Shildt Fired

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  • #175024
    bicyclemike
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    If as Nate said, that Shidlt wanted the Cardinals to go with proven talent and spend the money to bring ’em in similar to the Dodgers MO, then he bought his ticket out. The Cardinals do not have the resources to take on the risk that would come with operating that way. I highly doubt that had anything to do with the “philosophical differences”, as no one is dumb enough to think the Cardinals could do that. Anyone who has been in the organization as long as Shildt knows the organization’s limitations, and how they balance winning and fiscal health.

    My thought is it had more to do with a lot of things many of us arm chair managers get frustrated with – the way he utilizes his roster, particularly the pitchers, and his lineup construction and in-game decisions. Management likely wanted some input into that, and he said he would do it his way or no way.

    And as Nate also said, management is king and the king’s way rules.

    #175025
    PugsleyAddams
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    MsPaid (aka “Nate”)…….is stone cold money in the bank. When successfully attempting to figure these sort of matters out, you have to be able to connect the dots. Something tells me that Shildt, Shannon and the rumors of possible new ownership, are 3 important dots in this particular equation.

    #175027
    BlackHillsCard
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    Whatever the reason for the firing I cannot get past how Mozeliak said this happened recently and was brought to his attention within the past few days. That does not sound like anything to do with his managing style.

    #175028
    PugsleyAddams
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    Yet another dot. Nice…….very nice, Black Hills.

    #175032
    1964cards
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    I was as surprised as most of you were. So, i listened to the press conference in addition to reading Brian’s article. Mo was very careful what he said.

    Mo stated that the move was made due to “Philosophical differences of where they wanted to take the ball club.” This leads me to believe it relates in-game use of analytics, 2022 roster construction or both. Mo stated he was hopeful that the full coaching staff would be returning in 2022.

    It will be interesting to hear Shildt’s thoughts.

    #175033
    Cards667
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    2018-2021 Mike Shildt: 252-199 (.559)
    2012-2018 Mike Matheny: 591-474 (.555)
    1996-2011 Tony La Russa: 1408-1182(.544)
    1990-1995 Joe Torre: 351-354 (.498)

    Talent wins. Not the manager. As long as the manager has talent and doesn’t completely get in the way of that talent then talent will win. Line up construction, I love how mad people got at Schildt over it. It’s pretty irrelevant. People mad Goldschmidt hit 2nd. The Braves hit Solar leadoff! Molina hit too high in the order to me, but I could handle 6th. I didn’t love Schildt, but i sure didn’t dislike him or blame him for much, even if I was screaming a him to leave Gio in the Wild Card game and then again not to bring in Reyes.

    #175034
    Card4Ever
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    I would love to see someone from outside, a Francona or a Bochy. Unfortunately, I really believe Mozeliak will never bring in anyone who disagrees with any of his decisions, never bring in a LaRussa type.

    #175038
    blingboy
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    I don’t think Mo was unhappy with Shild’s performance throughout the season and was not thinking of replacing him as of the conclusion of the season. Things went sideways during meetings afterwards. Like Mo heard something from Shildt he wasn’t expecting and did not want to go forward with.

    I do not know what such meetings right after the season would likely consist of. Evaluation of the talent and needs on the active roster and 40 man? Seems a reasonable assumption. I think we need to remember that the team was pretty unimpressive all year except for a few weeks long hot streak at the end. The rest of the system (MiLB) was profoundly unimpressive all year.

    The whole thing did a lot of limping along with a bunch of short term emergency fix scrap heap fill in guys, cast offs and Indy guys, some of whom did an admirable job. It may be that Shildt wanted to know what Mo intended to do about that and was not satisfied with what he was hearing.

    #175040
    Pork Twain
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    I am more than ok with this move. This was lead to by leaving starters in too long, overusing questionable relievers and poor lineups. No reason to waste Waino and Yadi’s last hoorah on another year of this.

    #175041
    blingboy
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    This was lead to by leaving starters in too long, overusing questionable relievers and poor lineups.

