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I’m fine with Mikolas in the rotation next year. I’m even fine with one of Matz/Liberatore/Thompson as the #5. That still means that 3 starters have to be found somewhere. I like some of the ideas above to make a trade and sign a guy, then take on a reach. Would it get us all the way to a plus rotation? I’m not sure, but it would be better than this year.
Yamamoto is likely out of reach, as he’ll command $200M or so. Shoto Imanaga could be the play…he’s a lefty with better strikeout stuff than Yamamoto, and will certainly come cheaper. He might be signable in the range of Kodai Senga’s deal, which was $15M a year. That’s a bet I would make, as Senga has excelled too.
Then I’d look at a trade for Bieber or one of the Mariners or Marlins arms. We have some pieces to move that could accommodate that.
For the third arm, maybe we finally get Marcus Stroman here? He’s not an ace but he racks up ground balls still. Or I don’t mind the Freeland flier.
The biggest thing we got out the Montgomery/Stratton/Hicks, etc trades is young pitching prospects. I really like Robys stuff. It is electric. I also like Rajcics promotion to AA. He could see Memphis next year. Cornwall came out nowhere, and could be a factor.
I still say Mospeak tells me we’ll have 3 new starters next year, but I can see adding one outside arm of value. The other 2 would be a Lawrence type, and a prospect. I don’t agree with that, but unless fans revolt their idiocy they won’t change.
I would not like to be the Cards season ticket sales people for next year.
I’d look for Kloffenstein to be #5 sometime in 2024.
He will not be the #5 at the start of the season, and likely not the first few months.
So, the Cardinals have to plan as though he will not be in the rotation at all, and factor him into the depth if one of the starting pitchers earmarked for a spot in the rotation goes down with injury, as has seemingly happened the last few years.
At a minimum: The top 3 guys in the rotation need to be guys who will be good enough for those slots if they do what they have been doing. The 4th guy can be he’s done good enough consistently before and we hope he can again. The 5th guy can be hasn’t done it yet but we hope he’ll be fine.
I agree with the other posters that we need to pump the breaks on Nola and Snell. Both are going to get huge contracts. Nola is heading into his 30’s with a lot of mileage on his arm. The chances of Snell repeating this season seem very slim to me. He is also in his 30’s and has a history of injuries. I would put both of those guys on albatross alert.
I have always been high on Bieber but he came up lame this year and only has one year of control left.
I would be fine with Yamomoto, Giolito, and one of the Mariners young hurlers.
I’m a little higher on Nola than others…I think he could be our new Waino. Yet, I’d be ok if they skipped on him if the contract is too onerous. It’s possible his mediocre 2023 will drive his price down a bit so if they could get him for 5/$125M or 6/$150M I may change my mind. That’s pretty much Jon Lester’s deal, and he was worth it for Chicago. No more small market mentality for us.
Nola has basically been good every even year since his break in, so he’s due for a good 2024.
Snell has had a very good season and is going to end up with a big contract somewhere. I still think he much more likely to end up on the IL next year than he is of repeating this year’s success.
I had forgotten about Urias getting arrested for domestic violence, although who knows what ‘domestic violence’ really means in LA. I think it means he physically hurt his wife in some way. If that’s the case, he will never be a Cardinal.
My post about Urias was purely rhetorical. Who knows what our opening day starting 5 will look like. I personally would like to see them use all of their resources on flooding the system with high upside prospects and development program. But that requires patience and more of a rebuild than anyone wants. So really we all are just guessing who might be signed and who is available. I expect to see them go hard at guys that don’t have a loss of draft choice attached. Either Japanese player. Sonny Gray if the years are reasonable. People keep talking Montgomery. I don’t see that. I see a trade with Seattle or Miami. Maybe Tampa Bay. I’m highly concerned Matz will ever be a solution. They also need to bring in at least 2 proven bullpen pieces if they want to be competitive.
The entire pitching staff is a disaster.
There’s not a single current hurler starting or in the bullpen that I trust to perform at a high level and / or stay healthy.
Not one.
ZTR – With MLB pitchers , I think when you throw in the caveat of trusting them to stay healthy, it just about rules everyone out. They all break. It’s part of their profession.
Mikolas is the only guy in the stable that we can be reasonably assured will provide competent innings next year. Of course, pitchers gonna pitcher so you never know. Yet the slate is certainly blank for some new arms to come in and showcase their stuff. Hopefully the defense returns to being strong next year.
Yeah, the relatively shoddy defense was actually the biggest shocker to me in 2023. Very un-Cardinal.
Indeed. The defense that yielded 5 Gold Gloves just two years ago looks pretty tarnished right now. Some of that is new guys, and guys playing out of place. I hope they’ll clean it up in the offseason through practice or personnel.
Some have suggested the lack of a set lineup does not allow the level of chemistry between the defenders to develop to the elite level. Not sure how that could be proven or disproven, but there were a lot of moving parts this year. For example, seven different players have appeared at second base this season.
ZTR
The entire pitching staff is a disaster.
There’s not a single current hurler starting or in the bullpen that I trust to perform at a high level and / or stay healthy.
Not one.
I agree. That’s why I suggested throwing the kitchen sink at the rotation and going after 5 starters, including an underwater contract guy and a major injury recovery guy. Those two spots can be supplemented by Matz and Mikolas.
All of our AAA depth should shore up the bullpen and we can re-evaluate in June/July.
But I hope that Mozeliak looks for a few of the Neshek/Oh/Norris type relief options this year as well.
There is a good chance that Urias, like Bauer, has already thrown his last pitch in the major leagues.
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