Cardinals Team Hall of Fame

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This topic contains 193 replies, has 19 voices, and was last updated by Avatar GameCard 2 weeks, 3 days ago.

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  • #83291
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    gscottar
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    Hernandez played a little longer in St. Louis than he did in New York and he won a world series in both places. He should probably be in each team’s HOF.

    #83292
    UConn Card
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    Ny,

    Google ‘Keith Hernandez npr interview’ and you’ll get links to a wonderful interview he did on “Fresh Air” last June.

    Hernandez considers himself a Cardinal.

    He’s the best Cardinals first baseman, defensively, that I’ve seen and certainly belongs in the St Louis HOF. Just because he was also successful when playing for the Pond Scum shouldn’t be held against him.

    #83316
    bicyclemike
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    When a player comes up through an organization, and plays for the big club awhile it stays with them. It is not too different from life. We identify closely with the time and place we grew up, and learned about how life works.

    Steve Carlton said something similar at a local SABR event a few years ago. His first exposure to the big league club was watching guys like Dick Groat, Ken Boyer and Bill White and seeing how they conducted themselves, and modeled himself after them to some degree.

    Those experiences take on a special meaning as you grow older, as they “made you who your are” to a significant degree.

    Hernendez learned the game from people like Georg Kissel, and Cardinal veterans like Lou Brock and Joe Torre. By the time he went to New York, he was pretty much his own guy so the impact in his life was not as strong.

    #84093
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    gscottar
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    Someday I hope guys like Tommy Herr and Kenny Reitz get consideration. They were two of my favorite Cardinals growing up. Herr was a smooth operator at 2B and could surprise with the bat. In 1985 he had 110 RBI with only 8 HR while hitting 3rd in the lineup. Reitz was great with the glove. Mike Shannon referred to him as the “zamboni machine.”

    #84096
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    14NyquisT
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    Pass that info onto Mr. Walton…. he’s on the selection committee along with a number of Cardinal notables.

    #84098
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    gscottar
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    Yep, I knew Brian was on the committee. Maybe he can keep these guys in mind but I know there are many names to consider. Herr would probably rank higher than Reitz due to his all around game. Kenny was average with the bat and a slow runner but a great glove man.

    • This reply was modified 8 months ago by Avatar gscottar.
    #84126
    Brian Walton
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    I have voted for Herr among my max allowable 10 in prior years. I am not home now so I can’t check details. Reitz has yet to appear on the radar.

    #84138
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    PugsleyAddams
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    We identify closely with the time and place we grew up.

    We sure do, Mike. I lived in a town (Janesville) near the Wisconsin-Illinois border from age 3-10. Great sports town back in the day. Many areas of Janesville have gone severely downhill over the past 40 years, but I still feel a tremendous attachment. Any time that I travel near to it on business, I’ll make every effort to go hang out there for an hour or so. I’ll sit in my car for a few minutes in front of my old house and reflect back to the day when that dismal old gray tilted basketball hoop over the garage door was bright orange in color with fully intact ivory white twines….that were tickled on countless occasions by ole’ Pugs here. Then I’ll whiz by my old grade school, which surprisingly still looks the same in both size and appearance as when I used to suck my thumb for kicks. The newer neighborhoods when I was a kid are the places that are difficult to recall, as those little stick trees that occupied the lawns have now been transformed into huge hulking old behemoths….which really skews one’s memories. Anyway, I think it’s nice to have such fond remembrances.

    #84194
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    14NyquisT
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    So after age 10, what happened next?

    #84196
    stlcard25
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    Based on my reading comprehension…Pugs stopped sucking his thumb then!! 😂😂

    #84234
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    PugsleyAddams
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    Glad I could be a source of amusement, gentlemen. After age 10? Moved to Milwaukee (Whitefish Bay) until age 13, then moved to Cleveland (South Euclid – Brush H. S.).

