The Front Office's place in all of this chaos.

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This topic contains 195 replies, has 26 voices, and was last updated by Avatar 14NyquisT 1 week ago.

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  • #77938
    Brian Walton
    Brian Walton
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    C2016, unless we are sitting in the rooms with these people, we have no idea about their relationships or strategies. We only pick up snippets about things that are happening in overseas countries. You are clearly confusing results (which we see) with strategy (which we do not).

    As far as the overspend plans coming up “late in the cycle”, the results we do know show that assertion is plain wrong. The very first day of that signing period, they announced 13 players with bonuses over $5 million. Less than two weeks later, they added Machado for another $2.35 MM. And one can reasonably expect that they had been working them for a long time. But not every player is cleared and ready to sign on July 2, a prime example being Adolis Garcia.

    And again, expecting one team to get every player in a market where there are many other competitors is totally unrealistic.

    P.S. So far, Lazarito has been nothing special.

    #77966
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    Cardinals2016
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    We only pick up snippets about things that are happening in overseas countries. You are clearly confusing results (which we see) with strategy (which we do not).

    Brian – how many of the Cardinals top signings were in the Top 40? 2-3? Where were they in the Top 40? The back half, correct? If you’ve been planning for years to “spend big”, don’t you think you’d go after some of the very top players in that cycle?

    And don’t say they were actively pursuing Kevin Maitan. Maitan’s exact signing bonus was leaked a full year in advance of his actual signing, which is why many Braves fans think the Cardinals turned them in to MLB.

    As far as the overspend plans coming up “late in the cycle”, the results we do know show that assertion is plain wrong. The very first day of that signing period, they announced 13 players with bonuses over $5 million. Less than two weeks later, they added Machado for another $2.35 MM. And one can reasonably expect that they had been working them for a long time. But not every player is cleared and ready to sign on July 2, a prime example being Adolis Garcia.

    Players have to wait until they are 16 before they can sign!!! The only players that aren’t known well in advance are Cuban defectors! And even with them, there is evidence MLB teams (the Dodgers at a minimum) were complicit in their defections!

    You totally misinterpreted what I was saying. Read above. If you are planning to “spend big”, go after the very cream of the crop. The Braves and the Padres basically monopolized the Top 40, each signing a minimum of 8 of the top 40, and almost all their signings were in the Top 20. The Cardinals highest signing was #15, if I recall correctly.

    Who was our top signing that period, Machado? Armenteros’ slash line compares favorably.

    #77983
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    gscottar
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    From my recollection the Cardinals did establish a relationship with Robert. Was it is as strong as the White Sox? I don’t know but I know the Cardinals were not strangers to him. It probably did come down to money. I know the tax issue was a legitimate issue but at the end of the day the White Sox were willing to go past the puke point. Time will tell if that was the right call or not but I do know that Robert was more highly regarded than Adolis-Garcia as far as Cuban prospects go.

    #77988
    Brian Walton
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    Garcia is 5 1/2 years older than Robert, so there is no doubt about that comparison. Then again, because Garcia was outside the cap due to his age, Robert cost over 20 times more to sign.

    #78011
    Brian Walton
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    #78012
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    CariocaCardinal
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    So does the release fee amount count against the team cap?

    Also ought to make for some interesting visa situations since the US embassy in Havana is currently only issuing emergency visas.

    #78633
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    14NyquisT
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    We could have had Donaldson last winter… the FO offered Flaherty in the deal. This kind of maneuvering is classic Card’s mo.

    If that had happened… ??? It would have meant another player for Mozeliak to protect and visit at home.

    No doubt that Flaherty will be the ace of the staff in ’19. That deal would have put a big hole in the rotation.

    #86917
    Brian Walton
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    Bumping up this thread to discuss the status of the front office…

    #86920
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    gscottar
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    We have debated endlessly all of the moves we like and dislike but ultimately it comes down to winning, at least I hope it does. The longer this team stays out of the postseason the more the heat will be turned up on the FO. Only Bill Dewitt knows what the breaking point will be.

