Cardinals’ Off-season Needs

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  • #143758
    stlcard25stlcard25
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    Either O’Neill or Carlson will be the left fielder. I’d guess Carlson, since the club seems to highly value Bader’s defense in CF. Unless the club can purge Fowler somehow, I just don’t see room to add a starting LFer next year unless you’re interested in blocking Carlson’s playing time.

    #143761
    jj-cf-stljj-cf-stl
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    The manager penciling in the same lineup every postseason game says a lot.

    #143765
    Brian WaltonBrian Walton
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    stlcard25 said:

    I just don’t see room to add a starting LFer next year unless you’re interested in blocking Carlson’s playing time.

    What makes you think Bader is a higher priority than Carlson? They have to improve the offense somewhere. If it isn’t the outfield, I don’t see where it will be.

    #143767
    stlcard25stlcard25
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    What makes you think Bader is a higher priority than Carlson? They have to improve the offense somewhere. If it isn’t the outfield, I don’t see where it will be.

    He isn’t. Fowler will be starting. If we are picking up a starting LFer, then someone’s time is going to get cut. Carlson will lose some PT, Bader will lose a ton and O’Neill may as well be sent packing. It’s the unfortunate problem when your front office has painted themselves into a corner with the payroll.

    #143768
    jj-cf-stljj-cf-stl
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    Anyone know of a DH ruling for 2021? NL teams will need to know immediately after the world series, just to do business.

    • This reply was modified 5 months ago by jj-cf-stljj-cf-stl.
    #143770
    Brian WaltonBrian Walton
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    My assertion is that Carlson is NOT going to lose playing time in ANY 2021 scenario. If they get a better LF, then Carlson is your every day CF.

    #143771
    Avatarbccran
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    Bader and O’Neiil, as Brian says, weren’t in the starting lineup in SD. So it’s highly unlikely they’ll be there in 2021. Especially the platinum sombrero man. The 3 minutes between pitches guy.

    #143772
    Brian WaltonBrian Walton
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    jj asked:

    Anyone know of a DH ruling for 2021? NL teams will need to know immediately after the world series, just to do business.

    Until it is added, it is not. I’ve seen no talk of any immediate negotiations between owners and players, so anything happening that fast seems unlikely to me.

    I do get the urgency in terms of free agents and roster planning, but the owners might be fine with anything that slows the market (just my speculation). On the other hand, if I am Marcell Ozuna or Nelson Cruz, for example, I want the DH to stay for everyone all of the time.

    #143773
    stlcard25stlcard25
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    That’s fair enough, Brian. I guess we will find out.

    #143774
    stlcard25stlcard25
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    Bader and O’Neiil, as Brian says, weren’t in the starting lineup in SD. So it’s highly unlikely they’ll be there in 2021. Especially the platinum sombrero man. The 3 minutes between pitches guy.

    I guess you maybe didn’t notice, but Bader started all three games in San Diego.

    #143775
    jj-cf-stljj-cf-stl
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    So until we hear different, we’re currently back to Carp at 3B, and Edman as the super utility, OR, Carlson to CF and Edman to LF.

    If Shildt has to choose between Bader and Edman, for playing time, I’d expect him to choose his #2 batter instead of his #8 batter.

    And our “Offseason Needs” don’t include DH.

    #143776
    Avatarbccran
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    You’re right, 25. Sorry. He was 1 out of 9 with that platinum sombrero in game one.

    #143777
    Avatarbccran
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    Can a player actually have a .293 OPS, 25?

    #143778
    stlcard25stlcard25
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    Sure. Let’s talk about next year’s team, though. You’re hoping for old man Brantley and no more Bader. We’ll have to see what direction Mo goes. He’ll have to be creative to fit anyone in with the salary constraints. If fans can’t come back it may be trouble.

    #143779
    Avatarbccran
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    Brantley is 33 right now. Beltran was 35 when he came to the Cards. Berkman was also 35.

    #143780
    jj-cf-stljj-cf-stl
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    No DH suggests B Millers iron skillet of a glove is gone. Was a good signing.

    #143783
    jj-cf-stljj-cf-stl
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    His final two seasons in CLE, Brantley posted a very good 118 ops+. As a FA he signed for 2/36mil with HOU, 18mil AAV.

