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That same article says Rom “thrives on pitchability rather than overpowering stuff”. But then talks about his swing and miss stuff and ability to miss barrels. A bunch of canned scouting report spew thrown together.
Mo has plenty of work to do this offseason. I agree he needs to bring in 3 starters. 2 of them need to be better than MM and Matz. For that matter, we all enjoyed Matz little run of solid starts, but here he is on the IL again. He hasn’t been a reliable sp so far in his Cardinals career. Beyond that, good starters do you no good if your pen blows up. I realize we can backfill with some of the guys we have internally, but we are still going to need a couple of high leverage arms.
Some of the new guys are doing well. Rom has had 2 really good starts and Prieto and Saggese seem to have multi hit games almost every day.
As i pointed out in another post, Herrera is not ranked, either. Maybe the ‘experts’ who made that Top 30 ranking were just having a bad day at the office?
Mud, I think some ranking services have concluded that Herrera has graduated from the prospect ranks, based on certain criteria. Brian would be the expert on that.
Yes, I suspect that Herrera may have passed 45 days in MLB. That removes his prospect criteria same as 130 at-bats or 50 innings pitched. The former is just more difficult to track.
Yes last years FA class had some really good relief options and we passed on them.
Love to get into that market again
Pads –
That’s right on. Hope he doesn’t make the same mistake again of filling the bullpen with mediocre (at best) guys.
That was brutal this season.Let’s just take one bullpen example. James Naile.
This season with the Cardinals –
IP – 11
Hits – 21
Walks – 8
ERA – 9.00
WHIP – 2.636A 30 year old who was drafted in the 20th round by the As in 2015. Who had never pitched in the majors before this season with the Cardinals.
Really Mo?I think it’s far too early to say that the recently traded for pitching prospects won’t be a factor in next years rotation is quite premature. At least at some point.
They could be a factor in the rotation, but I absolutely do not want to count on them or on guys like Hudson or Liberatore. Let these guys force their way into a rotation spot.
Back in 2012, we had a preseason rotation of Carpenter, Waino, Lohse, Garcia, and Westbrook. Prospects Lance Lynn and Joe Kelly forced their way on or made up for injuries. Same in 2013, we had Waino, Garcia, Westbrook, Lynn, and Kelly, but Shelby Miller and Wacha forced their way into the rotation.
With excess options, guys like Kelly, Rosenthal, Martinez, and Siegrist ended up in the bullpen.
27 – The only pitcher who has any real AAA experience is Rom. He has 27 AAA starts, and will probably be competing with Hudson, Libby, Graceffo, and McGreevy for rotation time with the Cards in 2024.
If Mo is counting on any of the newly acquired prospects to be factors for the 2024 STL rotation we are in big trouble. I am not saying that some of those guys won’t make it up sometime next year but I highly doubt they would be ready to be a factor by opening day. We need proven guys ready to go by 3-28-24. The rookies can fill in as needed later in the year.
Pretty good summary there, but I don’t think there is a line between the “4 starter” plan and the “5 starter” plan. Mo won’t be choosing one or the other. There won’t be an issue with blocking the in house guys. This is because I don’t think Mo will bring in, by FA signing or trade, 3 guys who are post-arb and have a substantial contract. Those are the type who, added to Mikolas and Matz, will be automatically in the rotation, blocking everybody who doesn’t have a contract.
He will surley bring in one such guy. A heavy hitter who will either be signed as a FA or be traded for and who comes with a contract already in place. It seems likely he would acquire another less heavy guy who will either be puling down a significant arb salary or have a contract. But I doubt a third. The third starter will be a pre-arb or maybe first year arb. Not somebody who is automatic. So, even without injury, there would be one slot that guys can compete for.
Besides all that, I would not be worried about blocking guys who let us down this year, whether in MLB or AAA, which is all of them. Let them wait it out. The new guys are either unproven in AAA or hurt, so how blocked they are as of opening day is not an issue. Worry about how blocked they are when they have proven they are ready. There will be some attrition as the season progresses, and they can unblock themselves then, or not.
Oh I am not worried about blocking any of our minor league pitchers at any point next year but apparently not everyone feels that way.
I know it’s a dangerous thought, but how do we know that a
#4 or #5 starter brought in from the outside will be any better than Hudson, Woodford, Graceffo, McGreevy, or Rom? All 5
may be capable of pitching in the high 3s ERA.there is a big difference between “may be capable” vs. “has already done it”.
Truer words were never spoken.
I think the Cardinals need to acquire at least 1 SP with Top-of-the-Rotation capability. I would prefer that pitcher be controllable for at least 3-4 years. After that, they need to acquire 2 other SPs. Those 2 need to be at least high #3 quality or better. They can be on 1-2 year control. That should buy us enough time to allow our prospects to develop into viable options.
Hopefully, by the middle of 2024, 1 or 2 of Rom, Graceffo and McGreevy are ready. By 2025, I hope we have 2 or 3 prospects to fill starting rotation positions. Of course, by the end of 2025, all of our current starting pitchers, with the exception of Thompson and Liberatore, will have their contracts expire.
Hudson has pitched 427.1 major league innings with an ERA of 3.64. Woodford has pitched 176.2 major league innings with an ERA of 4.08. Aren’t those pretty much #4 and #5 numbers?
Hudson’s ERA is bolstered by his innings pre-pandemic before he blew out his arm. Last year it was 4.45. Woodford’s stretch of success came last year in roles other than as a starter.
If they are here next spring, they could compete for a role. If we hit opening day counting on either to fill a rotation slot, it will be asking for trouble.
If there are 4 solid starters, though, the fifth slot can be flyer. It’s not like when 3 slots are flyers, which seems to have been Mo’s plan for this year.
Flaherty was better before injury too, but he didn’t pitch like it this year. Career numbers ignore post-injury.
It’s what you think a pitcher will do going forward, and BillyMo dropped the ball big time last winter. Hope was their strategy.
Hudson couldn’t make the rotation for one of the worst rotations in baseball, until we sold starters at this deadline. Non-tender him this winter. Blow it up and rebuild it right.
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