Marlins Yelich-Ozuna trade thread

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  • #39671
    AvatarBrianpnoonan
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    I didnt vote for hudson or sierra in the 6-10 range.

    And I just described why.

    Hell I even described why when I did it.

    #39672
    AvatarBw52
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    I dont see how any reasonable fan doesnt like this deal unless that fan is hung up over Yelich.many liked Yelich and he would have been a fine addition BUT he would have COST even more than Ozuna.If said fans are mad because of Ozuna`scost prospect -wise how would those Yelich fans feel when it cost more?I would love to see Yelich in STLOUIS next season but who are you going to trade so he can play? Fowler has his NTC and Pham is flavor of the month.For me trading Yelich for Pham and Flaherty and Mercado would work.

    #39737
    Avatar14NyquisT
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    My deal is that the Cards went out and signed Fowler to a multi-year deal and too much money based on one season… look what happened… we didn’t get the ’16 Fowler and now we have the ’15 Fowler losing his CF position after one season… terrific. Not only that but he will be blocking some younger prospects ready to jump into the Card’s OF.

    I’m not saying that this will happen to Ozuna, but he was obtained with value based on one season. Eerily similar… I don’t want this to be Fowler II, with Ozuna regressing back to prior seasons.

    #39738
    AvatarBrianpnoonan
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    Ozuna has two seasons worth that deal.

    2014 and 2017

    #39764
    Avatar14NyquisT
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    From MLB.com:

    The infusion of talent in this trade has dramatically altered the Marlins’ Top 30 Prospects list, with Alcantara becoming the organization’s No. 1, per MLBPipeline.com. Sierra ranks fifth and Gallen is 15th.
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    In comparison: For the Cards MLB 8-7-17: Alcantara #10 Sierra #7 and Gallen #13.

    #39777
    AvatarBw52
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    Alcantara could be something special if he can harness his control issues.I have read some scouts think he would be better working out of the bullpen instead of starting.Gallen is a bulldog type and i hated to see him go but Cards are deep in young pitching coming up.Sierra doesnt do much to excite.4th OF with speed he doesnt know how to use and good defense.Cards have several others.

    #39851
    AvatarCardinals2016
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    For those worried about Ozuna being a one year wonder:
    P-D Link

    David Schoenfield, ESPN.com: “Ozuna, who is under team control for two more seasons, hit between .259 and .269 his first four seasons in the majors, so there’s certainly the possibility of regression, but there are a few reasons to believe in his performance. First of all, you can really point to his emergence in 2016, when he hit .307/.360/.533 in the first half and started the All-Star Game. He hit just .209 with six home runs in the second half, but he injured his wrist in late June and later missed a week after injuring the wrist on a diving catch. It seems likely that the two injuries affected his second-half production. Aside from that, Ozuna’s plate discipline was a little better in 2017, as his walk rate improved from 7.1 percent to 9.4 percent, and his chase rate in hitter’s counts dropped from 33.3 percent to 23.9 percent. He toned down the aggressiveness, and it paid off.”

    #39887
    Avatarvegasjim
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    I found it interesting Alcantara went right to #1 on the Marlins prospect list. Really puts the variances organization to organization of quality and depth of systems in view.

    Along those lines saw a comment I believe during the Stanton Yankees deal that if the Yankees and Marlins system were combined for a top 30, it would be made up of 22-25 Yankees.

    Makes me wonder how high a Hudson or a Hicks would show up in being ranked if not in such a deep of system.

    #39890
    AvatarCardinals2016
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    Well, Gallen went from #13 in the Cardinals to #15 in the Marlins according to MLB, which I found odd as he is there one piece that seems to have a good chance of contributing this year.

    #39903
    Avatar14NyquisT
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    During the upheaval with additions and subtractions, MLB updated almost immediately. Sometimes their rankings are a little bit…. what, flaky.

    #39904
    Brian WaltonBrian Walton
    Keymaster

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    Vegas, that is why it is good to also watch the national top 100s. It will be interesting to see whether Hudson and Hicks push onto any of those lists this year.

    #39970
    Brian WaltonBrian Walton
    Keymaster

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    Ozuna is 1 of just 7 MLB hitters to reach triple milestones in 2017. (free)

    https://thecardinalnation.com/ozuna-one-of-seven-to-reach-triple-milestones/

    #40756
    Brian WaltonBrian Walton
    Keymaster

    Paid - Annual

    Also from Morosi today:

    Sources: #Marlins engaged in “active trade discussions” with multiple teams regarding both Christian Yelich and J.T. Realmuto. Asking price on both players remains high; a trade is not imminent.

