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Pederson would be a good pickup especially if we we do have dh. If we can get him at reasonable price on a short term deal. I don’t consider him to be more than average but we have a lot of below average hitting so it would be a step up.
I also like a cheap deal for a Gyorko or Todd Frazier type to platoon at 3B with Carp. None of them would block Gorman in 2022.
I keep reading suggestions that the Cardinals acquire Joc Pederson but I’m unclear on what desirable element people see in him. He’s not a bad player, from what I can tell, but is he really a significant improvement over the mediocre bunch we’ve got now? Perhaps y’all can enlighten me.
Here is a link to a post from another thread by stlcard25 that shows recent stats of a number of possible outfielders, including Pederson.
https://thecardinalnation.com/forums/topic/offense-2/page/25/#post-141093
MLB Trade Rumors has their Top 50 free agent list out with predictions. Of note they have:
4. Marcell Ozuna to the Nationals 4 years/$72M
18. Joc Pederson to the Cardinals 2 years/$18M
25. Kolten Wong to the Red Sox 2 years/$16M
32. Yadier Molina to the Cardinals 1 year/$10M
35. Adam Wainwright to the Cardinals 1 year/$6M
50. Chris Archer to the Cubs 1 year/$4M2020-21 Top 50 MLB Free Agents With Predictions https://t.co/XT80m8db5j pic.twitter.com/mwLT4wTA2t
— MLB Trade Rumors (@mlbtraderumors) November 2, 2020
So pretending that is real, where would $25 MM more put them? If we add this to DeWitt III’s $130-140 base, the total would be $155-165, or essentially no cut at all.
It would put them at around $151M, which would be less than last year but they would have to move more money if they want a more dramatic cut.
I believe this is the player that stl25 has referred to. But just because Mo says it is possible that doesn’t mean it is likely.
I asked Mo last week if cash flow issues would discourage signing free agents from Asia with posting fees attached. After he told me how much he hated the question, he said no, that it’s possible if the player makes sense.
Kim Ha-seong, for the #stlcards, makes sense. https://t.co/jqo7QzZ74s
— Jeff Jones (@jmjones) November 2, 2020
Jeff asks tougher questions than most. And I thought that was a good one.
I did not go back into the audio, but checking my notes, here is what I wrote live on what Mo said:
“Will not say the posting fee is not prohibitive. If opportunity, will consider.”
That is not nearly as rosy as represented.
P.S. This is for you, gscottar. I also rediscovered this in my notes. It is on one of your favorite subjects, the parallels between the Cardinals and Dodgers.
Someone asked Mo if they were similar. He did not agree. Again, my notes, not exact quotes.
LA was ultra aggressive in the international market
LA took on dead payroll money for prospects
Their model is different from ours, but both focus on homegrown talent
Both teams do not start out at first baseI believe this is the player that stl25 has referred to. But just because Mo says it is possible that doesn’t mean it is likely.
Yep, that’s him. And I watched the Zoom call that Jeff Jones is referring to. It was funny that Mo said how much he “always hates these kind of questions.” I dunno if there’s a history with he and Jones or what, but he wasn’t happy.
But start out about $125M
Trade Carlos (-$11M) $114M
Trade Miller, eat half (-$6M) $108M
Trade Fowler, eat 3/4 (-$4M) $104MSign Yadi (+$10M) $114M
Sign Waino (+$6M) $120M
Sign Pederson (+$9M) $129MThat’s a good cut. If they could convince Kim to sign on, they’d still be under the budget for last year by $25M or so. It’s doable, but depends on how much risk Dewitt can stomach.
