Player Payroll/Budget

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  • #150243
    Avatargscottar
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    The Cardinals certainly hold their own with the “big boys” when it comes to overall revenue so even if the Cardinals are technically not in a “large market” based on population an argument could be made they are a “large revenue” team, which is something to be proud of instead of run away from.

    I don’t know what Tampa spends on scouting and development but they certainly seem to win their share of trades. It is uncanny how they do it.

    #150245
    Avatargscottar
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    One other thing I would like to add is when I praise another front office it doesn’t mean I am a fan of that team or I am being disloyal to the Cardinals. I like studying businesses to see what the successful ones are doing or not doing, whether it is baseball or not.

    The Cardinals were considered to be the model MLB franchise about ten years ago and hopefully they can get back to that. Their model the last few years have been try to build a 87-89 win team each year. That is not a terrible model but isn’t very exciting. The plusses are:

    1. A winning season each year.
    2. It creates enough fan interest to keep the turnstiles turning and the revenue coming in (unless something like covid happens).
    3. It puts you in a position to be in the playoff hunt so if you get in and get hot you might go all the way.

    The downside is that a LOT of things have to go right to win a championship.

    So if you see me praise someone like Friedman, Epstein, Cashman, or Neander just remember that even if I have something good to say about their business practices I could care less if the Dodgers, Cubs, Yankees, or Rays ever win another game.

    I want the Cardinals to learn from their mistakes and get back to being the model franchise.

    #151767
    Brian WaltonBrian Walton
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    Today is the day that financial positions for the arbitration-eligible players are shared. In some cases, deals may be announced.

    From our Monday team notebook:

    1/15/21 Deadline for teams and arbitration eligible players to submit salary figures. The Cardinals have five arbitration eligible players – CF Harrison Bader and RHPs Jack Flaherty, John Gant, Jordan Hicks, and Alex Reyes. All but Gant are first-time arbitration eligible. Gant, who is in his second year of eligibility, has already reached agreement with the Cardinals on a 2021 contract, avoiding arbitration. John Brebbia was originally in this group as well, but was instead non-tendered and has since signed with San Francisco. Hearings will occur in February for players who have not yet come to terms with their employer.

    #151817
    Avatargscottar
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    I guess we can expect Flaherty to go to a hearing for sure.

    #151818
    Brian WaltonBrian Walton
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    I would be stunned if that does not occur.

    #151823
    jj-cf-stljj-cf-stl
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    MLBTR has Reyes agreeing to 0.9mil and Gant at 2.1mil

    #151824
    Brian WaltonBrian Walton
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    Gant’s deal was announced several weeks ago. Reyes would be new news.

    #151825
    stlcard25stlcard25
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    They estimated $1.0-1.2M for Reyes and $1.5-1.9M for Gant this past fall. Not sure how that falls with others who have signed early, but the estimates they have may be a touch low.

    #151827
    jj-cf-stljj-cf-stl
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    Ok, sorry for the repetition.

    #151828
    Brian WaltonBrian Walton
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    One source:

    #151831
    jj-cf-stljj-cf-stl
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    same source, Bader 2mil

    #151836
    Brian WaltonBrian Walton
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    #151838
    Brian WaltonBrian Walton
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    #151839
    stlcard25stlcard25
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    MLBTR estimated $1.2-1.7M for Bader and $900K for Hicks. Seems like the guys with no health issues have gotten more than the estimates and the ones with some missing time have been less. It would bode well for Flaherty, if he wasn’t super likely to go to arbitration. I’ll be curious what his side submits.

    #151845
    Brian WaltonBrian Walton
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    #151907
    Brian WaltonBrian Walton
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    #151910
    stlcard25stlcard25
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    The midpoint doesn’t really matter, right? I thought one side or the other just wins when you go to arbitration?

    #151911
    BlackHillsCardBlackHillsCard
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    BW,

    Jeff Passan’s numbers from the Cardinals are slightly higher:

    #151921
    Brian WaltonBrian Walton
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    Thanks for the info, BHC. Any feeling which source is correct? The Post-Dispatch said their “sources” indicate $3 MM. Separately, so did Nightengale.

    That may or may not mean anything. I suspect a lot of times the national guys say they have their own sources when they are just parroting each other to make it appear less clear that they were scooped… Just a suspicion that was really locked in when Jon Heyman said he verified Hairston’s casino BS story, then even after it was debunked, he refused to back down and blocked anyone who questioned him.

    stlcard25, you are correct. The midpoint is irrelevant. In the hearing, one side will be chosen over the other – no compromise.

    #151926
    Avatarblingboy
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    An agreement normally happens before the arb hearing actually occurs. And isn’t it normally at or very near the midpoint which ends up agreed upon?

    #151928
    stlcard25stlcard25
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    Blingboy, from Brian’s article, they have a policy that negotiating stops as of yesterday:

    The Cardinals further the resolution process via an organization policy (which many other teams follow as well) set several years ago generically called “File and Trial.” Essentially, the team cuts off negotiations from today forward, instead intending to take the player to hearing next month because there was no agreement by now, rather than continuing to negotiate in the interim.

    #151931
    Avatarblingboy
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    That had slipped my mind. The thinking used to be the org wanted to avoid trashing the player’s qualities in an adversarial hearing since he is their property, and the player wasn’t anxious to have it laid out either. I guess that was the old days.

    #151933
    BlackHillsCardBlackHillsCard
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    Passan has been very spot on the last few years and has gotten some big scoops, but who knows.

    It appears the Cards are foregoing their file and trial approach this year with Flaherty. They wouldn’t have exchanged numbers if they going to do that.

    #151934
    Brian WaltonBrian Walton
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    The new way is to use the threat of a hearing to push the player to agree to terms by the January deadline. It worked except for a baker’s dozen of MLB players, including Flaherty, which was pretty much a given.

    #151936
    Brian WaltonBrian Walton
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    BHC said:

    It appears the Cards are foregoing their file and trial approach this year with Flaherty. They wouldn’t have exchanged numbers if they going to do that.

    That is not how it works. The two sides were required to exchange amounts by yesterday. That is the impending event that caused the other deals to get done.

    Everything I have read and heard leads me to believe the Cardinals are still a file and trial team. And I would be amazed if Flaherty would settle.

    In other words, I would give the odds of a February hearing to be about 99%.

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