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To get Bieber, it would probably take Hence plus Edman and maybe Gomez or Baker thrown in or Hence plus a group package of something like Gomez, Yepez, some other non-40-man promising pitcher (Bedell or Mautz seems about right), and Herrera.
It’s a lot for 1 1/2 years of a pitcher who would likely be our best pitcher, but not necessarily a dominant ace and who could get hurt on day 1. I guess it depends on what we see as the future on Hence vs what Cleveland thinks they could do with him and maybe on how likely we are to re-sign him. But I think Hence would need to be included since we’re not likely to give up Walker or Wynn or Nootbaar and any other path is just too many players.
To get Bieber I was thinking we would give up something like O’Neill, Burleson, Herrera, and Graceffo (injured).
I’d take that deal. But I don’t think the Indians will. O’Neill likely has very limited value now – especially with his current injury. But even before that, I think he didn’t have a lot. And with Graceffo being injured, this looks even worse for Cleveland. That’s why I think Hence almost has to be included if we want an elite pitcher with more than just this year left. I guess Edman + Carlson goes a long ways, but I feel like that hurts the team now so we get diminished value for Bieber.
The Guardians desperately need offense, especially in the OF and at C. They probably would want a young pitcher also. I think we could come up with a package they would take as long as it doesn’t involve Walker or Winn.
Trade simulator has gscottar’s proposal as 50.8M coming to St Louis and 53.6M going to Cleveland. So it may be a better proposal than originally thought.
Mid season trades often ask for a premium – especially on good pitching. We’re likely to have to come up with closer to 70M in value to outbid others for Bieber. And I’m not sure trade simulator is updated on O’Neill’s or Graceffo’s current injuries.
I’m all for hoping Cleveland would take O’Neill and value him at a $25M surplus. But I just doubt that would be the case. I’m guessing his market value right now is closer to $10M. So we’d be selling low.
You have to not only have a top end starter or two, he/they have to be healthy at the end heading into post. Otherwise, you might as well not have them. I think Mo has that in mind. An injury and they are basically done for the duration of their contract. Done as a front end starter or done completely. I think he has that in mind also. I’d be surprised if he goes all in, all the eggs in a basket, at the deadline or over the winter.
That’s the plan, stlcard25. Edman’s the only player any other team would covet enough to consider parting ways with a quality, top shelf, SP’er. Anyone else is brass plated and would return nothing more than a laugh. I think the Cardinals would be willing to offer him, so if the Cardinals make a trade that could be termed significant, I’d expect to be watching Eddie play in the post-season and crossing HP for another team.
Possibly, but he’s not as established as Eddie and hasn’t been exposed to the scrutiny of other teams to near the extent Edman has. Furthermore, Donovan’s not even arb eligible until ’25 and makes a little over $700K to Eddie’s $4.2M. Moreover, when Johnny’s on the phone with a suitor he can point out that Eddie has $27M Trea Turner outclassed in every category this season when he makes his pitch for a SP’er…Haha! At any rate, the short straw may be the good one if either one of these kids care about playing in a WS.
To get Bieber I was thinking we would give up something like O’Neill, Burleson, Herrera, and Graceffo (injured).
We not only have to offer a good deal, we have to offer something the Guardians want more than whatever others are offering. Somebody will offer an impact bat, either MLB with years of control or top of system ready to break in. They are definitely not going to bite on a basket of iffy complimentary types.
I think that offer has more value than you might think. Sure it could be switched around by adding this or that but I don’t think it is that far off. What I do know is that the Guardians haven’t had a decent OF in years. Maybe they want Noot and Carlson instead of O’Neill and Burly. I am also aware that their catching situation is terrible. Herrera would look good to them. Also remember that Cleveland is CHEAP. One of the lowest payrolls in MLB. Quality players earning the league minimum is what they want but if they think they are getting Walker, Winn, or Gorman then they can forget it. Bieber is good but he also will be a free agent after 2024.
Now they are speculating that Goldschmidt could be on the trading block in the Redbirds fall out of contention.
I would view that as highly unlikely. Mo has already stated that he expects us to be buyers. Even if we don’t gain any ground they will probably just stand pat instead of sell. The fact of the matter is that is mathematically difficult to be out of the race in this weak division. The winner might have 85 wins or less.
If Goldy was traded, some fans would assume the team has given up and would stop coming. Ownership won’t let that happen.
I guess even with the new scheduling it’s mathematically possible to win a division with a sub .500 W/L record, but I think the honorable thing to do would be to gracefully bow out and refuse participation in the post-season if that were to occur…At any rate, the ’05 Padres were the worst to ever win a division championship with an 82-80 W/L record which was good enough to win that season’s NLW by a full 5 games over the second place D-Backs. They were swept 3-0 in the first round by a 100 win Cardinal team.
Goldy’s pretty good, but I’ll bet Redbird fans would keep showing up if Goldy were traded for Freddie…
A) Goldy is not getting traded
B) as much as I want them to get a top notch starting pitcher, I don’t remotely see that happening now. The potential sellers don’t have anything they would want.
C) The biggest upgrade I can see realistically is a RHRP and a LHRP. Chapman wouldn’t hurt one bit and shouldn’t cost the farm. Liam Hendricks would be a nice addition as well.
PS: who the heck is going to start games in 2024? If your answer is Matz, I have a few acres on Mars for sale
2024? We’ve got the illustrious Matz until the end of ’25 to prove he’s worth that 4 year contract…He still has plenty of time to make Johnny happy!
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