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As a day off for Edman? Sure, but Edman leads the team in GS frequently.
If Edman went IL, then you’d have an open roster spot to bring up a glove first minors SS like PDJ this season, if you’d be willing to have a lesser offensive lineup.
If Edman went IL, then you’d have an open roster spot to bring up a glove first minors SS like PDJ this season, if you’d be willing to have a lesser offensive lineup.
Winn will start 2023 in Memphis and the glove looks pretty legit already. I also like his gap to gap power and think he will be a solidly above average hitter, although next year may be stretching it.
Then again, I’d consider Edman a glove first guy too. He’s never finished a full year with an above average batting line. Hopefully this will be his first.
I am not sure anyone could be added at SS that provides less offense than DeJong. He’s been atrocious since that little power splurge we went on after getting called back up. Since Aug. 10, he is slashing .150/.250/.233 with 27 strikeouts and 6 walks. He has nine hits in that span. The slash line is inline with his season overall, too. When he does make contact, good things tend to happen. But, he just can’t get the bat on the ball and at this point, that’s probably not going to change. He is a okay fielder at SS, but you need elite glove work to over come those pitiful offensive numbers.
I don’t think anyone is suggesting that PDJ should be on the opening day roster next year all things being equal. But all things are not equal. He is owed $9.1M next year and that can’t be ignored. It is most definitely a factor. Could the Cardinals release him? They could. Could the Cardinals trade him for some Class A player while eating at least $8M of his salary? They could. But will they?
why not try to fix DeJong’s problems? Are organizations limited in thinking that the only way to get a player back on track is to send them down? Let them “work on it” at a lower level? That didn’t work with Carpenter and it didn’t work with DeJong. Carp signed with Texas, I think, and then started to show some promise. The Yanks almost immediately grabbed him and boy, were they happy they did.
So, apparently there are guys called ‘swing coaches’, not ‘hitting coaches’? I guess at the major level, if a guy does a bit better this year vs. last year, the hitting coach gets credit. Does worse? The Hit coach gets the blame. But, actually, do hitting coaches usually do any good?
Edmund seems to have a real talent for spotting the problems with guy’s approach and also, their stance, their triggers, etc. Why don’t Moz give him a million or two and consider it a blessing if he could get DeJong back on track, get Knisner swinging with authority, etc.
And, don’t teams have psychologists?? If not, they should.
GS, the only other scenario I can think of with PDJ would be a mutual dump trade.
As I’ve said before, evidently they can’t fix DeJongs multi-year downward trend. So, trade him for a struggling pitcher of similar salary, and try to fix his production.
25, between having Sosa trade possibilities, and your Winn ETA of at least late 23′, it somewhat helps explain why the FO reclaimed Robertson. He does help fill the gap, if they do move PDJ.
25, between having Sosa trade possibilities, and your Winn ETA of at least late 23′, it somewhat helps explain why the FO reclaimed Robertson. He does help fill the gap, if they do move PDJ.
Perhaps. We will have to see how they go about setting the 40 man later this year. I would think that Robertson would be left off, but that’s not a certainty.
1948, repairing a swing is not as simple as it might sound. These guys spend years developing a swing around their natural abilities and in some cases nothing can be done because the abilities start to fade. Bat speeds slow down, eyesight gets worse, maybe an injury makes it difficult for a guy to get his body where he needs to get the bat where it is needed. Carpenter went through an extensive swing rebuild last offseason and that was more an act of desperation than a guy just trying to figure it out. Once his contract was up, he knew his career was hanging by a thread and spent all winter bouncing around with different coaches and instructors. Even after all that work, it didn’t exactly take immediately, because he wasn’t all that good with Texas. What he was doing with the Yankees was great, but you also have to factor in he went to a park built for left handed, flyball hitters.
For DeJong, I have no doubt he is working his butt off to try to fix his offensive woes. The question is what is the problem and how do you fix it? In his case, his issues are long-standing and the same voices are trying to figure this out with him and clearly they are just as baffled as him. It’s possible he just needs a new voice in his ear or eyes on his swing mechanics. It could be something small like a need to switch bats, too. There has been a lot of discussion about Paul Goldschmidt getting fitted for a bat this season similar to what golfers go through and look at how well that has turned out. Now, Goldschmidt is a good hitter, so it’s not like he warped from a regular guy to MVP-level, but the point is small, weird little things can have significant impacts on a hitter. For DeJong, I don’t think it’s the bat. I think he’s got an issue with approach and probably just a lack of talent. He’s always been a bit of an all-or-nothing type of hitter and once the guy’s bat starts to slow down and pitchers get more information on them, those hitters can get really bad. Maybe a change of scenery would do him well, but the likelihood is he’s just never going to really hit at the big league level again.
