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The Cardinals apparently are still intent on acquiring two top of rotation starters. But if they do that, there’s no room at the inn for Matz, Thompson, or Liberatore.
The Cardinal Nation “Hot Stove” is alive and well in the trade ideas thread. Nice read to catch up on. Well done all.
While we’re hammering out our best proposals for the roster, there, I’ll ask this question here:
Who do you think will be the next acquisition? What will BillyMo do next on this crusade to “fix” the roster?
We should have a list of FA pitchers that the Cards aren’t rumored to be looking to acquire. I think that there might be two or three out there.
What I THINK they will do? At the winter meetings sign Sonny Gray to a 4 year $88M deal.
What I WISH they would do? Trade for Dylan Cease and use the rest of the budget for another bat.
Here’s what I feel certain they will do….. Mo and the front office will maintain radio silence until a trade, or free agent signing, is done. Then, a few days before the front office announces the it, the writers will start giving us ‘breaking news’ about a trade, or free agent signing, that could happen. Then, when enough conversation has been generated, the front office will announce the trade, or signing.
As far as ‘which players’ is anybody’s guess. All we know for sure is that, if it’s a free agent signing, it won’t be one that costs mega dollars.
Signing Lynn and Gibson to one year deals has me stumped as to what is the plan to fix the Cardinals. Obviously it is a short term move aimed at fielding a competitive team for 2024 without inhibiting the future by taking on a big contract or moving good prospects. But what is the plan beyond that? We will be in the same boat next winter, or sooner depending on attrition this coming year.
I believe they will go all in for Yamamoto and then trade O’Neill for a solid right handed reliever. If they don’t get Yamamoto, they will pivot to Snell or a Glasnow trade. If they don’t get Snell, then they pivot to Montgomery or Imanaga or maybe Gray. They have to get one of the above or it’s a complete failure. IMO, by signing Lynn/Gibson, if they don’t get Yamamoto, it’s still somewhat of a failure. But if they get Yamamoto and a solid reliever for O’Neill, then I will consider it a very successful offseason.
The other option is to sign 2 more mid range starters and if everyone is healthy, one of Matz or Lynn goes to the pen. But that feels unlikely given the cost of the 2 starters and the Cards not wanting long-term free agent pitcher contracts. Plus, it mostly blocks our starting pitching prospects for a full season. So I think the above plan is where they are heading.
I agree some things can be guessed at based upon what we know. The Cardinals are extremely unlikely to have a $10+ Million pitcher starting the season in the pen. So Matz, Lynn and Gibson will be in the rotation as well as Mikolas. That leaves one slot, and we can only guess who fills it. My feeing is that Mo will not block the pipeline by filling that slot with an acquisition. Rather it will be filled from the laundry list, which probably means Thompson or Liberatore, at least to start things off.
There is the chance that a trade for a top shelf starter will include sending one of those four back the other way. Nothing Mo has said suggests that will happen, but I do not rule it out.
Adding a high level arm doesn’t “fix” the Cardinals, though. Its a band aide.
I’m guessing that they signed Lynn and Gibson for reliable depth. There’s little reason to think that Matz is going to last in the rotation, and if Liberatore or Thompson goes to the pen, then they only have one of them left for the rotation when attrition happens.
Lynn has an option year with a $2M buyout. Then, there’s Hence, Roby, Kjerpe, Graceffo, etc for 2025.
Signing Lynn and Gibson to one year deals has me stumped as to what is the plan to fix the Cardinals. Obviously it is a short term move aimed at fielding a competitive team for 2024 without inhibiting the future by taking on a big contract or moving good prospects.
Those two guys were signed because they were ready to sign RIGHT NOW.
Mo did not want to get caught at the bargaining table like he did last year with the A’s, where the other side holds all the negotiating power.
The Cardinals are extremely unlikely to have a $10+ Million pitcher starting the season in the pen. So Matz, Lynn and Gibson will be in the rotation as well as Mikolas.
