Cardinals Team Hall of Fame

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  • #121522
    Avatar1982 willie
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    well last year I voted for morris and tudor, both definitely should be in there in my opinion. normally I would vote the same since nothing has changed far as my opinion. but with herr being put on there, why he wasn’t before I don’t know. im probably changing morris to herr. while most people probably vote most deserving, I vote that in combination with how long its been since they played. I figure as time goes by, lots of the older guys will get picked over in favor of players more people know cause they are more current. I still want morris in but I believe herr was just as important a cardinal as some of the others. by the way, when is George Hendrick gonna get on this thing.

    #121543
    Avatar14NyquisT
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    Brian Walton: (member of the red-ribbon committee)

    (My personal ballot, which allowed for up to 10 names, included just nine this year. I voted for all seven who went on the make the fan ballot – plus Hendrick and Andujar.)

    I reread George’s career. Did you remember that he was traded with Dave Duncan from OAK to CLE for Ray Fosse? And how about being traded from STL to PIT for John Tudor?

    I think he’ll be on the ballot next year and finally get in…. a true Cardinal powerhouse member for the
    7 years he was here. Two AS years and received MVP votes in four seasons with the Cards.

    #121547
    Avatar1982 willie
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    i didn’t know Hendrick was traded for tudor. wasn’t as easy back then to know what and when about stuff. tudor was a great pickup. both players were great for the cardinals.

    #121578
    Brian WaltonBrian Walton
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    Ny, I am sure glad you quoted me as it led me to realize I made a typo!

    But, yes, I believe Silent George is deserving of consideration. But his StL WAR far trails Hernandez and also falls short of Carlton and Morris. The former two do not receive fair consideration because of their success elsewhere, but were really good as Cardinals. Morris was the ace for some very good teams before Carpenter arrived.

    P.S. I was making a point by voting for just nine. The pool is getting shallower – to the point I am not sure all nine should go in. IMO, it is time to dial back to one Modern Era player per year. But that is the DeWitts’ call.

    #121582
    BlackHillsCardBlackHillsCard
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    I agree they need to dial back on how many guys get in. We’re quickly running out of guys who I would consider worthy of the Cards HOF and a few of the guys on this years ballot I will never vote for: Renteria, Herr, Smith. Renteria and Herr because I don’t deem them worthy and Smith mainly because I consider him a Cub. He only played 3+ seasons as a Cardinal. Hernandez at least spent more years as a Cardinals than a Met, which many people don’t seem to realize.

    #121583
    Brian WaltonBrian Walton
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    Not Cardinals Hall of Fame. Not even Cardinals, but retired numbers is a subject that comes up here now and then. I think this is way cooler…

    Also, I read that the University of Colorado football team is unretiring three numbers – with the blessing of the families of the now-deceased honorees.

    #121591
    Avatar1982 willie
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    I don’t abide by the we need to limit the number of players going into the cardinals hall or the major league hall. the benefit of having a more welcoming inclusive hall far outweighs having an exclusive hall. having more of those guys in red around is only a benefit to the team and its fans. we already have one or two you could call suspect but I don’t really have a problem with them, they were voted in. its not always about numbers and other fancy analytical statistics either.

    #121593
    Brian WaltonBrian Walton
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    1982, that is why a committee can be beneficial. Different people bring different perspectives. I can assure you that members like Whitey, TLR and Joe Torre are not citing WAR, which is great. But ultimately for the Modern Era players, we just set the ballot. The fans decide who goes in – using whatever criteria they choose. It is a peoples’ Hall.

    #121594
    Boyer14Boyer14
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    They do need to limit the inductees for every year. Leaving it wide open cheapens the honor.

    #121661
    Avatar1982 willie
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    well bwalton, I agree with that as far as fans choice. I also like having the committee though I think some of the older players should have been brought out before some of the newer ones. to me the team hall isn’t like the national hall of fame. I don’t look at the same criteria as I do when deciding who to vote for. to me it isn’t really a lot about their numbers or stats. its part of it but only part in my eyes. its why I can vote for a guy like Hendrick who was our sole power guy in a time when most players didn’t go for homeruns. or why I could vote for forsch whose numbers don’t compare to the all time greats but was a great cardinal and represented the team well. now I guess some people do look mainly at their numbers and I guess that’s ok for them but to me that isn’t what a team hall of fame is just for. and boyer14, I wasn’t talking about the numbers who get in every year, I was talking numbers in general. though I think there could be three. I don’t feel its a cheapening of the honor though to have more. it may cheapen it to you as a fan if you think that way. but the positive it does for that former player and the team as a whole far outweighs that in my eyes.

