Home › The Cardinal Nation Forums › Open Forum › Trade Ideas/Acquisition Ideas/Non-Cards Rumors – 2019-2020
- This topic has 2,233 replies, 52 voices, and was last updated 3 years, 3 months ago by thejager.
-
AuthorPosts
-
February 11, 2020 at 9:51 am #12202814NyquisTParticipant
From today’s Cardinals Conclave:
Dexter Fowler is the veteran of the group. He “rebounded” from a horrendous 2018, where he was worth -1.4 WAR, due to .190 batting average and a .298 slugging percentage. He still wasn’t very good though. He netted 1.7 WAR, a far cry from the 4 WAR season he was coming off of when we signed him. (That 4 WAR season was the only one of career over 3 WAR and now is starting to look like a fluke.
That fluke season while he was in his FA year with the Cubs made Mozeliak grossly overpay him. Bowtie is foolishly trying to squeeze something out of Fowler that just isn’t there. I don’t get this at all.
February 11, 2020 at 9:57 am #122029Assuming no signing strategy change (quantity versus fewer higher dollar signings), would the Cards trade some surplus players that will be without options for International cap money for the 2020-21 years. We may have as many as 6 without options a year from now.
February 11, 2020 at 2:23 pm #122087Urias claimed by the O’s
February 12, 2020 at 3:54 pm #122220Cardinals sign Brad Miller – MLBTR
February 13, 2020 at 9:54 am #122307This article is in my wheelhouse of interest. Yep, 2022 is the year there could be some big spending but not before.
https://www.vivaelbirdos.com/2020/2/13/21134036/the-cardinals-should-spend-in-2022
February 13, 2020 at 11:54 am #122325While an interesting thought, I suspect we won’t see the Cards sign any of those big names. I could also see them signing Wong to an extension and maybe spending money on a couple of mid tier guys before then, meaning they’ll only have some change to spend on free agents.
February 13, 2020 at 12:28 pm #122334Twelve players left from the 2017 club, that’s a lot of roster change. What they do between now and then will greatly affect the 2022 budget.
btw, from another thread, Stripling has three seasons club control. I didn’t care for 667’s trade but Striplings control does affect what we have discussed previously on a LAD trade.
February 13, 2020 at 3:38 pm #122347The Cardinals currently only have $50M obligated for 2022. Even if Wong, CMart, and Yadi are still here plus the arbitration guys there should be plenty of cash for some signings. That doesn’t mean we will but it should be available.
February 13, 2020 at 8:04 pm #122368They have plenty of flexability in 2021 if they choose to excercise it.
February 14, 2020 at 9:18 am #122403They have plenty of flexability in 2021 if they choose to excercise it.
If they don’t bring Yadi back they would, otherwise, I don’t see much flexibility.
February 14, 2020 at 9:39 am #122411By 2022, who is likely to be the starting returnees? If we get good contributions from Ivan Herrera, Nolan Gorman and Dylan Carlson, that financial flexibility could be useful. If we miss on one or two of them and don’t find a replacement in the system, I dunno that we’ll have money to spend.
Ideal 2022 returning lineup…
C Herrera/Yadi
1B Goldy
2B Edman
SS Dejong
3B Gorman
LF O’Neill
CF Bader
RF CarlsonFlaherty
Mikolas
Hudson
Cmart
Reyes/Liberatore/Rondon/etcFebruary 14, 2020 at 9:48 am #122414Gscott, They dont have to bring back Molina and they dont have to bring back Wong. In that case they could probably sign Betts and stay under 180 million payroll (they wont though).
February 14, 2020 at 9:52 am #122416If Herrera, Gorman, and Carlson flop we are going to have to have someone play those positions. Yadi may be an option but it would be a reduced rate. Carp might still be here in 2022 but it would also be at a much reduced rate. His option won’t vest or be picked up. As for Fowler there is no way he should be on the roster in 2022.
I don’t see how there couldn’t be plenty of cash available for external signings unless Mo does some more weird internal extensions that none of us are foreseeing.
February 14, 2020 at 9:53 am #122418Gscott, They dont have to bring back Molina and they dont have to bring back Wong. In that case they could probably sign Betts and stay under 180 million payroll (they wont though).
