Trade Ideas/Acquisition Ideas/Non-Cards Rumors – 2019-2020

Home The Cardinal Nation Forums Open Forum Trade Ideas/Acquisition Ideas/Non-Cards Rumors – 2019-2020

Viewing 25 posts - 2,101 through 2,125 (of 2,131 total)
  • Author
    Posts
  • #147831
    Avatargscottar
    Participant

    Paid - Annual

    This just a bunch of nonsense being talked about by a radio personality having a slow day.

    You just summed up 95% of the offseason.

    #147836
    Brian WaltonBrian Walton
    Keymaster

    Paid - Annual

    95% might be conservative, but there are segments of the population who eat up anything posted, whether it makes sense or not. It is sort of like all the rest of what is going on around us. 😉

    Since this came out, I’ve seen a number of fan tweets drooling over the idea of Adell in the Cardinals OF. As I understand it, the radio proposal was this: The Cardinals would take on Upton and his $51 MM in dead money plus give up their best two pitching prospects in Liberatore and Thompson just to get Adell.

    #147846
    jj-cf-stljj-cf-stl
    Participant

    Paid - Annual

    I’m not convinced Adell / Upton is a wash, because Adell has shown that BB/K for his professional career. LAA would need to add slightly to Adell, one of SS Jackson or Paris, to dump Upton, and receive no players in return.

    #147850
    Brian WaltonBrian Walton
    Keymaster

    Paid - Annual

    Hunter Renfroe, anyone?

    P.S. I wonder if anybody is going to criticize the Rays front office for what they got in return for Pham? 😉

    #147851
    Avatarmudville
    Participant

    Paid - Annual

    Sorry I didn’t do this to begin with. Hear is the link for the Zack Tho0mpson interview:

    The Fast Lane

    The Thompson interview comes on at 4:15 which is 2 hours/15 minutes into the show.

    #147852
    Brian WaltonBrian Walton
    Keymaster

    Paid - Annual

    Here is a stats-based view of Renfroe. Sadly, a career 106 OPS+ would be clustered at the top of the Cards outfielders.

    #147855
    jj-cf-stljj-cf-stl
    Participant

    Paid - Annual

    Renfro is a lefty masher, career .912 ops in 495 PA’s.

    #147882
    AvatarILcardfan
    Participant

    Free

    I think the cards should do whatever they can to load up for 2022 and beyond when the next wave of young talent is expected to arrive. That probably means sticking to what we have for 2021 and in effect punting on this upcoming season. Should then be sellers at the deadline, Mikolas and Miller would be candidates to be moved if pitching decent. Fowler and Carpenter could both be candidates as well if they are hitting at all, with both having expiring contracts they might be attractive rentals.

    #147884
    Avatar14NyquisT
    Participant

    Paid - Annual

    ILcardfan….. some good looking ahead points made.

    #147889
    Avatargscottar
    Participant

    Paid - Annual

    Ilcardfan, I agree with your sentiments. That is exactly what the Cards should do but I highly doubt they will. They will try to cobble together their usual B minus team with eyes on squeaking into the playoffs on the last day and going on a run. That has been their business model for several years now so it probably won’t change.

    I would like to regroup, put together a C minus team for one year, then be in position for a run of many A level teams.

    #147890
    Avatargscottar
    Participant

    Paid - Annual

    Back to the Angels idea for a minute, I understand the attraction of Adell. Most services had him ranked as a Top 5 overall prospect going into 2020, although his milb numbers were good but not great. He has a high ceiling though.

    The problem is that deal would have to be restructured differently to make sense for the Cardinals. Justin Upton is owed a whopping $52.7M over the next two years!! Yikes! As Brian pointed out Upton isn’t much better than Fowler.

    For Upton and Adell I would offer the Angels Fowler, CMart, O’Neill, Gomber, and Rondon. Now the Angels probably wouldn’t accept that offer but maybe there is a compromise somewhere.

    The first part of the trade would be Upton for Fowler and CMart. The Cardinals would be taking on $52.7M and the Angels would be taking on $28.2M so advantage Angels. Fowler is good buddies with Joe Maddon and CMart would slide into their beleaguered rotation.