    #122782
    Brian WaltonBrian Walton
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    #122841
    Avatar1982 willie
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    That’s cool info there brian. I believe I had read that somewhere before, but I had forgotten it.

    #123845
    Brian WaltonBrian Walton
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    Voting is now open.

    #123850
    kscardfankscardfan
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    Hernandez and Morris easy choices.

    #123851
    Avatargscottar
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    Tough decision with several worthy candidates but I am going with Tommy Herr and Keith Hernandez.

    #123871
    bicyclemikebicyclemike
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    It’s Tudor and Keith for me. I like all of the candidates, but when you look at the accomplishments as Cardinals, Hernandez outpaces the offensive guys and Tudor does so with the pitchers, although Matt Morris is a solid choice as well.

    I like Big Lee a lot too, and of course Super Steve was ready to dominate, but did so in a rival uniform when Gussie Busch threw a tempter tantrum.

    Will never forget that deal. I was a teenager at the time, and on the surface did not like the trade, but then thought “Well, Rick Wise is pretty good and even a year younger than Carlton. This may turn out just fine.” But then I read the reaction to the deal by knowledgeable baseball men in the Sporting News, and was like “Uh-oh, I think we may have blown it on this one”. 1972 proved without a doubt that we had made a major mistake.

    #123873
    Brian WaltonBrian Walton
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    They told a story on the broadcast this past week that Carlton himself had told them. He had caved into Gussie’s contract demands and was walking down the hallway to the offices to accept, when they met him and told him he had been traded. If he had come in a few hours earlier, the whole decade may have changed. Maybe the next one would have been even better, too.

    #123892
    bicyclemikebicyclemike
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    Yeah, I have heard that story about Carlton agreeing to the club’s terms, but the deal had been done just before he was able to let them know.

    And just to make the deal the complete failure it was to become, the club gave Wise the same amount Carlton wanted. By mid-‘73 the trade looked like it might not be such a bust. Carlton struggled some after his incredible 1972, and Rick Wise was the starting pitcher in the NL All-Star game. But Wise was traded after that season and was a good, not great pitcher for a few years. Carlton went on to set Hall of Fame standards and have a better career than even the great Bob Gibson.

    One thing about Wise that has always been impressive, yet you never hear much about is that he pitched in 25 games including 8 starts as an 18-19 year old with the Phillies in 1964. He was pitching in the big leagues just out of high school, and for a pennant contender.

    In addition to that, he had one of the greatest games in MLB history in 1971, another All-Star season, when he pitched a no-hitter and hit two home runs.

    Rick Wise was no slouch, but he did not have the long-term success of Super Steve.

    #123972
    Avatar1982 willie
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    well I voted for tudor and herr. I changed from morris to herr this year mainly cause I vote older guys in first. Still think morris should get in. It will probably happen this year since I didn’t vote for him. It was interesting to read that herr was the last person to get 100 rbi hitting less than 10 homeruns.

    #126011
    Brian WaltonBrian Walton
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    Some good news this morning…

    #127216
    Brian WaltonBrian Walton
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    #127438
    Brian WaltonBrian Walton
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    Ozzie doing some lobbying… (The correct deadline for voting is May 11, but no reason to wait!)

    #127439
    Avatarbccran
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    Will Keith being traded under a cloud affect the vote?

    #127440
    Avatargscottar
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    Tommy ranks in the top 2 or 3 of my all time favorite Cardinals. I hope he gets in.

    #127445
    Brian WaltonBrian Walton
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    bccran asked:

    Will Keith being traded under a cloud affect the vote?

    Of course. Based on his play and his numbers, Hernandez should have gone in three or four years ago. His results speak for themselves. It is really too bad and when the principals patch things up but others not even involved keep carrying a 35-year old grudge forever.

    Personally, I was really disappointed about the drugs and the trade, too. But it does not change how good he was as a Cardinal. Nor does it matter what he did as Met.

Viewing 25 posts - 201 through 225 (of 326 total)
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