    His two seasons in Hou were even better, with a 126 ops+, and now he’s a FA again. He’s due for another very nice contract. If DeWitt decides to bump the player budget to cover all of Brantleys next contract, I sure wouldn’t mind. I just don’t see it as realistic in this environment.

    #143784
    AvatarPugsleyAddams
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    He was 1 out of 9 with that platinum sombrero

    Much much has been said of this “platinum sombrero” since it’s occurrence the other night. Might not make for a bad nickname, as it really doesn’t sound like a bad thing. “The Platinum Sombrero”…….. I’d take it.

    #143785
    Avatarbccran
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    Earlier on this thread, McBride laid out the positives and negatives for the 2020 season, with no retort from 25 about only talking about the 2021 season. You almost have to discuss player performances from 2019, a shortened 2020, and the short playoff series to reflect on what should be done for 2021. What else do you have to go on? It seemed fairly obvious that Carlson had some good moments after he was brought up a second time. That probably puts him into the 2021 outfield in CF. Fowler, especially because of his contract, will be in right field. That leaves the third outfield position to Edman, Bader, or O’Neill. Who do you think will get that position? The infield is set except for perhaps a struggling Carp at 3B. So a discussion about next season is pretty much about LF and 3B. The rotation and bullpen are probably set without outside help.

    #143786
    stlcard25stlcard25
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    Edman most likely will play 3B, with Carp playing there some. Edman will also play some 2B and (hopefully) spell Dejong as well to give him a break. As of now, Carlson will start in LF or CF, with Bader and O’Neill getting some time there as well in a rotation. If Mo can massage the budget to get a FA signed, that will impact PT as well. The potential was still there for several guys to get 400+ plate appearances in the OF next year but if the DH isn’t back (seems like the trade of the expanded playoffs the owners want for the DH that the players want would be a smart move) that will really make it tough to find time for either Bader or O’Neill and probably means one will be traded. Bader probably has more value right now, so if I was voting, it would be him.

    • This reply was modified 5 months ago by stlcard25stlcard25.
    #143788
    Avatarforsch31
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    The big difference between what McBride said and you, bccran, is he just laid out a review of pluses and minuses for 2020. He did it 1 time with no expectation of a heated discussion. You have continued to try to get into a denigrating discussion about a certain OF you don’t like. You keep bringing up the most negative points you can just to run him down.

    It’s funny that almost everyone has said that Carlson will be playing a major part in 2021 but you act like posters are saying that Bader is better. What most are saying is that Bader will be playing CF, when he plays. No one is attaching a number of games he will play and most are trying to look at ways the Cardinals don’t have to rely on him. We all want to improve the team.

    End of my discussion on this.

    #143796
    Avatarbccran
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    Thank goodness you’ve ended your discussion on this, Forsch. You and I both know that Bader is no better than a late inning defensive player and possible starter against LHP. That’s it.

    #143797
    jj-cf-stljj-cf-stl
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    Carpenter has ranked 6th most on the roster in PA’s, for both 2019 and 2020. In 2019, with no DH available, he started 106 games and logged 492 PA’s.

    #143800
    Avatargscottar
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    In order for Carp’s 2022 option to vest he needs a combined 753 PA’s between 2020 and 2021. He had 169 in 2020 so he will need 584 next year.

    584 is possible if he has a very productive year but if he continues to limp along hitting around .200 I don’t see how Shildt could justify giving him enough playing time to hit that target.

    #143805
    jj-cf-stljj-cf-stl
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    We disagree on Carpenters 2021 PA’s needed for the option to vest. We know it’s 1100 PA’s total (20-2021), w/a at least 550 PA’s occurring during 2021.

    2020: The pro-rated multiplier for 2020 should be 162 divided by 58 games played (2.7931). That gets our boys to the 162 game equivalent. 169 PA’s, times the multiplier, gives Carpenter 472 PA’s for 2020.

    2021: 1100 PA’s, minus his pro-rated 2020 PA’s of 472, leaves 628 PA’s need in 2021.

    We are disagreeing by 44 PA’s, I’m not sure where they are.

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