    #41082
    thejagerthejager
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    Realmuto is pretty interesting to me…ive described it before… but if we can snag him that would be a pretty snazzy move…especially if we could move Kelly as a centerpiece in a deal for Colome and Archer

    -Realmuto can legitimately play 1b and catcher (GG level catcher at that)
    -while also being our backup catcher (or timeshare catcher)
    -he provides an even better backup to Yadi if Yadi goes down
    -He is cheap and young
    -hits well with decent power and average
    -woudl slot in nicely in the middle of the lineup
    -having the backup for catcher be a starter at another position is very strategic and valuable for a team with concerns about having enough bench and relievers…we could go 8 and 4 in the pen and bench with all 4 bench players being real hitters….and it maximizes the use of the 25 man…not having any players that “cant” be played

    I love Yelich but i think our OF is set…and has plenty of depth…Realmuto might be a legitimate STEAL for value….he wouldnt be called on to be THE hitter and his nice all around game woudl play well in the lineup and also give it more flexibility

    #41084
    Brian WaltonBrian Walton
    Keymaster

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    I am missing the point here. With so many other needs, why would the Cards focus on adding another starting catcher? If they need a first baseman, then go get a first baseman. There are many of them on the market.

    Realmuto is a nice player, but is not a fit with the Cardinals.

    #41085
    Avatargscottar
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    Supposedly the Cubs are looking into Yelich also by dangling Almora. I’m thinking it will take more than Almora to get him though.

    We know that the Marlins wouldn’t take Fowler off our hands but who among us would trade Pham + prospects for Yelich? I would be very tempted.

    #41097
    thejagerthejager
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    Brian…

    Realmuto can play 1b…he can start there…and he is probably at this poitn an equal of Yadi at catcher as his backup…

    -Realmuto provides the ability to get a good hitter (3.6 WAR, 109 OPS+, 240TBs, .280+ + 15 HRs + decent footspeed on bases)
    – he provides GG level defense at catcher and a MLB ready fill in for Yadi as he ages, and good defense at 1b (when he has played it he has played it well) defensive WAR just under 1 (for a total of around 5 WAR…Hosmer’s total WAR was less than Realmuto’s…Hosmer was better offensively and much worse defensively -1.6 dWAR for Hosmer…even if at different positions…Realmuto’s 3.6 WAR vs Hosmer’s 4.8 and -1.6dWAr makes the discussion about worth valid IMO)
    – also he is 27 and cost controlled and not a FA until 2021….he is in his prime and we dont have to keep him after his prime if we don’t want
    – ha also allows for the trade of Carson Kelly when his value may be highest…and our needs may be highest
    – it also frees up a bench spot without using a reliever spot
    – the money savings lets us still be in play fora big FA next year

    compared to Hosmer he isn’t as great offensively, but he also won’t cost 8 years and 160million….the difference in output vs money invested easily outweighs the difference

    instead of signing Hosmer for huge money and signing Arrieta and Holland for huge money..we may be able to trade for effective replacements without gutting the system entirely…and what we do lose we gain back in cost controlled young players. The loss of prospects is dear but is mitigated by the level of players we get back and the contracts and/or control they have

    IMO Realmuto IS a legitimate target for 1b

    #41104
    Brian WaltonBrian Walton
    Keymaster

    Paid - Annual

    We will have to agree to disagree. Absorbing the cost to acquire a 26-year old catcher just to stick him at first base seems a sub-optimal idea to me. Realmuto is a good-hitting catcher, but would not be a standout first baseman. Career OPS+ = 104.

    #41111
    AvatarCariocaCardinal
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    I wouldn’t trade Pham for Yelich straight up.

    #41113
    AvatarNJ315
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    Let me see Yelich is 26 with a career war of 17.7, he has a nice contract for the next 4 years with a nice option for 5th. Pham excellent WAR last year 6.4, very affordable financially. But 30 at the start of the season, ongoing vision problems and the biggest question is last year’s performance who he really is.

    I will take the younger one who has been consistent in his career. He just turned 26. Pham is a gamble and 4 years older.

    #41114
    AvatarCariocaCardinal
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    And I’ll take the guy who has averaged about 5O% more WAR per plate appearance and should cost $15-$20 million less over the next 4 years for similar production.

    #41115
    AvatarNJ315
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    How do you know that? Pham may be a one hit wonder or he could keep having vision problems. How are you so sure Pham is the real deal? One season??? How productive will he be ages 30-34??

    #41117
    mbusappmbusapp
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    I find it interesting that posters who said we would never see Pham again after he failed to make the team out of Spring Training who now think he is worth a King’s ransom. We could solve all the Marlin’s payroll problems with this trade: Pham, Wong, Flantery, O’Neil and Fernandez for Yelich, Castro and Ziegler.

    #41121
    AvatarCariocaCardinal
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    Well, I am the one backing Pham here I guarantee you I never said we would never see him again. I have always been a Pham supporter.

    If I gave up all that for Yelich, why would I have to pick up dead salary as well?

    #41124
    AvatarCariocaCardinal
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    How are you so sure Yelich won’t revert to a 2.5 WAR player? Why are you so sure Pham that Pham won’t be the 7 WAR (full year) player he was last year.

    I have seen nothing to indicate Pham’s vision is going to get worse. If last year is how he plays with ongoing vision problems I’ll take it. Pham could regress 33% and be Yelich’s equal at a cheaper price. I’ll risk that he wo t regress further than that.

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