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I agree that Matz could go at anytime but I think the Cardinals are hedging on Fedde and Helsley. They would like to keep them until the deadline but if Nado scuttles the payroll purge plan then all bets are off. Noot could be out the door too if Nado stays. Burleson can play LF at a cheaper cost, defense be damned.
In all seriousness if in some bizarre scenario that Nado stays I think Fedde, Helsley, and Matz are gone but also I could see one of Noot, Burleson, or Gorman gone. Of those last three guess which one makes the most money?
I think we need to recalibrate how we view this offseason through the lens of the Cardinal brass. It is really all about the dough $$$$$. Shedding payroll is their number one objective. Piecing together a roster of what remains is a secondary concern. I honestly believe that.
Nootbaar is only making $2.8 million.
The Cardinals would save more money, and have a better team, by paying down $12 million of Mikolas contract and putting another Memphis pitcher in the rotation.
Of course, to your point, this front office probably can’t figure that out.
I agree that Matz could go at anytime
Why in the world would anybody want Matz? The Cardinals have had him for three years and he’s given them next to nothing. It’s likely that most of the St.Louis fan base doesn’t even recognize his name. You would really have to be that ‘eternal optimist’ to offer anything of value to acquire Matz even if the Cardinals would eat some of the money still owed him.
It is really all about the dough $$$$$. Shedding payroll is their number one objective. Piecing together a roster of what remains is a secondary concern. I honestly believe that.
I agree there.
But they also have to start building a contender to get the fans back, and our farm system is lacking in impact potential.
They need to get something out of the trades as well.
Why in the world would anybody want Matz?
Cardinals are going to have to pay down his contract, to find a taker as well. Probably going to have to eat half of it.
The A’s can take the other half.
Speaking of which, going to be a strange year when the A’s spend more on payroll than the Cardinals.
Cots has Noot projected to make $3M in arbitration. Burleson would make .800. Simple math for BDW.
No one would want Matz by himself but they would take him if the Cardinals attach another player with him. Remember that the Sacramento A’s must add more payroll to avoid a grievance from the MLBPA.
Mikolas has a NTC and I think he is going to be as stubborn to move as Nado is.
With Matz, they are probably best off just keeping him, hoping he pitches well enough to be traded at the deadline.
That would save them 20-30% of his salary.
With Fedde & Helsley, I still think the best return is if you package them together (since they each only have one year on their contracts). Any team (except the Cardinals) can afford a good starting pitcher and elite closer for $15 million.
In a little shy of 200 innings of work, Matz is 10-12 to go along with an ERA of 4.47 in his 3 year stint with the Cardinals. Certainly nothing to boast about, but those numbers actually seem better than I would have thought after having suffered through watching him work most, if not all, of his 34 turns as a member of a Redbird rotation.
This budget reset can be done by next offseason. Who goes first or last really doesn’t matter. “Shed” is priority one.
Who goes first or last really doesn’t matter.
You should know by now that this front office can’t do two things at once. They were told to get rid of Arenado’s contract, and that is their laser focus until it gets done.
Once Arenado is gone, they’ll start shopping Fedde.
Goldschmidt + Arenado to Yankees
The Yankees reportedly approached St. Louis earlier in the offseason about a possible deal for Arenado but talks waned once the Cardinals showed no interest in taking on Marcus Stroman’s contract.
“San Diego has been approached, but according to a source the Padres are not sure they have the financial flexibility to take on that contract,” Goold added, and might ask the Cardinals to eat money in any Arenado trade.
The Cardinals Cannot Sequence Moves
Derrick Goold of the St. Louis Post-Dispatch wrote this afternoon that the extent of the Yankees’ interest in Arenado depends on how much of the deal the Cardinals would cover. While it’s not known how much the Yankees want St. Louis to eat, their proposal of Stroman would’ve been a financial counterbalance. The righty will make $18MM next season and would trigger a matching player option for 2026 if he throws 140 innings. An Arenado/Stroman swap would’ve gotten the Cardinals off the hook for the former’s salaries in 2026-27, but it would not have represented a significant cut next season.
