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bccran don’t like what is being said……………Oh oh. How to deal with this?
Brian –
I agree that injuries haven’t played in as much this year. I think they have played in a lot more in prior years. Haven’t they? What about 2016?
Also, since the Cards are very much of a build from within organization, how many rookies has MM had over the years compared to teams like the Nationals, Dodgers, Yankees, Red Sox, etc. Seems to me that other contending teams have had a lot more free agents signed or gotten more experienced players through trade.
bocran I don’t have a dog in this fight but fair is fair.
When I see people called stupid that turned this franchise around after the mess the brewery made of the team it is clear that they have all of the answers and everyone else is stupid. Maybe even the organ player is stupid if we still have one.
When they show up on game threads criticizing moves before they play out on the field they will have some credibility. Anyone can find something to pick at after the fact.
I think the biggest argument against Matheny is the lack of ability of this team to step up in key games. Is that on the players? The manager? Mo? Probably some combination but I’d put the preponderance of that on the manager and his leadership.
The ups and downs bother me too. Our best starters letting the game get out of hand before the game is out of the second inning and our hitters hitting double figure run production one game and looking like they are swinging with a wet newspaper the next game.
Sorry, but this lineup simply doesn’t compare to the Nationals, Red Sox, Yankees, Dodgers, Diamondbacks, Astros, etc. You can only play with the hand that’s dealt.
So, let’s go with that the lineup is the hand that was dealt and it is not in the top tier.
Yet you assert “the front office has been fine.” Who else could be responsible for assembling this team?
I think the front office has been overall fine over the years as far as supplying the majority of players based upon their business model. System developed players with potential. Carpenter, Wong, Piscotty, Diaz, Adams, Pham, Grichuk, Rosenthal, Siegrist, Wacha, Jaime Garcia, Lynn, Reyes, Weaver, Bader, DeJong, etc. But I have been disappointed by some of their recent moves…Heyward, Fowler, Leake, Cecil, etc. Some of the cards in the hand that MM was dealt this year have underperformed miserably….Leake, Oh, Siegrist, Broxton, Piscotty, Diaz,
etc.Like you, Brian, I felt they needed a big bat if Adams, Grichuk, or Piscotty didn’t fill that bill.
That time has now arrived.
We’ll see what happens over the winter. IMHO the biggest hole is at 3B. I’d trade some of our pitching and OF depth to fill that hole and let Gyorko go back to being a super sub.What do I miss? A trade or FA signing for a Holliday, Berkman, Beltran type players. Not a Fowler/Heyward type complimentary piece.
You draw a delineation between the long legacy of success under current ownership and the recent performance. I think that is very important. That track record buys them more time, but eventually current results override the past. The Cubs are clearly ahead now. The Cardinals are in a pack in the middle. They need to respond in a more successful manner than they have in recent times.
Mo and Bill have rolled the dice in the last year on Grichuk and Piscotty becoming solid, middle of the order bats (3-6). It hasn’t panned out. DeJong came through, but the jury is still out. Now they have Bader, O’Neill, and possibly Adolis Garcia as hopefuls. Will they make a big move? We’ll see..
i think we are still feeling and reeling from the after effects of losing Taveras… not only was he major part of the future of the organization, but they had set up the organization to accommodate his presence, when he passed we started grasping at fixes and they just havent panned out…
Grichuk seems to be what he is… I give Piscotty another year after what happened to him on and off the field…last year we were willing to throw away Wong after his bad year but he came in this year and really turned it around… guys are allowed to have a poor year without them being worthless and not part of the plan…
I want a middle order bat more because i want some stability instead of hopes and dreams of guys panning out in our favor…we just have too many guys who are at the point in their career whether due to injury, age or youth that are hard to depend on without hesitance…
it used to be we MOSTLY had those guys and then got surprised by up and comers…when we shifted from FA fixes for the offense and went young first we took some big risks like Taveras filling our needs long term. Unfortunately the unfortunate happened and we are still trying to figure out a solution
MM has had to deal with trying to fix those needs by using what he has…sometimes that was going with the vets for their dependableness… sometimes too long…but that’s a tough line to draw and determine when you dont have endless money to throw at Cuba and FA nor have a stable of high 1st rd picks stockpiled due to poor play for years
MM’s success so far buys him next year…but if we dont make it this year nor next i cant imagine he stays….the CArdinals have high standards and deservedly so… and though we will still end up probably with a top 10ish record… people want playoffs… total wins buys you time but playoffs buys your a future…MM has to show he can not only get to the playoffs, but also how to get a team BACK to the playoffs after scuffling whether due to injury, poor play or whatever… He is close, but getting over that hump will be big and interesting to see whether he can do it..