    The second part of the deal would be Adell for O’Neill, Gomber, and Rondon. Adell has a much higher ceiling than those three but the Angels would be receiving three decent players with moderately high ceilings and Gomber would be another immediate rotation piece. They would probably want someone better but I am not giving up Liberatore. I might give up Thompson but the Angels are in win now mode so they need players who can contribute now. Mike Trout and Joe Maddon aren’t getting any younger.

    #147891
    Avatargscottar
    Participant

    Paid - Annual

    At first glance Hunter Renfroe looks like a similar player as Tyler O’Neill. Am I wrong?

    #147900
    Avatar1964cards
    Participant

    Paid - Annual

    gscottar, I am not too excited about either Upton or Renfroe. It doesn’t look like Upton has much left in the tank headed into his age 33 season. I am not sure Renfroe is an upgrade over what we already have.

    #147907
    Avatargscottar
    Participant

    Paid - Annual

    1964, I don’t think anyone, including the Cardinals, are excited about Upton. That idea was hatched as a way to essentially buy a prospect.

    And I agree that Renfroe wouldn’t be much of an upgrade over what we have.

    #147916
    jj-cf-stljj-cf-stl
    Participant

    Paid - Annual

    We hope O’Neill can develop into Hunter Renfro type of production. Tyler has started 100 games, Hunter 368. It’s a tough comparable with differing stages of their careers. Tyler is a poor mans Renfro, at this time offensively.

    • This reply was modified 5 days, 21 hours ago by jj-cf-stljj-cf-stl.
    #148003
    thejagerthejager
    Participant

    Paid - Annual

    I read that little article on LaStella as an option, and the more I think about it i think i like it (only because i am pessimistic on the FO making enough major moves)

    Still, I wonder what LaStella will end up demanding.

    I think the FO has to much of an ego to cut bait on their young OFers and are so gun-shy right now to repeat the Arozarena, Mercado, Voit deals they want to feel they have had a “proper” look at some of the guys…at least with ONeill and Thomas…and with Fowler having to play i am not confident they will adjust the OF that much if at all…but the offseason is young i guess

    How about:
    sign LaStella
    sign Ha-Seong Kim
    re-sign Yadi and Waino

    then: (based on that one guessing article that said CMart for Sanchez was possible and DH for NL, also i saw a guessing offer of Gray, Mcmahon and an pitcher for Sanchez and Frazier somewhere)
    trade CMart + Ponce + Knizner for Clint Frazier and Gary Sanchez
    trade Edman + Bader for Brad Keller (freeing KC up to trade Whit more easily…could offer Oviedo in this too as i think Keller is worth more and still has good control)

    Roll:
    Jack, Keller, Waino, Mik, Kim….Gomber, Woodford, Libertore, Reyes etc.
    Hicks, Gallegos, Miller, Reyes, Gant, Genesis, Helsley, Webb
    LaStella (2b), Carlson, DeJong, Goldy, Sanchez (DH), Kim (3b), Yadi, Fowler, Frazier
    Oneill, Carp, Thomas, Sosa, Ravelo

    rotate Fowler and Frazier based on matchups..Frazier + Oneill for Lefties and Fowler + Thomas for righties (not slam dunk numbers though so plenty of rotation probable)

    Sanchez as backup catcher isnt the worst and his bat as a DH still play. Sanchez, LaStella, Kim and Frazier up the offense without sacrificing defense much if at all.

    just thinking out loud

    #148049
    Avatar1964cards
    Participant

    Paid - Annual

    I wonder if the Cards would have interest in Cesar Hernandez. He appears to be a better hitter than Wong and can hold his own on defense. Just not sure of the price tag.

    Signing Hernandez would solidify 2B for two or three years. You could move Edmund to third and Carp to the bench. I think this move improves both the infield offense and defense.

    #148086
    jj-cf-stljj-cf-stl
    Participant

    Paid - Annual

    BR has Kolten Wong as Hernandez #1 comparable. MLBTR expects Cesar to sign a 1/6mil contract and Wong a 2/16mil. Cesar as a career leadoff man does have the OBP to replace Wong in the batting order and he does hit LHP’s better than Kolten.

