Alec Burleson

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  • #194553
    jj-cf-stl
    Participant

    Donovan works the strike zone, good plate discipline. With Edman that comes and goes.
    Edman will be an arb1 next season and will lead his class in PA’s and GS. Whatever you are expecting his arb amount to be, double it. He missed super2 by less than a week last winter.

    #194556
    stlcard25
    Participant

    Paid - Annual

    Donovan and Edman are similar players, with Edman no doubt having more value in a trade. Donovan might net you a #4/5 starter in a trade, while Edman might net you a #2/3. That’s the difference. Winn could be ready to approximate the defense, base running and some of the bat for Tommy as soon as mid summer. For once I’d like to see the Cards strike while the iron is hot and trade the guy at his peak value for better value.

    #194561
    14NyquisT
    Participant

    Edman was custom made for this team…. that’s it. Mo should know this.

    #194562
    forsch31
    Participant

    Free

    Since Donovan basically duplicates Edman and Edman’s value may never be higher, it makes the most sense to trade Edman. With 3 years until free agency, someone should give great value to get a super utility guy like him. He can step in as a starter at many positions or constantly start at a different position each day.

    My fear with Edman is that he will never maintain the hitting he displayed earlier this year. Maybe he will only be an average hitter, good defender.

    #194565
    stlcard25
    Participant

    Paid - Annual

    Calling Edman an average hitter is a stretch, even. He’s good player, but almost all his value comes from defense and base running. If the Cards elect to keep him it’s fine, but I think Winn and Gorman are your up the middle duo for the future. The rotation looks much less certain.

    #194566
    bccran
    Participant

    Edman is like David Eckstein. He’s a winner. Don’t trade him, just because his “value is higher”. That’s the reason to keep him.

    #194575
    Brian Walton
    Keymaster

    Paid - Annual

    Like any trade, it should depend on the overall needs of the club at the future time when trades are again allowed and the value received in return. As noted, there are others at his positions so I wouldn’t consider him untouchable, nor would I get trade him just to get rid of him. There would have to be a reason.

    It’s not unlike trading Bader. No one really thought about it ahead of time. But when another team had a need and he was an ideal fit plus their offer filled a big need for the Cards, the deal made sense.

    #194588
    GameCard
    Participant

    Free

    The Cardinals and really every team need more than 9 players because of injuries and up and down production. This current team has seen it with O’Neill, Bader, Molina, DeJong etc. Players like Donavan, Yepez and Nootbar have stepped up to fill those holes. Obviously, Goldschmidt and Arenado are the most important players that we have but Tommy Edman is next in importance. He is a fast, switch hitter and an excellent defender at both 2B and SS. You don’t ever consider trading him. Teach Gorman to play corner outfield(Probably LF) and in a year play Walker in right, Carlson in CF and Gorman in LF.

    #194589
    stlcard25
    Participant

    Paid - Annual

    C-Herrera, Knizner
    1B-Goldy, Yepez
    2B-Gorman, Donovan
    SS-Dononvan, Winn
    3B-Arenado, Donovan
    LF-O’Neill, Burleson, Yepez
    CF-Carlson, Nootbaar
    RF-Nootbaar, Walker, Burleson

    Everything is covered even without any other tweaks, so a guy like Edman or Donovan would be expendable. By no means should he be given away, but to add a front of rotation pitcher, losing three years of Edman looks a lot better than losing 4 years of Carlson, 6 of Gorman, Winn, Burleson or Walker.

    #194591
    CardsFanInChiTown
    Participant

    Free

    I don’t have a specific target, but the need of a 1A starting pitcher takes precedent going into 2023. Obviously Goldy and Arenado are off the table, and I’d add Winn and Herrera to that list actually. And let’s be honest, Dewitt isn’t going to approve signing one of the top guys, so a trade is the likeliest option.

    #194592
    gscottar
    Participant

    Paid - Annual

    I don’t have a specific target, but the need of a 1A starting pitcher takes precedent going into 2023.