Arenado has a $32MM salary next year, $5MM of which is Colorado’s responsibility. Another $6MM is deferred, so the immediate savings for St. Louis would only have been $3MM. The Cardinals could have tried to flip Stroman themselves. The righty is coming off a 4.31 ERA over 154 2/3 innings. His salary is above market but not egregiously so, but it doesn’t seem the Cardinals had any interest in that sequence of moves.
It’s difficult for this front office to strategize how to get better prospects while shedding payroll….
I guess a swap of Arenado for Stroman was declined by the club. They didn’t even bring it to NA. Might have been too much work for Bowtie to rid himself of another pitcher for him to fit. Maybe the Yanks wanted us to pay down some contract. Which would’ve been almost an even swap. If indeed they wanted us to pay $5 mil a year.
With Matz, they are probably best off just keeping him
To move Nolan, at a minimum Bill has to eat the $15M add on year, and probably more. Sonny Grey just turned 35 and he’s owed $65 million over the next two years. He did well last year, but his season began and ended on the shelf. Bill owes 36 year old Mikolas $18 million, a guy whose last winning season was 2018. Matz and his $12.5 million doesn’t seem like a top priory for a shedder. Not too different than Fedde’s $7.5 and Helsley’s likely $7.
The elephant in the corner with a lampshade on its head is the $60 Million owed to Contreras. That is a lot for a first baseman, who may or may not be able to play the position every day, and who, at age 32 with three years of contract left will be done by the time the Cardinals might be any good again. They have to field a team, I get it, but that’s a load for not much actual difference. Is there going to be $60 Million more revenue with him than without him?
I see it different, jj. As has been mentioned by others, Mo doesn’t want to go out with a horrible season, so that will temper the demo. 12 months from now, Bloom will be in charge, and the demo will take out whatever was propping up Mo’s hoped for dignified exit.
Its a delusional pipe dream, of course. The dignified exit.
On the optimism side, Mathews could emerge sometime this year, and McGreevy could be solid. A reliever could could emerge from the depths of the system. It’s hard to imagine anything good on the position player side. The progress will be more and better clip boards and lab coats in PD. Supposedly. And the multi million dollar taxpayer funded makeover of Roger Dean Stadium and the Jupiter complex is underway.
bling, why do you think Contreras’ contract is bad? He has been on the team for two years and was their best hitter both years.
Christian Walker, who is a year older, and was slightly worse than Contreras with the bat the last two years, just received $20 MM per year for three years with Houston.
I don’t think you understand market prices.
I’m not in the camp that questions Mo’s loyalty. I have no “evidence” to raise that question.
Even if all 3 NTC’s stay long term, Bill can come in at 100mil, by the start of next offseason. Budget reset.
I get the feeling that some want the Cardinals to become the A’s and dump everyone with a decent salary. That isn’t going to happen. They need a few certainties in the lineup to remain respectable during “the reset”.
bling said:
And the multi million dollar taxpayer funded makeover of Roger Dean Stadium and the Jupiter complex is underway.
That has nothing to do with this thread, but the County’s portion of the Stadium renovation is funded by bonds to be repaid by an increased bed tax. I just paid 13% on a two-month lease. Ouch!
That the owners of the Stadium (the County) should participate in the costs of renovation (along with the two teams) does not seem unreasonable. But of course, it always ends up back in the lap of the public.
Having said all that, the renovation is long overdue. Being better at player development includes having better facilities than ones that are 30 years old.
I get the feeling that some want the Cardinals to become the A’s and dump everyone with a decent salary. That isn’t going to happen.
Actually, it is happening.
The Cardinals current projected payrolls is $138 million, and Mo has been told to shed more payroll. They are trying to unload Arenado’s $27 million, have been in talks about shedding Matz’ $12 million, and everyone believes they will trade Fedde’s $7.5 million and Helsley’s $7-8 million.
The A’s received $70 million in revenue sharing this year, and have to get their payroll up to $105 million. The A’s will have a larger payroll than the Cardinals this year.
And after likely taking losses in three out of the last five years, DeWitt is probably now convinced that the best profit-maximization strategy for his ballclub is to cry poor and accept revenue sharing dollars rather than try to compete.
He already has his hand out for public welfare to support renovations to his private business.
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