    I believe it was made clear that it was not due to roster management/in-game management decisions. It seems to have been a difference as to the path going forward from here.

    #175042
    1964cards
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    Agree with you Blingboy. Sounds like Mo and Shildt did not agree on path forward.

    #175043
    Pork Twain
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    A lot of things are said in press conferences that do not sum up the entirety of a situation. If he did all of the things I mentioned…perfectly, it would have been a lot more difficult to move on from him for purely philosophical differences.

    #175049
    gscottar
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    Bochy said he’d be interested in a job and Francona just stepped down in July I think from the Indians.

    No Francona did not step down. He took a medical leave of absence but is expected to be back in the Cleveland dugout in 2022. We could have hired him before the 2012 season but didn’t. Big mistake.

    #175050
    gscottar
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    This whole Shildt thing is still very surprising to me. Weren’t there reports recently that the Cardinals were working on an extension for Shildt? What in the heck happened? Shildt always struck me as a company yes man. I am very surprised he would push back against Mo. I also have a hard time believing the “philosophical differences” explanation. Shildt carried around a notebook from George Kissell for crying out loud. It doesn’t get any more Cardinal than that.

    #175051
    gscottar
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    I would imagine the list of candidates would be Clapp, Marmol, Oquendo, Schumaker, or Beltran.

    I wouldn’t mind going after a more veteran manager but the Cardinals haven’t seemed interested in that since LaRussa left.

    #175063
    Ratsbuddy
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    Something tells me that whoever the next St. Louis manager is that he will be met with immediate negative reaction and most of us will not like the hiring. And on top of that, most will be worried about the immediate future of the Cardinals.

    r/Esteemed Rat

    #175064
    CariocaCardinal
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    Bases on Mo’s comments I can only conclude that Shildt was unhappy with payroll plans going forward.

    #175065
    Cardinal in France
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    Doncha just love the way these guys talk?

    “The decision we made has been made, and ultimately we have to stand by that, because that’s the decision we decided on,” said Mozeliak.

    Gotta wonder what it must be like inside their heads.

    #175066
    Brian Walton
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    #175068
    blingboy
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    Unattributed blather. Could have heard it from the guy on the next barstool. That said, I wouldn’t expect so either. I also do not expect it to be Marmol or Oquendo. Is Pop Warner a possibility? Or Albert?

    #175069
    gscottar
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    If I were laying odds, which I am not, I would say it will either be Clapp or Schumaker.

    #175075
    Brian Walton
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    Speaking of odds, these come from betonline.ag:

    Next Cardinals Manager

    Stubby Clapp 3/2
    Skip Schumaker 4/1
    Mark McGwire 23/4
    Buck Showalter 13/2
    Oliver Marmol 15/2
    Joe Espada 8/1
    Jose Oquendo 10/1
    Bruce Bochy 11/1
    Brad Ausmus 12/1
    Matt Holliday 12/1
    Jeff Banister 14/1

    #175076
    gscottar
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    #175077
    blingboy
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    I couldn’t read the paywalled ESPN article but in the video blurb the guy thinks the philosophical difference was bringing Reyes to do what Reyes had been doing, blow the game.

    #175078
    Ratsbuddy
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    Next Cardinals Manager

    Stubby Clapp 3/2
    Skip Schumaker 4/1
    Mark McGwire 23/4
    Buck Showalter 13/2
    Oliver Marmol 15/2
    Joe Espada 8/1
    Jose Oquendo 10/1
    Bruce Bochy 11/1
    Brad Ausmus 12/1
    Matt Holliday 12/1
    Jeff Banister 14/1

    That’s not alot to choose from there. Certainly nobody leaps out as a leading candidate. And it makes me wonder if the prima dona players would respect anybody from this group.

    I suppose if I had to choose one from this group it would be Brad Ausmus. Maybe Stubby 2nd.

    Isn’t there anybody else out there that we could consider???

    What about Don Mattingly? He’s from Evansville and he perhaps might be interested.

    r/Esteemed Rat

Viewing 25 posts - 51 through 75 (of 235 total)
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