    #86924
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    gscottar
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    Not sure where to post this but the Cardinals are the 7th richest team in MLB by valuation.

    https://www.forbes.com/sites/mikeozanian/2019/04/10/baseball-team-values-2019-yankees-lead-league-at-46-billion/#736c8bdb69b2

    #86947
    Brian Walton
    Brian Walton
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    Looks like about a 3:1 ratio of happy fans to unhappy fans, according to this survey.

    #86991
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    CariocaCardinal
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    Lemmings anyone?

    #87055
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    14NyquisT
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    The VEB poll has a limited number of participants and I would guess that would skew the numbers. One actually has to apply to be a participant and then approved by VEB which takes a few days. The participation total numbers are not given so confidence levels should be questioned. This posting info should not be given much credibility simply because poll participant numbers should first be ascertained.

    Some people gloss over facts when they have a cause to push.

    #87056
    Brian Walton
    Brian Walton
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    C’mon, Ny. You are really stretching here. I did not make up “facts” to support a point of view. I simply shared public information, with three data points, while leaving it up to the reader to assess. You always have the option to post any information of studies to the contrary.

    Honestly, I was a bit surprised by the VEB survey results as I would have expected their core readers to trend more toward the negative than the average fan. Historically, in surveys without scientific sampling, the people who are unhappy are often the ones more inclined to take the time to vote.

    Then again, the team is not playing badly despite the pockets of fan frustration. Perhaps more people are focusing on the bigger picture in the early going of what will be a long season.

    P.S. As of today, obviously still early, the 2019 Cardinals are on pace to win 100 games.

    #87057
    stlcard25
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    As is usual, the vocal minority tend to make it seem more skewed than it really is. I’m sure the dissatisfied folks write a large share of the comments on VEB.

    If the team is winning, all else is forgiven. I’d expect fans to be satisfied as long as the Cards are in the hunt.

    #87068
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    forsch31
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    Ny, are you saying that VEB has a greater percentage of followers that are satisfied than the general population? Why should the fact it takes a while to be approved as a participant be a reason to discount a poll?

    #87070
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    CariocaCardinal
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    Not even VEB which prides itself on using data has the integrity to call this what it is. “The majority of VEB members that responded to this poll are satisfied with the direction of the team AT THIS MOMENT.”

    Nothing more. Nothing less.

    #87079
    Brian Walton
    Brian Walton
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    I am missing the perceived significance of “at this moment”. Isn’t that how/when anyone responds to any survey – how you feel at the time you answer the question?

    It appears that this particular survey has been taken three times already, so there have been three “at this moments” to date. It looks like the surveys are being held on a weekly basis, and if that continues, we can see if the results follow the fortunes of the team on the field. The last week has clearly been the team’s best of the short season to date. If there is a correlation (unless the team tanks in Mexico), one might expect the approval rating to improve.

    Personally, if I was responding, I would take a longer term view than the games of the last week. But everyone has their own interpretation of the “direction of the team”, I imagine.

    #87930
    Brian Walton
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    This week’s poll has fan approval of the Cardinals direction up to 93%.

    Apparently, comparable polls are being held across all of Vox team sites. Here is a comment from the VEB article:

    “…just 53 percent of Cubs fans are confident in their team and only 64 percent of Red Sox fans are feeling it…”

    In other words, winning cures the ills.

    They also have a Shildt approval rating that appears to be essentially unchanged from the earlier polls.

    #90748
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    gscottar
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    If you ever get frustrated by our front office take solace in the fact that we aren’t the Nationals. They are a train wreck from the top down.

    #90758
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    14NyquisT
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    Connie Mack couldn’t help this underachieving team. I hope that they don’t sink to the level of the old Senators, even Washington doesn’t deserve that. 🙂

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