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Expectations.
I didn’t want JJ to hit leadoff as I thought it might put too much pressure on him as he acclimated to MLB. That he has handled that well while making himself a very good second baseman despite the limited experience at the position coming in should be celebrated, not nitpicked.
To be fair, like i said this thread had evolved into a conversation about rookie of the year,not his value to the cardinals. So thoughts on his stats, all of them, are on the table.
I think JJ is a good baseball player right now. I think it won’t be too long before he is an excellent player. I don’t see anyone on the Cardinal roster I would prefer leading off. Of course he could be better. I have no doubt he will be better. We should all enjoy watching this kid blossom.
Rah Cardinals! And Rah JJ!
I grew up with back of the bubblegum card stats and still refer to them often but there is no doubt the game has changed. Back in the 1980’s it was common to see between 20 to 30 MLB players hit .300 or better for the full season. Last year there were 7.
Anything above .275 is a good hitter now and .250 isn’t bad. JJ is curently at .235 but his OPS of .755 is not bad at all especially for a rookie. He has the 4th highest OPS on the team behind Walker, Herrera, and Burly.
I wont let the times change my perception of a great hitter. I think 300 is still the bar. Now obviously there has been times where just 300 want great. During the rabbit ball era whole teams averaged 300 so there is always other factors. The difference is being a great hitter has been undervalued by mlb, fans, and the players. Its no longer really coached from what i can see. I still think a sly manager if he could convince some players that have the ability to be really great avg hitters to do it against maybe their own personel interest could have a dominating team if he configured the roster right with a power guy here and some speed guys.
I happened to notice a long time ago that all of the great hitters have an intimidating glare when they stand in the box. Therefore, it’s my view that the key to being a good hitter is to never smile when you have a bat in your hands…
. I still think a sly manager if he could convince some players that have the ability to be really great avg hitters to do it against maybe their own personel interest
Remember Felix Jose? He played his best two seasons in the big leagues for the Cards in 1990 and 1991. As I recall, they tried to convince him to hit more for power than average, and his power output actually went up as a result.
Can’t believe Wetherholt isn’t first. He’s a 2 way player. Stewart is not. And a starting pitcher plays every 5 days.
Everyone agrees Jj is an elite defensive player. Statistics agree he is an elite defensive player. I’m an older fan. So you can stick to our father’s and grand fathers statistics or you can learn how to use Google and find out what all the newer metrics mean and how they’re calculated. Baseball still uses all the traditional stats. We’ve just found their importance has been recalibrated. Many Baseball statistician now consider wrc+ as being the best statistics to value a players overall contribution to his team scoring runs. Anyway, here’s a list of the leaders. JJ is good.
Weighted Runs Created Plus (wRC+) | Glossary | MLB.com https://share.google/2e0oqLIZvnMfDFwJm
Major League Leaderboards – 2026 – Batting | FanGraphs Baseball https://share.google/FMboTWtVzYMA8zR9A
Ohtani is a bum! 😉
💣 Homers this year:
– Shohei Ohtani: 7
– JJ Wetherholt: 8 pic.twitter.com/7EXMfJmp2D— STL Sports Central (@STLSprtsCntrl) May 13, 2026
Or you can just stick with your newer metrics and not worry about what others use. You can use google to look up a lot of things maybe more pertinent than baseball stats.far as felix jose, i dont remember him. But yea if you just focus on power, yea those stats generally will go up but so may some other negative stats even if modern baseball doesnt look on them as negatives.
Sticking to baseball card stats, worrying about his BA is like complaining about Cindy Crawford’s mole!
JJ Wetherholt is currently on pace for…
126 Runs
32 Home Runs
87 RBI
20 Steals
83 Walks#STLCardspic.twitter.com/TwUQzIJyjb— Eric Cross (@EricCrossMLB) May 13, 2026
In my view, the absolute common demominater for indentifying a truly great hitter is TB’s. It’s all you really need to pinpoint the hands that hold the bats that are extremely dangerous and generate tremendous amounts of offensive production. Take a look at the all time leaders in TB’s and you’ll see a collection of the undisputed all time greats.
From my cheap seat, the key number for Wetherholt is going to be runs scored. If he can cross HP somewhere near 80 times or more this season and beyond, he’ll have been an outstanding draft pick and addition to the Cardinals. And as a middle IF’er it goes without saying that his mitt will play a large part in regards to the success of the team.
Just think what his stats could be if he hit for higher avg. Hes fine as is, but the best players always strive to be better.
I can’t imagine he isn’t trying to be better in all aspects of his game. In fact, I’ve never met a player who says he is satisfied. But the overconcern about JJ’s BA continues to be a real head-scratcher.
I think i mentioned I’m an older fan. But my memory is good enough to remember when ba was king. But it just isn’t that way anymore. The guy who’s led the league in ba overall for the last 5 years has been shuffled to 4 different teams. Last year his ba was .303. He had a 1.3 war. Victor Scott 1.7. Pages 1.6. There’s just a lot of stuff besides ba that contributes to a players worth. And at the end of the day, war is $.
Well im not really concerned about his avg. But lets just pitchers start pitching strikes to him more, less walks, his avg stays the same then hes not scoring as many runs. So then the avg will mean something. Just say this, if walker was hitting 235 which could mean he might have a few less homers and less rbis. The talk on him would be a little different now.
I dont care about war. Its a cool stat fot a lot of people and scouts like it but when you can have a high war but yet strike out a lot. It just means zero to me. I wasnt notching the strike out thing at weatherholt just the war thing.
You are right Willie, different stats have more importance to some fans than they do others. I like war because it can be applied to players in a different era and you can see how great they really were.
Either way, stats have been a central part of baseball Fandom since the inception of the game. I like looking at stats and reading discussions about them better than I like watching TV. I wish I got to more games. I used to go to 1 game of every home series during the season.when you can have a high war but yet strike out a lot. It just means zero to me
An out is an out at the end of the day and it doesn’t matter in a lot of PA if the out was by K or a ball in play. There are times it does yes to advance a runner, but many PA it doesn’t matter. Aaron Judge strikes out 27.4% of the time but I don’t think you’ll find anyone saying he isn’t a great hitter.
Well im a big fan of what i see. I trust my eyes. I understand liking war because of what you said, keepcoming, you can measure against people you dont or didnt see. But like i said, to me it doesnt always value what i value in players. I should like it, i dont watch as many games or players like i used to but im just set in my ways.
Ill say aaron judge isnt a great hitter. Is he a great homerun hitter, yea he is. But a hitter,no. Yes it matters, to me how you make an out matters.
C’mon, man.
Judge won the 2025 batting title. That is for the highest batting average in his league. In fact, it was highest in all of MLB. Since you love BA, how can you ignore this? He hit .322 and .331 last two years.
He also has three MVP Awards, was Rookie of the Year, has five Silver Slugger Awards and has been named to seven All-Star Games!
Judge is NOT a one-dimensional player. You need to watch more AL games!
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