I suppose they don’t have to but I would be shocked if both aren’t on the 2021 roster.
February 14, 2020 at 10:36 am #122425I enjoy looking a year or two ahead but the uncertainty caused by a new CBA after 2021 makes it difficult. Sooner FA? Sooner arb? DH?
February 14, 2020 at 11:25 am #122432I don’t see how there couldn’t be plenty of cash available for external signings unless Mo does some more weird internal extensions that none of us are foreseeing.
Or maybe they go 2015-16 kind of crazy and sign some mid tier veterans to bolster the staff or lineup. I’d hope they learned their lesson there, but you never know…
February 14, 2020 at 1:48 pm #122442Mid tier veterans should never be signed, equal production can usually be found from internal options or gamble with two wild cards for a year.
February 14, 2020 at 2:55 pm #1224532016 thru 2018 we missed the postseason and I thought the FO strayed from their model and understandably took on added risk when acquiring. Just a gut feeling and hopefully we don’t revisit that scenario.
February 20, 2020 at 8:33 am #123034We lose our #2 starter and not one desperation trade proposal to fill that void. That is a testament to our pitching depth!
.February 20, 2020 at 8:53 am #123036Here you go… 96 likes.
With Mikolas set back a bit, that Joc Pederson/Ross Stripling trade combo would seem to make an awful lot of sense in St. Louis.
— Craig Edwards (@craigjedwards) February 18, 2020
February 20, 2020 at 9:16 am #123041That trade would have made sense before the Mikolas injury but I don’t see it happening. The Cardinals have made it clear that they are tapped out financially and don’t want to give up any more prospects.
February 20, 2020 at 9:36 am #123042FWIW, I agree with your second sentence/conclusion, but I don’t see how the payroll/prospect dynamic was affected by Mikolas’ injury. To me, this trade idea makes no more or less sense after than before.
February 20, 2020 at 9:40 am #123043If we won’t trade for an actual need for the club, then why would they trade for a position they need, even it is better equipped to deal with the loss.
Our offense was bad WITH OZuna and JMart and all the same guys….and we take away that, and then pin all our hopes on old guys getting better, and young guys overperforming
What makes this bad is that it pretty much knocks out the possibility of trading for Arenado using Hudson. And while I was less interested in a trade that used Hudson to start I would have been HAPPY to have lost Hudson and had to replace him with who we are replacing Mikolas with now in exchange for what Arenado would bring to the offense
Arenado deal post Mikolas injury news:
Arenado
for
Libertore + ONeill + Knizner + Monteroadd in another solid prospect like Woodford to get them to bring the money down a bit (at least in the first 2yrs)
and somehow convince Arenado to give up the opt outThat would seem to deal with any of the issues about acquiring him, and while we would lose some very good pieces. None of them are irreplaceable.
Libertore = Thompson
Oneill = the field of options
Knizner = Herrera
Montero = Gorman/Nunez/etc.
Woodford = the field of optionsOneill would mash in Colorado, Knizner is a solid offensive catcher for that park, Libertore could be the lefty they need for the future, Woodford could be a solid backend starter, and Montero could be a 1b they need.
It’s a lot of CHEAP good value
February 20, 2020 at 9:57 am #123050FWIW, I agree with your second sentence/conclusion, but I don’t see how the payroll/prospect dynamic was affected by Mikolas’ injury. To me, this trade idea makes no more or less sense after than before.
I wasn’t really linking the Mikolas injury to the payroll/prospect dynamic. I was just pointing out that we could have used Pederson/Stripling before the injury and the reason why I don’t think the trade will happen is also the same pre/post Mikolas injury.
February 20, 2020 at 8:27 pm #123120Oneill would mash in Colorado, Knizner is a solid offensive catcher for that park, Libertore could be the lefty they need for the future, Woodford could be a solid backend starter, and Montero could be a 1b they need.
It’s a lot of CHEAP good value
If Mo offers that package for Arenado, Colorado’s GM would run to take it. That’s probably at least three starting players and some potential in the others for a guy who’s probably a 4 WAR player outside the friendly confines of Coors. How much money do you think the Cards would get from Colorado in that deal? It would have to be $60M-80M to make that a palatable deal for me.
-
AuthorPosts
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.