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Basically yes.
If we get a decent deal for a donaldson or similar in the process great… But not at the expense of creating another matt adams situation.
I still think we can “go for it” this year if we simplify a bit. Next year put reyes and weaver in the pen all year and a few other minor predictable moves to move us forward.
All you need is a straw (or two) to stir the drink. With more assets it is doable without sAcrificing your future.
Point being they’ll want Gyorko to bridge the gap until Vlad Jr is ready. So it will have to be him as the centerpiece. And I agree you might as well try and see what else you can pry from them as well if you do it.
Hey man if the price is right you make the deal. Go for it in 2018 at worst. If we can’t contend with him this year you can trade a couple guys at the deadline this season and recoup the prospects you lost.
If they are negotiating with the Jays for Donaldson, they should keep in mind that, if Donaldson comes to the Cardinals, he will be playing 1B, outfield, and probably 2B, besides 3B. Also, it is highly unlikely that he will ever approach the kind of production he has accomplished for the Jays. Every player on this team except Tommy Pham is underachieving, and it seems likely that Donaldson will underachieve, also.
Donaldson’s contract runs out this year, but since he has another year of arbitration before free agency, he would not be a traditional rental.
John Mozeliak says the #STLCards are unlikely to be in the market for a rental, but adds they always have to keep an open mind to things.
— The Kevin Wheeler Show (@WheelerShow101) July 6, 2017
I think this whole rumor got started because the Cardinals like to give the impression that they are buyers all the time, but the reality is, if they are holding to their plan of seeing what the next 4-6 weeks are bringing, there is no way they are considering a deal for Donaldson at this point.
Gyorko, again, has been are only starting player producing both offensively and defensively.
agreed…he isnt really a traditional rental…i think the interest in him lies a lot in that…JD Martinez Frazier…they might fit but they are .5year guys…that’sa rental
but if you arent gonna go rental…then shouldn’t you jump on the deal as quickly as possible to maximize how much of NOt a rental it is?
will be interesting to see what the Cardinals do…buying AND selling is a tough line to tread…
saw that the Nationals were inquiring on Iglesias from the Reds…i’d be in on that too..i figured he wasnt available…
Heyman’s take on the Blue Jays
https://www.fanragsports.com/mlb/blue-jays/heyman-will-blue-jays-trade-big-stars/I suspect that the Cardinals are not going to offer Carson Kelly in any deal, and that will pretty much put the brakes on any big trade like Donaldson, especially since he’s a rental. With the kind of numbers he’s posted in Toronto, its a sure bet that he will want 25-30M/yr. when he hits free agency. Its hard to imagine the Cardinals going that high for any player.
BTW, I am not in the ‘fire Matheny’ corner. I just wish he would figure it out.
I would have no problem trading Carpenter. He really doesn’t play defense well at any position but can play a lot of positions. He is a better fit for the American League where he could DH and be an infield backup. Also he is a late bloomer and those guys usually fade in their early 30’s. Like Allen Craig.
Donaldson was also a late bloomer, becoming a major league regular at age 27. So I am a little concerned with his dropoff this year. I would not give up the farm for him and I do agree we have to clear out the roster duplications to add him.
I would not play Fowler another game in center field. Pham doea a much better job and we have at least 4 guys (Sierra, Bader, Adolis Garcia and Mercado) not too far off. Bader may be ready now.
I would also get Kelly some time at 3rd or 1st base and then bring him up maybe in August. They are giving him quite a bit of time off at Memphis and playing Rosario. he could spend some of that time working on other positions. We are having to play Fryer too much and I would rather have Kelly getting experience. I don’t think Kelly was that bad at third base but that the organization thought he would be a better catcher.
Voit is intriguing but I think he goes back down when Wong returns. Ultimately, he will probably leave the organization in a trade or as a free agent. I don’t understand why he has been rated so poorly. His at bats are better than most of the Cardinal regulars. Doesn’t swing out of the zone so much and seems to have a pretty quick bat. But it would be a huge risk to rely on him for a full season at this point.