he isnt going anywhere this offseason so all the hate on him is screaming to the void… and i just dont see how it makes anyone feel better…it seems like all it does is bias you to any bad outcome….and as he isnt going anywhere at least for next year (after that Dewitt interview)…maybe it woudl be better if you complain about something that might actually change…otherwise you will just make your life miserable…
enjoy the game and team however you like…I just dont see why hating on something that isnt changing is going to help you enjoy your fandom…seems like a waste of time to me… but that’s to me…i waste my time on other dumb things so do as you will….
but attacking other people for their opinions is just unacceptable…just because you yell louder than someone else…or there are several people yelling at one or two people doesnt make YOUR opinion any righter than theirs…. I THINK my opinion is better because i came to it and havent been convinced in any way to change that opinion… if you cant handle BCC or me or anyone else defending their opinion without throwing personal attacks then you are just making your argument weaker….and the same goes vice versa… i’m not outside of this criticism either…nor is anyone no matter their amount of posts, past history, status whether paid member, or not, moderator, admin, owner whatever…
I don’t think the Cardinals were counting on OT as a long term solution. Not replacing him, though, has indeed been a problem.
You think the Cards would have given up their best young pitcher since Ankiel for a one year rental if they hadn’t have been counting on OT?
Unfortunately, I think they were trying to trade OT for a player who played a little better defense to go along with the high end bat. They may have had to include several others in the trade with OT.
Matheny is taking heat from some over not removing Molina last night…
1) when the score was 8-1
or
2) when Molina was dazed by the first foul off his mask (as suggested by Dan McLaughlin real time)Bernie Miklasz calling for Molina to sit out the rest of the year.
https://www.101sports.com/2017/09/26/mondays-scary-scene-yadier-molina-cardinals-must-right-thing/
Brian – why do you take so many shots at MM? Especially using Bernie, who is a known MM bashed.
Bernie doesn’t have a whole lot of credibility among sophisticated baseball fans in St. Louis.Onyx – believe it. He’s a relative.
bccran, why do you take sharing of news items as bashing? Please consider taking posts not directed at you less personally.
P.S. I don’t know how to identify sophisticated baseball fans, but I am guessing that other than you, they do not hang out here! 😉
On a serious note, I find myself disagreeing far less often with Bernie in recent years. Perhaps he does not feel the need to be as extreme in his takes as when we was with the paper. Or maybe it is just me…
MY uncle knows a guy who knows a guy whose nephew is dating a girl whose father used to coach little league where a former gm used to play.
Believe it, BH. I’m sorry, but it’s very true.
Brian – it would be helpful if at this time you threw in a positive article or two about MM. I’m sure they are out there. Just to show some balance.
And my thoughts about Bernie aren’t uncommon. I think if you asked other posters on here who live in the St. Louis area, you would get much the same impression of Bernie’s after he left the printed media. He simply is not the same entity in this community as he was at one time.
bc, you are able to put the link to positive articles, as well. If they are out there, you can find them, also.
Not the point, Forsch. If a moderator is going to have a duel role of also being a poster, he should try to present an unbiased view.
His posters are on both sides of the issue.
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