    Yes this is definitely our number one need but a close second is catcher.

    I AM NOT giving up on Herrera but I am also not convinced he is ready to be an everyday player in 2023. Option 1 would be to find a stop-gap veteran that can hold the fort down until Herrera is ready. Option 2 would be to go big for Contreras, in which Herrera could still get two starts a week since Contreras does seem to DH quite a bit.

    Anyway, none of that has anything to do with Burleson but we seem to have gotten sidetracked…lol

    #194593
    jj-cf-stl
    Participant

    Beane: Hi Bowtie, lets do a deal.
    Mo: Who you offering?
    Beane: My catcher Sean Murphy.
    Mo: I’m interested, and I’ve got middle infield depth.
    Beane: Murphy for Gorman
    Mo: Nah, he is my 2Bman for the next 6 years. How about Donovan?
    Beane: Love his near minimum salary but he’s mostly unproven compared to Murphy.
    Beane / Mo simultaneously: Edman
    Mo: Done?
    Beane: Done

    #194596
    GameCard
    Participant

    Free

    Again, EDMAN should not be considered in any trade.

    #194600
    CariocaCardinal
    Participant

    Paid - Monthly

    I would trade any player for the right return. Sean Murphy isnt the right return.

    #194602
    blingboy
    Participant

    Paid - Annual

    I am not expecting Mo to go all out for a top starter this winter. He may not do much of anything. Opening day roster may look a lot like what we have now. Yepez instead of Pujols, Burleson instead of Dickerson. I would not be at all surprised to go into ST with the idea of sorting through the pitchers we have in house to come up with a rotation and a pen. Maybe a low hanging fruit or two during ST if we are riddled with injuries.

    #194623
    Cards667
    Participant

    Free

    Bling, that’s exactly what I’m saying, replace Pujols and Dickerson internally and I don’t expect much at all. I could see something like Hudson, Fernandez (out of options), maybe a Walsh type traded for some minor league depth. AA IF is REALLY thin once you move Wynn and Walker to AAA, probably Dunn also. A team like TB has a lot of IF depth in the minors and always budget constraints. So if you said those 3 for something along the lines of Alika Williams and Tanner Murray it would clear out 40 man spots, rotation spot for Pallante, Liberatore, or an acquired SP, get some depth in the minors IF so they aren’t relying on the Frontier Leagues for guys like Baldoquin and Errol Robinson. And then, in my opinion, they are going to want Gorman playing every day at 2B. Donovan is cheap and control and a perfect utility guy to plug in all over regularly. 1B and 3B are set. So that leaves SS. If they can find a taker for DeJong and his $9.5 million it makes sense and roll Edman as the every day SS, But if they can’t, as much as I like Edman, he could be dealt if a proven C or a high quality SP to put into where Hudson is now or could be leaving in my made up possibility. The FA SS market is strong and a loser could be willing to pay for Edman or take a flyer on DeJong, opening a few more things for the Cardianls. I like Edman, but when evaluating the roster and the future, such as DeJong FA after 2023 and opening SS to Winn in 2024, there are a billion different scenarios that could be thought up, but I agree with the fact I don’t see this off season as a busy one at all, but for now I’m going to enjoy the rest of 2022 and hope for the best.

    #194627
    1toughdominican
    Participant

    Free

    A little more than a month ago I would have said there was no chance that Eddie would be given any consideration as a trade chip this off season, however if he doesn’t improve his performance in the batter’s box, I’d be sad to see him go, but not shocked by a trade that brought a decent return. I still feel he’s better than average with the bat. He’s going to collect 25 to 30 SB’s wherever he plays, and he obviously fits into a GG and he’ll be awarded several more before he’s done. I also feel that he carries that silly thing that we refer to as the intangible. My gut feeling tells me he’s a winning type ballplayer. He’s smart. I’ve yet to see him make a mental mistake on the field. He plays hard and he plays with intensity to win. Heck, until about a month ago he was on pace to cross HP 100 times and runs are still pretty important in this game. In any event, I hope he stays in a Redbird uniform for awhile.

