- This topic has 461 replies, 43 voices, and was last updated 3 years, 11 months ago by
.
-
Posts
-
Whatever Nightengale means by “weighing in”, the Cards have been linked to Soto by a national writer. So this has its own thread now…
The Washington #Nats have begun fielding preliminary offers for Juan Soto, with seven teams already weighing in, including 3 in the NL West:#Mariners#Padres#SFGiants#Dodgers#STLCards#Yankees#Mets.
The trade deadline is Aug. 2, but Nats will wait unless get the right deal— Bob Nightengale (@BNightengale) July 21, 2022
MLB Network’s Mark DeRosa shared his trade idea:
Would this get it done? Not enough? 🤔 pic.twitter.com/AMLKAuduhE
— MLB Network (@MLBNetwork) July 21, 2022
Not sure what to add that has already been said in the Trades thread but I will summarize my random thoughts.
Soto is a great player.
He turned down $440M from the Nationals.
Scott Boras is his agent.
Highly unlikely the Cardinals would re-sign him after 2024.
The Cardinals desperately need pitching.
I would not gut the farm system for 2 1/2 years of Soto.
I would be in favor of moving some prospects for impact pitching.
Mo hasn’t made a significant deadline trade since 2014 so why is this year different?And no way would I do DeRosa’s proposed trade.
Maybe we should trade for Matt Carpenter. He is currently hitting .337 with a bunch of homeruns for the Yankees.
And I could live with DeRosa’s deal. Soto, according to the experts, is a generational player. If he fell in love with St. Louis he could be a lifer.
r/Esteemed Rat
He might fall in love with St. Louis but would DeWitt fall in love with writing a $400 to $500 million check?
Here is a summary of the situation. Some reports state the Nats want to attach Corbin to any Soto deal. That could complicate matters. It would require less prospects being sent out but would require taking on a massive amount of salary. I am sure the Nats would have to pay some of that down.
Latest On Juan Soto's Market https://t.co/o1IDn1443i pic.twitter.com/5iFdIq1ie0
— MLB Trade Rumors (@mlbtraderumors) July 21, 2022
I think this a typical Boras tactic. Get the talking heads thinking more teams involved who likeLy can’t make this deal. For example, the Padres are trying to get under the salary cap, so unless they cut salary they don’t want to add Sotos salary, much less Corbin’s too. And while the Yankees have a lot of money, they want to resign Judge, and I assume that will not come cheap.
I have always thought when we were bidding on Holliday, Boras was trying to get us to outbid ourselves against this mystery team.
A few data points to consider:
1. The Cards have more top 100 type prospects than just about any team, although with the recent draft other teams will have caught up a bit.
2. This doesn’t include recent top 100 players with a lot of control remaining such as Carlson and Gorman.
3. It also doesn’t include young players who’ve had some measure of MLB success and decent to full control remaining, such as Yepez, Pallante, and to some measure Edman and O’Neill.
4. By this measure, the Cards may have more to offer than any other team in terms of controllable young talent. The rub is how much of it they may be willing to trade.
5. Tha Cards were willing to take on Giancarlo Stanton as recently as 2017, and had a trade framework in place. They’ve also traded for or traded and signed nearly $300M in commitment since then in Goldy and Arenado.
6. It’s not a secret that with all this young talent and guys like Yadi, Waino and others moving on in the next few years, payroll is going to be freeing up. A $30M+ AAV contract is NOT going to break the bank in 2025+, and the salaries would be palatable for Soto til then. Thus, 13 years and $500M would in fact fit into the budget. They could even spend some on pitching. It’s not as unreasonable as one may think.
7. Finally, the Cards know better than anyone the value of having a Hall of Fame anchor for your lineup. Albert singlehandedly made the team immensely better from 2001-2011. Soto would instantly improve the lineup for a decade or better and he the centerpiece to build around for that time. Giving up 4-5 good young players wouldn’t be a back breaker, IMO.
8. That said, the trade is unlikely. We all know that. But any FO that didn’t explore trading for such an impact player at Soto’s age would be pretty malfeasant in their duties, IMO.
I don’t make the deal if Walker is sent the other way. Without Corbin, I might – might go with Gorman, Libby and someone not named Walker – Wynn maybe.
But I don’t see Soto staying here after his current deal ends so I don’t see us as being willing to put a deal together.