If Mo were playing chess instead of checkers, he’d sign two more FA’s better than Mikolas, then work to trade Matz & Mikolas so he can sign Montgomery (who you know won’t sign until late Jan, early Feb because he is a Boras client).
If anyone seriously thinks the Cardinals are players for Yamamoto or anyone that will command a similar financial outlay is fooling themselves and will be very disappointed with the outcome. The Cardinals are closer to done with their offseason than they are to starting it. They may add one more midtier starter and a bullpen arm or two that cost less than 7.5M. They also may add a backup catcher for depth. That’s what they always do, and that’s what their playbook allows them to do.
Mo mentioned a swing man, so I think we can expect that. A 4A catcher for Memphis seems likely. Pen help, but I don’t have a feel for what that will be. Hopefully not the next Andrew Miller.
There are 8 outfielders on the 40 man right now, but the better outfield arrangements involve using Donovan or Edman out there. So we could stand some turnover in that area.
I pretty much agree TXCard. I expect they will buy one more SP they can prop up as top of the rotation quality, but with a 15mil-ish AAV. Couple righty relievers and see what trades can bring.
Pretty underwhelming moves so far. Lynn move is okay, but Gibson doesn’t move any needle much. Unless we get a number 1 starter we are fighting to be .500.
Rat – I looked him up. He was a big time Japanese wrestler. Even if he was still alive, I know I couldn’t take him alone. You’d have to soften him up for before I could put him away.
So what Tojo, Jerry Lawler, Bill Dundee and others did was called wrasslin’. I grew up in Memphis and every Saturday morning there was a televised show plus the big events like the Southern Heavyweight Championships would be on Monday nights at the old Mid South Coliseum. Dave Brown (local weatherman) and Lance ?? were the announcers, lol.
Big, big stuff during the 70’s
My sense is the Cardinals will make as good of or better offer to Yamamoto than any other club, but the allure of a bigger city will be too much to overcome. We dodged a bullet when Stanton went to New York. Hard to believe that could happen here, but we will see how it plays out.
“Wrestling at the Chase” which was recorded from the Chase Park Plaza Hotel, ran from 1959 to 1983 on local TV channel KPLR 11 in St. Louis. The “play-by-play” ring action was initially announced by none other than Joe Garagiola. The Chase Park Plaza Hotel was also once the primary accomodation source for visiting Big League ballclubs when they were in town to play the Redbirds. I still have a baseball that includes a Mickey Lolich signature which I snagged as a young kid out in front of the Chase when the Tigers were staying there during the ’68 WS. Kaline’s signature also adorns that same baseball.
Hey, that’s really cool 1TD. In the early ‘70s a buddy and I stood outside the clubhouse exit at the old stadium and could have gotten a lot of autographs as players from the Cardinals and opponents would leave. As it was I only got Joe Torre.
Even Jack Buck came out that way one time.
As for Loclich and Kaline, I have their signatures as well. But mine are from a buddy who grew up in Michigan and went to Tiger fantasy camps for several years in the early 2000s. They would bring me back stuff like that. I also have Denny McLain, but met him at collector’s shows. In fact I have an SI that has Gibson and McLain on it, with both of their signatures that I got in person at shows.
But enough of that – back to the topic at hand. It seems the Cardinals are truly working on landing a bigger name pitcher still – they may not get Yamamoto, but I think they will be in on either Snell or Cease. Getting Cease might hurt, as we would likely be sending Edman, Carlson and maybe even Liberatore over for him. That is a potential deal that could really back fire, as Libby still have a lot of potential and by 2025 could be better than Cease, and we gave up the other guys as well.
That’s outstanding to have both Gibson and McLain’s signature together on anything, much less an SI, Bikemike. Those two were pretty good in ’68…Haha! As I recall, my boyhood friend and I were really on the lookout for McLain out in front of the Chase hotel, but he never materialized and I had to settle for Lolich. Little did I know at the time that he would be the arch villian that would slay my favorite team…Haha!
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