    #84415
    Brian Walton
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    #84488
    bicyclemike
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    I do the same thing as Pugs as whenever I am in an area I used to live, I try to stop by the old stomping grounds. I was lucky in that the home I grew up in from age 6 through 18, when I left for college, was also the house my parents grew old in. We just sold it in 2016 after my mom passed away at age 87. So I was there a lot over the years. So the same house that my dad and I would listen to Harry and Jack call Cardinal games in the ‘60s over a crackling KMOX on a summer evening was the place I later watched games on ESPN or Fox in hi-def crystal clear color.

    #85674
    Brian Walton
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    Gibson gets his own street. I dare you to double-park there!

    https://www.mlb.com/cardinals/press-release/cardinals-unveil-honorary-bob-gibson-way

    #85912
    Brian Walton
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    Ben is apparently too young to remember Steve Carlton. They guys he mention aren’t in the same area code.

    #85928
    bicyclemike
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    BenFred is obviously a latter-day fan of the ball club. Many of us know when the opposite was true, where the Cardinals seemed to consistently make bad deals. The ’70s were the worst, but the 1980s, despite the successes, had some real clunkers.

    I was not a big fan of dealing Pham away, and hated giving up Alcantara, but understand the situation surrounding both deals. I am happy to see Marco do well. He is a local area product, and a great kid. Once O’Neill plays on a regular basis, which I assume will be next year at the latest as my guess is Ozuna will be allowed to walk after this year, I think he will even up that deal. Still though, it would be great to have a solid lefty in our rotation. You really do not want to give up good left-handed pitching.

    #85946
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    gscottar
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    The guys mentioned in the article are all doing well but I don’t think you can really fault the Cardinals for trading them.

    Pham: Had some success on the field here but was hurt constantly and very temperamental to deal with to say the least.

    Piscotty: Had one really good year here but then struggled. He obviously was dealing with the stress surrounding his mother so a change of scenery to get closer to home was a good move.

    Marco: Never did much here although he showed promise. I still think that trade will look better once Tyler gets regular playing time.

    Voit: I am as surprised as anyone of his success in New York but he was never going to get regular playing time here, especially not with Goldy here now. It would have been nice to have gotten a player better than Shreve but who could have predicted that Voit would suddenly become an all star? I suspect the Yankees are as surprised as we are.

    Grichuk: He was given many many opportunities to start here and could never seize the opportunity because of his poor OBP. I’m glad we aren’t paying him $52M.

    #86814
    Brian Walton
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    #86815
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    PugsleyAddams
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    Just voted for Tudor and Morris…..with a special tip of the cap to Hernandez.

    #86820
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    Bob Reed
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    “Grichuk: He was given many many opportunities to start here and could never seize the opportunity because of his poor OBP. I’m glad we aren’t paying him $52M.”

    The following career numbers are from Fangraphs, a couple days back. See if you can guess which one is Cub star Javier Baez and which one is underachieving & undisciplined hitter Randal Grichuk.

    Player A is 27 years old and has accrued 9.3 WAR in 1,877 MLB plate appearances.
    Player B is 26 and has accumulated a total of 9.9 WAR in 1,940 PA’s.

    Player A has a lifetime wRC+ of 110, strikes out 29% of the time, and walks 6% of the time.
    Player B has a lifetime wRC+ of 103, whiffs 28% of the time, and walks just 5% of the time.

    The answer of course is that it doesn’t matter much at all which is which, since they’re more or less identical in terms of age and production at the MLB level. (Not saying I wouldn’t rather have Baez — middle infielders are tougher to find than outfielders. But the point is that Grichuk has had a good career so far, and should be good going forward. I think Toronto got a relative bargain.)

    #86830
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    PugsleyAddams
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    Good point Bobby, but I’m not sure if Grichuk is Cardinal HoF worthy…..or eligible.

    #86967
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    RememberDiz
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    I’m still not over the Wally Moon for Gino Cimoli trade.

    #86971
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    gscottar
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    I like your stats Bob but one of those players finished 2nd in MVP voting last year and the other one didn’t.

    #86973
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    gscottar
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    Randal’s OBP this year currently sits at .261. Yikes.

    #86986
    BlackHillsCard
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    Not sure how anyone could call a .297 career OBP a bargain.

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