We should focus on a decent pitcher or two and not entertain a deal that would gut the system and possibly hurt for many years. I still have trouble watching Sandy Alcantara. Can’t imagine what a Soto deal would do.
Not a chance I’d ever do DeRosa’s deal. I like DeRosa too, but that is a killer. It doesn’t improve their chance at a world series hardly at all for this year or the next 2. It rips apart the future. And then if they sign him it rips apart a limited budget. And he’s not “falling in love and taking a pay cut to stay”.
Hold onto the future. They make that trade they still have a middle of the pack to bottom third pitching staff, and in 2 years they are trying to trade him to rebuild an empty farm system with a pending free agent 36 year old Goldschmidt and 33 year old Arenado and wondering how they don’t turn into what the Nats are this year only a few years removed from the world series.
Trade O’Neill if your moving a OF and make room to give Burleson a chance and I think he’ll succeed.
But most importantly add a SP and a middle to late RP. That’s what’s needed.I agree that the trade DeRosa offers is way too steep. How about something like this: Cards give up:
Libby – #2 rank in MLB
Malcom Nunez – #10
Julio R. – #20
Yepez
O’NeilThat addresses several of the National’s needs. I may be too cheap with prospects, perhaps Herrera would have to replace Julio for a catcher. I am assuming the Cards would take on Corbin’s salary or part of it anyway. Would this have a chance?
Likely free agency for the 5:
Carlson 2027
Mcgreevy 2029?
Winn 2029
Walker 2029
Liberatore 2028Why lose all these prospects and the control? No way Mo would do this.
They’re not trading for Soto unless he comes relatively cheap. I think that’s possible but only if the Nats are dead set on moving him at the trade deadline. They’re not trading Carlson and they’re not trading Walker.
I’d sure hate to see Winn get traded. That throw he made in the All Star Futures Game was unforgettable. But Edman is really good, also.
I would rather we see what the Reds will need for Castillo than gut the future for Soto. I just don’t see how the Cardinals will be able to keep Soto long term.
Libby – #2 rank in MLB
Malcom Nunez – #10
Julio R. – #20
Yepez
O’NeilNot even close. They want top talent, and rightfully so. BTV has those 5 at a 61.5 trade value to Soto’s 176.8 himself. I understand Soto is a special talent and as I’ve said in other threads trading him now is like trading a young Harper, Trout, and close to a young Pujols. It’s going to take a haul, but I don’t want to see the Cardinals give up what it’s going to take.
I’ll say this, if he publicly said “I want to be a Cardinal and I will sign a 10 year $320 million deal tomorrow there.” I would consider giving Walker, Winn, Graceffo, Hence, O’Neill, Nunez (which BTV says is still 29 million, equivalent to Edman, in trade value light). So I don’t see WASH taking that deal, having internet in 2.5 years of O’Neill, and I definitely don’t see Soto not going to the open market. I think to sign him now would take 15 years and $500-525 million, and in 2.5 years on the open market, who knows where AAV could be and he’ll still command 10-12, maybe 13 year deal, of course depending on how the next 2.5 years go.
perhaps Herrera would have to replace JulioÂ
Those 5 are a 82, which equals Walker and Burleson. And WASH got Ruiz from LAD in the Turner deal at C who’s 23 and starting this year for them. Herrera doesn’t appel to them.
If they could make the trade at a palatable price player wise, would your offer 6 years for 210 mil / 35 mil per year or 5 for 200. Set the bar for bragging rights.
If you can believe the interview with Boras. Soto is wanting a higher annual value than any other player and a stable franchise. This gets him both, and another bite at the apple around 30.
If you can believe the interview with Boras. Soto is wanting a higher annual value than any other player and a stable franchise. This gets him both, and another bite at the apple around 30
I didn’t look up the AAV for the life of the contract, I know Arenado got some lower years that make his AAV lower, but 2022
Scherzer 43.3
Trout 37.12
Rendon 36.57
DeGrom 36
Cole 36
Correra 35.1
Arenado 35
Strasburg 35
Lindor 34.1
Seager 33
If he wants to be the highest paid player the contract is going to be huge. He’s got 2 arbitration years left to be bought out and then the extension. Even if your very conservative and say buying out the years at 20 and 25 then he wants highest AAV AND he’s still only 25 at that point. The Cardinals need to get out and build a whole team and not be LAA with their huge contracts for top players weighing down anything else they can do.Bling couldn’t be more right,
this whole thing absurd
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.