Edman 2B
Carlson RF
Goldy 1B
Pederson LF
Dejong SS/3B
Kim 3B/SS
Yadi C
O’Neill/Bader CFFlaherty, Waino, Kim, Mikolas, Reyes/Gomber/Ponce
Yes, there is a history with most everyone on the calls. Jeff is never shy to ask questions and as I said, he tends to ask more direct questions than most. But some are aimed more accurately than others. Mo regularly kids Jeff as Shildt does Jim Hayes (though gentler). It is never angry, but sometimes the subjects can get irritated. Remember there can be 20 to 40 of us, with many trying to get their questions in. Sometimes the same things get asked when people arrive late or they get asked in a slightly different way. I did the latter myself on the last call because I wanted to drill down on a specific point on going external for OF help. Mo replied that he would not answer my question. It goes with the territory and is ok as long as everyone is respectful, which is the case.
Negative view of Kim.
Lots of people saying Kim, and OK, maybe, I don't know much about him, but I think of him as a SS, and @kileymcd didn't exactly sell me on him here pic.twitter.com/EIPeZZqPeg
— Mike Petriello (@mike_petriello) November 2, 2020
Brian, thanks for the info on Mo’s take on the Cardinals-Dodgers comparison. The fact that someone actually asked him that question indicates that maybe I am not the only person who has thought about it.
I have never said the two organizations are identical. I just think there are more similarities than you would think and I have also stated that by making the comparison should be considered a compliment to Mo.
When people claim that the only reason the Dodgers are good is because of money I have to disagree. They do a lot of things well, not just writing checks.
We just had a World Series between one of the wealthiest teams and one of the poorest teams. They are both very well ran and the one common trait they have is the blueprint of Andrew Friedman.
It was a very topical question since the Dodgers had just won the World Series. They were clearly on everyone’s minds. Friedman just earned his first ring. Good for him and the Dodgers. The best team won.
The Dodgers absolutely clean up on the international market. I can’t say for sure, but their overseas scouting budget may have been one area that their payroll muscle might have been flexed where it was a bit unnoticed.
“Flexing the payroll muscle”. Now that is a term I haven’t heard spoken in these here parts for a while now – and probably won’t for some time in the future, either! 😉
To follow up on the Dodgers front office this is what Goold wrote in his Q/A the other day.
How long is the Dodgers’ championship window?
Is forever an answer? The Dodgers have financial might, a front office with intellectual muscle, and Mookie Betts to go with Walker Buehler. I meant it when I wrote it in the newspaper that the Los Angeles Dodgers are the monster that Moneyball never intended, and as long as they are run like that in the second-largest market in baseball, then they have the potential to be good for years and years and years to come. They draft well. They develop well. They have the money to spend to cover up their mistakes.
Derrick Goold
Having an ace and a superstar position player on your team definitely helps. Just like having Pujols papered over a lot of the Cards’ issues over the years.
Given our present business model, which consists of reliance on kids from AAA and a self-imposed salary cap the Cardinals will never be a top flight team. They’ll struggle and battle every year to make the playoffs on the last day of the season. They’re not the only team in that situation. The Brewers, Reds and even the Cubs to a certain extent are second tier teams. Watching the lineups of the Dodgers, Braves, Yankees, Astros, Padres and then looking at our lineup was sobering.
It is the reality of the league. The Cardinals don’t have millions to throw around like New York and LA teams do and they never will so, couple that with a talent evaluation system that seems to be broken and you have the mess we have in St. Louis. The Cardinals will rarely if ever be in the top five or six teams with a chance to win the WS. We’ll all have to be satisfied with a team that crashes into walls, sprints to first base on every play, takes out the SS on double plays, etc. The old college try syndrome because if you think they’ll ever be a powerhouse from their own AAA players and low hanging fruit then you’re delusional because it’s not going to happen.Having an ace and a superstar position player on your team definitely helps. Just like having Pujols papered over a lot of the Cards’ issues over the years.
It helps but so do these things:
A front office with intellectual muscle
They draft well
They develop well
A front office with intellectual muscle
They draft well
They develop well
The Cards have all those things too. What the Cards don’t have…a superstar position player. Both teams are good at developing the 2-3 WAR guys and the good young pitching but the Cards haven’t found a Bellinger or brought in a Betts.
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