    #148118
    Brian WaltonBrian Walton
    Keymaster

    Paid - Annual

    Now the Braves have two new starters. Waino can forget it.

    #148126
    stlcard25stlcard25
    Participant

    Paid - Annual

    These recent contracts suggest to me that either:

    1) Some teams are well under even their COVID budget and willing to spend to make their team better.

    2) Most teams now have a better grasp on what revenues will look like next year and have baked that into free agent offerings.

    This is now three pitchers (Ray, Smyly and Morton) who have gotten more than I expected them to get. Perhaps it’s the one year phenomenon and none of them have gotten what I think they would have last year, but it suggests that a win on the free agent market will be closer to the $9M we have grown to expect than the $4M that it seemed it may fall to at the onset of the market.

    This means, to me, that there may be a few crazy bargains for teams willing to wait til late in the process, but nothing like some of us may have hoped for will materialize for the Cards. Pederson will likely get $10-12M on a one year deal, and even a fallback like Rosario will probably get $8M or so. It also bodes well for Wong possibly getting a multi year deal in the $20M range, or perhaps above his previous offer with St Louis for one year.

    To me, that means that St Louis, if they are serious when they cry poor, is unlikely to add anything beyond a Jedd Gyorko type. To some, that may sound positive, but what I mean is a guy that is very slightly above the “spring training invite” group and is probably going to offer you a marginal platoon advantage, and nothing more.

    #148128
    jj-cf-stljj-cf-stl
    Participant

    Paid - Annual

    I like how ATL tries for one year FA contracts, especially the expensive ones like Donaldson, Ozuna and Morton.

    #148130
    jj-cf-stljj-cf-stl
    Participant

    Paid - Annual

    A one year obviously never becomes a multi-year burden contract. The budget always has built in flexibility to adapt to next winters roster, even if the funds need to go in-house to arb player raises. Young players that are deemed ready never get blocked which allows the funds to float from 3B, to LF, to a SP’r. A very flexible approach to meeting changing roster needs.

    #148132
    thejagerthejager
    Participant

    Paid - Annual

    I like the idea of Cesar Hernandez nice find i think i coudl be fine with that kind of move…though LaStella feels more stable im just not sure how much he will demand

    I also saw that the Rays would listen on Blake Snell, still pretty cheap and definitely good

    I wonder if we could swoop in and grab him building off the Arozarena trade dealings, and with the success of Arozarena perhaps some of the other players they were eyeballing might garner more value.

    We need offense, but Blake Snell frees us up significantly on dealing from our depth of pitching to acquire true impact level bats

    I am still high on Ha-Seong Kim and I think his money may be lower in the market and the general unknown of hitting coming across the ocean, but i’d prefer an Arenado or Lindor

    re-sign Waino(1yr) and Yadi(2yrs)
    sign Kim
    trade for Snell (Edman + Oviedo + ONeill + Gomber)
    trade for Merrifield (Thompson + Bader + Ravelo)
    trade for CFrazier (CMart + JWilliams/Thorres for Frazier)

    Jack, Snell, Mik, Waino, Kim/etc….Libertore/Reyes/Ponce/Woodford
    Hicks, Reyes, Miller, Gallegos, Helsley, Genesis, Webb, Gant
    Merrifield(2), Carlson(LF), DeJong(ss), Goldy(1), Kim(3), Yadi(c), Fowler(RF), Frazier(CF)
    Knizner, Sosa, Carp, Thomas, FA-UTIL (Merrifield can play all OF so can be anything)

    #148133
    Brian WaltonBrian Walton
    Keymaster

    Paid - Annual

    #148135
    thejagerthejager
    Participant

    Paid - Annual

    Tomorrow eh? fun

    I would have thought they felt good about their infield depth with all that youth and upside.

    I hope we were also scouting him too, our inroads with our own Kim perhaps helping some

Viewing 25 posts - 2,101 through 2,125 (of 2,131 total)
  • You must be logged in to reply to this topic.

First-hand news and commentary on the St. Louis Cardinals™ and minor league system for over 20 years