Having him platoon with Adams would not have been a bad idea. If the Cardinals become sellers then it would make sense to give Voit some serious time.I am not commenting on this tweet other than to note that it seems to have a lot of people riled up.
I'm hearing insight of serious progress in Cardinals' quest to acquire Josh Donaldson. Nothing yet final yet, though.
— stlCupofJoe (@stlCupofJoe) July 7, 2017
For all we know it is gyorko and spare parts for donaldson which would at least try to nix any argument I have about roster clutter.
Patience as always… Like others implied in another thread they could still deal oh and lynn etc afterwards. I just dont want to see a matt adams happen. Beyond that willing to see what happens.
(I know I originally flipped at the idea but a 6 war season would even out a lot). If we pair him with another player or two anyway…
Looks like some retrenching.
No update on this one. No, I wouldn't have tweeted this without serious assurances, but looking questionable now.
— stlCupofJoe (@stlCupofJoe) July 8, 2017
Have the Cardinals been linked to a trade prior to it happening recently?
It seems like most of the trades aren’t known about until they happen…That’s part of the reason I discount the Donaldson trade rumors (and the fact he only has one additional year of control and 3B is our best position this year)…
That’s a good point Cards16….. the trades that are done here usually come out of nowhere. Maybe our new GM will be different but I doubt it with Mozeliak in the same office complex. Sabe.
There’s an article on the Scout MLB homepage that gives a couple of trade ideas, one is for Donaldson to the Cardinals for RHP Reyes, SS Perez, and RHP Alcantra…I almost broke out laughing at how absurd that idea was…
i can see why it makes sense to someone…but it seems heavy for a 1+ rental
How about Flaherty instead of Reyes….Diaz instead of Perez..leave Alcantara in
more than most would want to give up…but is still manageable
Donaldson leaving after 2018 pretty much guarantees us a good compensation pick…so that player would hopefully replace Sandy or Jack down the road…Diaz is value controlled and is a good buy low option….Jack and Sandy are both exciting…and highly rated
the star power of Donaldson alone means we have to give up more than will be comfy…no matter the production this season…
I think we can replace Sandy and Jack though it does sting …and i think Diaz is already looking pretty replaceable with DeJong tearing it up
still i dont see anyone near Donaldson in producing fear in the batting box anywhere in our system…that has a lot of value…
Time to dust off this thread. Bob Nightengale just tweeted this.
The #STLCards, who badly need a slugger in the middle of their lineup next year, are expected to strongly pursue #BlueJays 3B Josh Donaldson
https://twitter.com/BNightengale/status/913790385629081600
(As a reminder as we head into the off-season, our policy is to start new threads on free agents or trades ONLY when the rumors come from a credible source. Poster ideas go on the pinned thread for general trade and rumor discussion. Thanks.)
As it was during the approach to the trade deadline i would imagine it would be a steep price, but one that is needed.
Where’s your hole?
C – Set – Molina/Kelly
1B – Set – Carpenter/Martinez/Voit. Carp’s numbers are still good. Upgrade would only be marginal.
2B – Set – Wong/Valera backup
SS – Set – DeJong – what a delight.
3B – Possibly set – Gyroko/Wisdom backup. Upgrade possible, but only marginal over Gyorko’s numbers.
LF – Set – Pham – 20/20
CF – Set – Fowler by contract. I don’t think you could move him if you wanted to.
RF – Competition – Piscotty/Grichuk/Martinez/Bader/O’NeillThe Cards are in the top 1/2 of all teams in MLB in runs scored. They rank 13th. The Cubs rank 4th. The Baby Bears scored an average of 2.4 more runs per week than the Cardinals.
This season was held back mostly by Waino, Leake, Rosenthal, Oh, Cecil, Socolovich, Siegrist, Broxton, etc.
They should strengthen the pen over the winter and take a long look at O’Neill at ST. He’s your big bat in waiting, and you don’t want to block him.
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