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Pretty astounding that they couldn’t have gotten something for a guy who went 12-7 with a 3.37 ERA in a trade. I can’t understand the logic by the Reds.
I agree. Miley put up a WAR of 6.0 in 2021. Why not just exercise the $10M option then trade him? It makes no sense.
Cubs To Sign Yan Gomes https://t.co/XNHEncXfgc pic.twitter.com/gSZkg71Exk
— MLB Trade Rumors (@mlbtraderumors) November 30, 2021
Cubs Nearing Agreement With Clint Frazier https://t.co/zLcTjS5hbc pic.twitter.com/hSVrk3HXei
— MLB Trade Rumors (@mlbtraderumors) November 30, 2021
Cubbies make a big move.
CHICAGO! @Cubs
— Marcus Stroman (@STR0) December 1, 2021
Stroman on the Cubs. Somehow that seems right. It won’t be quite as enjoyable as seeing Jose Lima go up in flames but I’ll take it. Wisdom and Schwindel are not exactly the strong defensive guys you want for Stroman’s ground ball tendencies and I don’t even know who is at SS.
Marcus Stroman signed a three-year, $71 million contract with the Chicago Cubs that includes an opt out after the second season, sources tell ESPN. He’ll make $25 million in 2022, $25 million in 2023 and $21 million in 2024. It includes $2M escalators for 160 IP in ‘22 and ‘23.
— Jeff Passan (@JeffPassan) December 2, 2021
Even at that price, I’d have been a fan of the Cards going after Stroman. I don’t think he will be awesome in Chicago, but he’d have been a game changer in St Louis. The Cubs are quietly inserting themselves right back into the thick of the NL Central. With a couple of more signings, I might say they are better than the Cards.
I am very surprised they were able to get Stroman on just a 3 year deal. The AAV is obviously high but that is still a smart deal for the club. It limits your long term exposure.
stlcard25
Even at that price, I’d have been a fan of the Cards going after Stroman. I don’t think he will be awesome in Chicago, but he’d have been a game changer in St Louis. The Cubs are quietly inserting themselves right back into the thick of the NL Central. With a couple of more signings, I might say they are better than the Cards.
It isn’t a smart move for the re-building Cubs.
I don’t see them getting much better than being a .500 team. They got some great production out of journeymen Ortega, Schwindel, and Wisdom this year so unless they’re spending half a billion more on FAs, I can’t see them even becoming a mid-80s win team.
To get there even, they won’t go after a shortstop with Hoerner there. Maybe they could go after Castellanos and Bryant or something and then get another couple pitchers like Rodon or Kershaw.
More likely, they want to see what they have with Madrigal and Hoerner in the infield and Davis and Velaquez in the OF. They obviously signed Gomes with the intent to trade Contreras.
With a couple more signings, I might say they are better than the Cards.
I don’t think Ted Williams and Cy Young would even get the cubbies within a few games of us by season’s end, StlCard25. Their work is very much cut out for them.
And Marcus Stroman. Not that it makes a big difference (see Billy Wagner). I was surprised to see how short in stature Stroman is…..5’7 & 170 lbs.
* I just goggled Billy Wagner and he’s not as short as I thought he was. We all know who the shortest every day player was in MLB history, as he played in our fair city. But I wonder who the shortest pitcher was? Might be a question best left for Skippy J. and all of the fine folk over at the esteemed Elias Sports Bureau.
After the trade deadline in 2021, the cubs went 20-36 and were outscored by a stupefying total of 104 runs. They’d need three Marcus Stromans just to get to .500, in my unhumble opinion. It’s still an awful roster right now. (Just like the Texas Rangers and their big improvements, we gotta keep the starting point ever in mind.)
And moreover, I think Mr. Stroman may be overvalued in some corners of the internet. Here are the 2022 Steamer projections for Stro and Steven Matz:
M.S. 4.09 ERA, 3.95 FIP, 188 IP, 3.0 WAR
S.M. 3.91 ERA, 3.99 FIP, 161 IP, 2.5 WARSo, at least as far as one forecasting model is concerned, either Marcus Stroman is a radical overpay, or Steven Matz is a terrific bargain. Or both.
I wonder if Stroman is designed to put some star power back into the team and soothe upset fans a bit. It surely did not move the Cubs from non-contender to contender.
And moreover, I think Mr. Stroman may be overvalued in some corners of the internet. Here are the 2022 Steamer projections for Stro and Steven Matz:
M.S. 4.09 ERA, 3.95 FIP, 188 IP, 3.0 WAR
S.M. 3.91 ERA, 3.99 FIP, 161 IP, 2.5 WARSo, at least as far as one forecasting model is concerned, either Marcus Stroman is a radical overpay, or Steven Matz is a terrific bargain. Or both.
I can’t get a bead on Steamer this year. They seem overly optimistic on some and pessimistic on others. BRef has them as such (I don’t see WAR or FIP)
Stroman-3.42 ERA, 150 IP, 1.213 WHIP
Matz-4.37 ERA, 142 IP, 1.352 WHIP
In a neutral environment, I agree with those numbers. I think the ballpark/defense of each team will probably adjust it a little. For Matz it may adjust a lot. Put me down for the IP for Steamer for both (maybe a little less for Matz) and ERA around 3.20-3.50 for Stroman, 3.70-4.00 for Matz. What’s the value of that? I dunno if it’s 2.5 times, but I’d have been fine with offering Stroman $20M a year.
I wonder if Stroman is designed to put some star power back into the team and soothe upset fans a bit. It surely did not move the Cubs from non-contender to contender.
Probably so but I don’t think this is going to be a complete tank job like they did last time. I expect them to add more after the CBA fiasco concludes, possibly someone like Correra. They certainly have the payroll room to do it.
As of right now:
1B Schwindel
2B Madrigal
SS Hoerner
3B Wisdom
LF Happ
CF Ortega
RF Heyward
C Contreras
DH FrazierSP Hendricks
SP Stroman
SP Miley
SP Alzolay
SP MillsI have no idea about their bullpen.
As constituted right now they could be an 81 win team if everything went right but they don’t have a lot of depth to cover injuries.
gscottar
Probably so but I don’t think this is going to be a complete tank job like they did last time. I expect them to add more after the CBA fiasco concludes, possibly someone like Correra. They certainly have the payroll room to do it.
Bob Reed is right. I think they are in for a world of hurt as a lot of their production in 2021 came before the trade deadline (Kimbrel, Bryant, Rizzo, etc)
Tanking-wise, this seems like the 2012 offseason when they went out and signed Edwin Jackson to that 4-yr deal (Stroman), along with Feldman (Wiley), and still had Garza (Hendricks) and Samardzija (Alzolay) under contract…
They traded all four of those starters, getting some really good talent back like Edwards, Olt, Ramirez, Arrieta, Strop, Russell, Straily, and McKinney to go along with ’13 and ’14 draft picks ~ Bryant and Schwarber.
I would agree that what the Cubs have done so far does not make them an equal with the Cardinals.
However, what they have done so far leads one to ask two questions:
1. Are the Cubs done acquiring “significant” talent from the outside for 2022?
2. Are the Cardinals done acquiring “significant” talent from the outside for 2022?
The answers to those two questions could have an effect on the dynamics of the NL Central for 2022.
If/when the Cubs sign Correa maybe the perception will change. Assuming they are tanking and will stink again could be a mistake.
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