Numbers since being traded at the trade deadline:
Starters
Frankie Montas: 6GS – 5.87 ERA/30.2 IP/4.54 FIP
Luis Castillo: 7GS – 2.70 ERA/43.1 IP/2.86 FIP
Noah Syndergaard: 6GS – 4.63 ERA/35 IP/3.17 FIP
Jose Quintana: 7GS – 3.15 ERA/34.1 IP/3.08 FIP
Jordan Montgomery: 7GS – 1.45 ERA/43.1 IP/2.28 FIPRelievers
Josh Hader: 10 G – 15.26 ERA/7.2 IP/6.37 FIP
Raisel Iglesias: 16 G – 0.61 ERA/14.2 IP/1.75 (owed 48M in 23-25)
JoJo Romero: 6 G – 1.35 ERA/6.2 IP/1.76 FIP
Chris Stratton: 11G – 3.00 ERA/15 IP/2.78 FIPFor not giving up a top prospect or player (Bader hasn’t played a game since) I’d say Mo did a heck of a job, I’m usually griping about him because of their severe lack of spending, but at this deadline, he gets a pat on the back and two thumbs up.
I agree Chitown. I am usually tough on Mo but he got this trade deadline right.
Since August 1 the team that acquired Montgomery, Quintana, Stratton, and Romero has a record of 27-9 and is on cruise control.
The team that gutted their farm system for Soto and Hader has a record of 19-16 and is scrapping for a wild card spot.
Admittedly, I think the entire trade values thing is rather silly, (but fun). If a team isn’t REALLY close to the arbitrary cap, (luxury tax), it makes no sense. Before the season baseball Trade Values had a trade that “worked out”, Goldschmidt, Arenado and a pre-injury Flaherty PLUS about 5 million in cash for Aroldis Chapman. Seriously would anyone actually make that trade?
It is a good argument starter, lol. A couple trades proposed in the past couple days. Would you do either?
Angels Get
Alec Burleson – 19.4
Jack Flaherty – 3.1
Nolan Gorman – 45.9
Michael McGreevey – 5.1Cardinals Get
Shohei Ohtani – 72.2
===========================
Cardinals Get
Shohei Ohtani – 72.2
Mike Trout – 22.4Angels Get
Alec Burleson – 19.4
Dylan Carlson – 50.1
Dakota Hudson – 7.2
Matthew Liberatore – 13.5
Jake Woodford – 2.3
Juan Yepez – 3===========================
Cards4ever, I think those things are worthless honestly, but of Trout is only valued at 22.4, I’d gladly overpay and give them Burleson and Hudson! Ohtani only has a year left now so I assume those numbers aren’t updated?
Cards4ever, I think those things are worthless honestly, but of Trout is only valued at 22.4, I’d gladly overpay and give them Burleson and Hudson! Ohtani only has a year left now so I assume those numbers aren’t updated?
Burleson and Edman for Trout. Sign me up!
No, Ohtani is insanely valuable and his arb2 salary was only $5.5M, so he stands to make maybe $10M next year? His surplus value for one year and change is very high.
I think Ohtani is the best player on the planet. I would rather have him than Trout. The problem is that the Cardinals would probably only have him for one year. When he hits free agency after 2023 the starting point for his new contract is probably going to be 10 years/$400M and he might get $450M or $500M. I don’t see the Cardinals playing at that poker table.
Ohtani Will probably ask for 12/600. 25 per as a pitcher and 25 per as a hitter — and he might get it. Worth it if healthy.
The only position I’d like to see upgraded this winter is catcher.
If Pujols / Molina retire, and Dickerson signs elsewhere, our bench could be:
C Knizner
UI PDJ
#4 OF Burleson
1B/OF YepezDonovan needs to play everyday and Oli uses him at DH, until there is a need elsewhere.
Carlson and Gorman are very young and I am committed to them starting.
DH Donovan (L)
SS Edman (S)
1B Goldschmidt (R)
3B Arenado (R)
LF O’Neill (R)
RF Nootbaar (L)
2B Gorman (L)
C acquisition (?)
CF Carlson (S)The only position I’d like to see upgraded this winter is catcher.
I tend to agree with that. Our offensive production at catcher has been horrendous this year. If the Cardinals do something at catcher this winter it will probably be a stopgap to share time with Herrera but I would actually go big and go after Contreras. I think there is a way for him and Herrera to exist on the same roster since the DH is available.
Donovan, Yepez, Burleson and now a catcher. DH gets a lot of play on our forum.
I’m expecting a vet, bat first catcher, on a Dickerson like contract, for one season.
DeJong for Grandal
DeJong could possibly play 2B for them or be utility IF. He’s from Chicago area. 2023 is owed $9.16 million, 2024 $12.5 million option with $2 million buy out, 2025 $15 million option with $1 million buy out. Total is $12.16.
Grandal will be 34 on the last year of his contact at $18.25 million. He’s having a bad year at the plate, but only a year removed from an career above average hitter.Catchers
Tucker Barnhart (32)
Curt Casali (34)
Jason Castro (36)
Robinson Chirinos (38)
Willson Contreras (31)
Austin Hedges (30)
Sandy Leon (34)
Omar Narvaez (31)
Roberto Perez (34)
Kevin Plawecki (32)
Austin Romine (34)
Gary Sanchez (30)
Kurt Suzuki (39)
Christian Vazquez (32)
Stephen Vogt (38)
Mike Zunino (32)That’s the free agent options.
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