 at 5:25 pm #164499
With the injury to Brian Anderson, and him being moved to the 60day IL, I wonder if Mo would shop DeJong and his contract?
Short term we cover SS with Sosa and set up for an acquisition at SS this winter. DeJong has a contract MIA could live with and they may want to move the remaining salary on Marte.June 21, 2021 at 9:53 pm #164507LACardFanParticipantFree
Given the type of year DeJong is having, why would Miami (or any team) trade for him?
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.