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I did not say that did I? I said he has reached his ceiling you said yourself. His career .725 OPS is below average so he is who he is. Great glove and below average hitter. I said Edman is a good player and Iam just not obsessed with him. I can have him on the team or I could trade him.
Please name the three you have ahead of him
My comment was tongue in cheek, knowing that he’s pretty much tailor made for the utility award.
Edman plays a really nice SS, and he swung the bat better in 2022. The other guys at 2B are Donovan and Gorman, neither of whom are great defenders. If the bats are hot, they make up for that. But it’s possible that Winn at SS and Edman at 2B is the long term solution up the middle.
Eddie may or may not be awarded a GG this off-season, but I’ll say this…I watched all or parts of every single Cardinal game this season, and I saw the perennial GG Cardinal 3B’man make more bad plays in the field than I did Tommy Edman. Eddie rarely has a lapse of judgement and almost always makes the play and completes it for the out.
I’ve never seen Winn play, but if he pans out and the Redbirds decide he should man up at the SS position, I’m all for it as long as his middle IF’er counterpart is Tommy Edman at 2B.
The possibility that Edman might win a gold glove at SS or the Cards might keep him at SS and Winn emerges at another position should not offend reasonable observers.
Just like the possibility that the Cardinals would move Edman from SS should not offend reasonable observers. However, there are a few who have the appearance as offended anytime the idea that Edman would be moved comes up. (Euro, this is not directed at you. I’m just quoting a good statement.)
Edman and his speed could make a great centerfielder.
(Wow, I need to read these posts more thoroughly and quicker. I just noticed 25s post where he said this first.)
What makes this interesting is the criteria for the utility gold glove haven’t been published. At least not that I have seen and I looked a week or so ago. The question I have is could someone now theoretically win two gold gloves in the same year, say 2B and Utility. Prior to this year, you could only win at the position for which you played the most innings. That would be shortstop for Edman. However, if he “qualifies” for the utility gold glove based on whatever criteria, then would that make him not eligible for gold glove at SS? If not, then it would be possible for a guy to win two gold gloves.
Based on my reading of the criteria HERE, it appears as though a player would need to accumulate 698 innings at a position in the first 138 games to be eligible for GG consideration. Given that Edman didn’t get 698 innings at either 2B or SS for the entire season, I would guess he would be ineligible for either individual position.
It would also seem reasonable that the utility player eligibility would require some number less than 698 innings and more than another chosen number (say, adding up to 698 with 100 or more at each position) at multiple positions not in the outfield.
That’s why I think that Edman is well suited for the award and very likely will win it.
I’ve tried to compare hypothetically both Edman and Winn playing CF, and I come out with Winn. He has the speed, range, judgement, and arm.
I’ll also say that the fact that Tommy Edman can play both middle IF positions almost flawlessly coupled with the fact that this discussion is momentarily raising the possiblility of him being the Cardinal CF’er is a testament in and of itself to what a valuable baseball player he is. I’m not certain that anyone ever raised the possiblility of Smith playing CF or Mays playing SS…Haha!
My comment was tongue in cheek
Sure, if you say so, but I didn’t see the emoji. So while that was evident to you, it wasn’t to others. Seems more like it gets under your skin to say Edman is the asset he has become because you have projected differently for him for a long time. What is clear is you and a couple others like to yank one guy’s chain over Edman. It’s okay if somebody is a huge Edman fan, he’s one of ours. Why is that an issue? And the fact this has gone on for a couple years, Edman’s continued success at everything the Cards have asked him to do makes it a challenge I’m sure.
he’s pretty much tailor made for the utility award.
See my comments on the criteria for the utility gold glove. I’d really like to see them. If you know, please point me to them. I don’t think they’re on the Rawlings site.
Edit to add: I posted this before I saw your last response addressing the subject.
I would guess he would be ineligible for either individual position.
No. You’re eligible for the position where you played the MOST innings. SS for Edman.
I’m not certain how much credibility it had, but I read an article not too long ago that claimed Edman indeed had enough innings in ’22 at the SS position to qualify for a GG award at SS.
(Wow, I need to read these posts more thoroughly and quicker. I just noticed 25s post where he said this first.)
LOL, forsch. Correct. I was just playing with/poking at 25 on that. For the record, I don’t think there’s any moral high ground for either opinion here.
I’m not certain how much credibility it had, but I read an article not too long ago that claimed Edman indeed had enough innings in ’22 at the SS position to qualify for a GG award at SS.
The rule is you’re eligible for just one position. That’s the one where you played the most innings, as long as it meets the minimum number. You must have 698 total innings by the 138th game. Of course Edman had that many. So SS it is for Edman. How the new utility gold glove plays into this, I’m not sure. Haven’t been able to find those criteria.
EuroDandy…The article I read focused on the minimum number of innings to qualify. Edman had plenty more than was needed at SS.
I was a little disappointed when the Yankees/Indians game was a washout last night. Now I’m happy it was…Haha!
Yep, 1td. I edited my post to add what the actual minimum is. It’s 698 total innings by the 138th game.
Now another question pops into my mind. The Rawlings site says you qualify for the position in which you played the most innings. I’m wondering if the “most innings” is based on the numbers at the 138th game, or at the end of the season. This shouldn’t be that hard.
Most likely this Edman/Winn debate can be tabled for another year since Winn hasn’t even played at AAA yet but it seems to me that the Cardinals have a good problem on their hands trying to find spots for Edman, Donovan, Gorman, and Winn on the same roster. Perhaps one or two of those guys could be traded for a high end player from elsewhere. Time will tell.
Speaking of CF, I was rather impressed with DeLuzio. He may never be an everyday player but his speed and defense are very valuable in a stadium like Busch. I think he could be a very fine 4th OF if he can hit a little bit.
EuroDandy…Yeah, who knows? I know that votes go to coaches and managers so that should help Eddie’s cause. There’s not a manager or coach in the entire Big Leagues that wouldn’t love to have Edman on his roster.
If you had to have a throw from CF to the plate to save a game, would you rather have Winn or Edman throwing it?
gscottar…DeLuzio impresses me as an oversize Shane Robinson type.
Maybe so. I am hoping he is a little more than Robinson or Peter Bourjos but that may be wishful thinking.
bc, if you had to have a SS dive to make a stop in the hole and make a throw to win a game, would you rather have Winn or Edman throwing it?
I am pretty sure the SS makes more throws that can affect a game.
The rule is you’re eligible for just one position. That’s the one where you played the most innings, as long as it meets the minimum number. You must have 698 total innings by the 138th game. Of course Edman had that many. So SS it is for Edman. How the new utility gold glove plays into this, I’m not sure. Haven’t been able to find those criteria.
Per both Fangraphs and BRef, Edman had 614-2/3 innings at 2B and 622 innings at SS for the entire year. Am I missing something, because the criterion is 698 innings at one position. This is from the article I posted:
Player Qualifications
To qualify for consideration for a particular position, a player must have played a minimum number of games or innings (based on position) at that position through games played on September 11th, 2022:All infielders and outfielders must have played in the field for at least 698 total innings through his team’s 138th game: this equates to playing in the field for approximately 7.5 innings per game in approximately 67% of his team’s games by his team’s 138th game; this ensures that only full-time players are considered;
All infielders and outfielders with at least 698 total innings played qualify at the specific position where he played the most innings (i.e. where his manager utilized him the most)
So it doesn’t look like Edman would be qualified at either position, unless I’m misreading. Or are they saying 698 innings and you’re in at the most played position? It doesn’t look clear to me.
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