    #194628
    1toughdominican
    Participant

    Free

    I’m with you…Eddie’s more than ok with me. But you know how it is in this game. One word…”youneverknow.”

    #194635
    bccran
    Participant

    Interesting contradiction. Posters want to have depth in case of injuries, but then propose trading one of the Cardinals most versatile all around players.

    #194640
    Brian Walton
    Keymaster

    Paid - Annual

    All depth is not the same. How much depth is just enough and how much more becomes a surplus from which you can trade to help the team elsewhere?

    In the case of the middle infield, Sosa is gone, but Winn is coming. None of the incumbents (Edman, Gorman, DeJong, Donovan) have contracts expiring soon. It COULD become a surplus situation ahead. But just after the trade deadline has passed does not seem the ideal time to get worked up over future trade scenarios that are anything but real.

    I will add that Kolten Wong might provide an interesting case study for those who want to try to anticipate the future.

    #194641
    bccran
    Participant

    A key might be to check the versatility. Edman can play 3 infield positions and the outfield corners. Donovan has that kind of versatility. DeJong probably not so much. Gorman has played only 3B and 2B. Winn? He’s an unproven minor leaguer at this point. Exciting, but still just a prospect. And probably several years away. We may not have as much depth as appears.

    #194642
    stlcard25
    Participant

    Paid - Annual

    It’s hard to envision the Cards acquiring a top of the rotation starter (which I’d call a desperate need if they want to compete for more than the division in the next few years) in free agency, as you have said before that it’s just not the Cards’ model. So that leaves trades. Here are what I’d consider the Cards’ good trade pieces (in order of overall value, IMO):

    Walker
    Carlson
    Gorman
    Winn
    Edman
    Liberatore
    Herrera
    Graceffo
    Hence
    Burleson
    Donovan
    O’Neill

    Of those, Walker is too good to be traded unless it’s for a megastar. Carlson is too needed in the OF. Herrera can’t really be moved unless we had some other option at catcher. Graceffo and below are worth half or less than Edman and above so you’d need to trade two of them to equal Edman.

    So that leaves Gorman, Winn and Edman as the most likely trade chips if we want to upgrade the rotation. Edman is currently producing the best at the big league level, but has the least team control remaining. He’s also arguably having a career year, so his trade value could be at its highest. Winn is the lowest floor of the three as he’s still in Springfield. He also has a high ceiling. Gorman is controlled for six years and seems safe to be a big league average or better 2B in that time. But the K issues are slightly worrisome.

    It’s clearly a spot where the Cards have decent depth so it seems like the place to trade from. So do you value 3 years of Edman, knowing that he could have peaked or 6 years of Gorman or Winn, with the potential for multiple Edman type years?

    #194655
    Brian Walton
    Keymaster

    Paid - Annual

    bcc said:

    Winn? He’s an unproven minor leaguer at this point. Exciting, but still just a prospect. And probably several years away.

    Several years? Maybe if he slows down. Otherwise, he should be ready to debut in 2023. Of course, the actual timing also depends on opportunity, which is almost impossible to predict.

    With plenty of time remaining this season, Winn already has 264 plate appearances at Double-A with an OPS just short of .800. He is probably defensively ready right now and IMO, he is a better SS than DeJong or anyone else with St. Louis.

    As the Double-A season ends before Triple-A, I wouldn’t be surprised to see he and Walker get the late-season Memphis promotions and/or spots in the AFL. Their time is coming sooner than you think.

    #194659
    bccran
    Participant

    Winn and Walker are probably penciled in for 2024. They’ll need a decent amount of time at AAA.

    #194662
    blingboy
    Participant

    Paid - Annual

    As of right now we have no established everyday starting SS or 2B besides Edman. DeJong getting a chance to reclaim SS. Gorman so far not claiming even a platoon share of 2B. Edman is not going anywhere.

Viewing 25 posts - 226 through 250 (of 379 total)
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