Cardinals’ Off-season Needs

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  • #147638
    stlcard25stlcard25
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    Mo will be hunting for bargains.

    You know who are bargains?

    -The guy who had a 115 wRC+ in one partial season and won a Gold Glove in another one.

    -The top 10 prospect in baseball who really started to come on at the end of 2020.

    -The guy who hit so well at the end of 2019 that he made Randy Arozarena expendable.

    Those three guys will cost less than one “Brad Miller,” combined.

    #147647
    Avatar14NyquisT
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    stl-25:

    Carlson will start. Fowler will begin the season as a starter. That leaves Bader, O’Neill and Thomas to fight for one spot. Adding yet another OFer to the mix unless the DH is in play is akin to throwing all three of their careers away. I don’t think the team is ready to do that, so unless they are willing to make Fowler a backup (which I’d personally do), I don’t think an OFer will be added.

    I believe this is the way the FO sees it. Its a sticky situation because O’Neill-Bader-Thomas haven’t stepped up as of yet. And then there’s always that $$ thing.

    #147652
    Avatarmspaid
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    bccran:

    The outfield is bad…sure. But, they need to find out once and for all about O’Neal, Thomas, Williams, Carlson, of course, and any other hot shots from the minors. They can’t do that if an outside person is taking up a slot. Plus, they’re going nowhere next year except to the bottom of the division most likely. So why waste money on an outside acquisition for nothing. Chalk up 2021 as a throwaway year, get rid of all the bad contracts and start a rebuild in 2022. By 2025 they could be ready to challenge the rest of the league.

    #147658
    Brian WaltonBrian Walton
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    nate said:

    Plus, they’re going nowhere next year except to the bottom of the division most likely.

    I will give you 20-1 odds right now this will not happen. (Of course you won’t accept.) Why dilute your points with over the top negative pronouncements?

    #147679
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    The NLC is awful. A lot of prognosticators are saying 85 wins might win the division in 2021. The Cardinals could do nothing else this winter and still be competitive in this division. The front office knows that.

    #147781
    AvatarCard4Ever
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    I hope it isn’t 5 years! I’m already an old geezer, lol.

    #147784
    stlcard25stlcard25
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    Card4Ever…there’s no way it’ll be 5 years. The Cards have the talent to contend for the Central next year and by 2022 should have guys like Gorman, Liberatore, Herrera, Thompson, Oviedo, etc available. That’s in addition to the core of Flaherty, Hudson, Goldy, Dejong and Carlson already there. Hit on one of O’Neill, Bader, Thomas or Montero as a big league regular and supplement with a couple of free agents and you’re well on your way to a Series contender.

    #147791
    Avatarbccran
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    The only difference I have with several other posters is that the Cards went into 2020 with an outfield that had an aging veteran and some untested young guys.
    They didn’t hedge their bets either in the off season or at the deadline. The result was one of the weakest hitting outfields in the major leagues. An outfield hitting 7th, 8th, and 9th in the order.

    You’ve now lost Wong from the lineup in addition to losing Ozuna after 2019. With no significant additions. The team came in last in the major leagues this shortened season in doubles, home runs, and total bases. That’s pathetic.

    With a severely declining third baseman, a young second baseman who hasn’t really proven himself offensively yet, a shortstop who fell short offensively last year, and a true question mark at catcher, what do you really have? Only Goldy is a sure bet.

    Yes, IMHO the Cards will be looking for some Brad Miller type additions in a glutted FA market. Long term contracts? No (unless it’s with Ozuna). One year contracts or ST invites? You bet.

    #147798
    AvatarOnyxgem
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    The only way the Cards contend for the division next year with the team they got now (and we know they are not going to spend any real $$ to make any REAL upgrades) is if the rest of the league decides to rebuild….

    #147800
    stlcard25stlcard25
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    They contended this year with a lineup ravaged by COVID and the most grueling schedule any team has played in at least 60 years, so your point falls short…

    The Cubs and Reds will definitely take a step back next year, and the Brewers may as well. Then you have the Pirates. Like has been mentioned, 85 wins may be enough to take the Central. That’s well within reach. Is it wonderful to think about? No, but it’s what we have to aim at with the lay of the land we have. 2022 can be a 95 win team with the right moves and a little luck.

    #147860
    Avatarbccran
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    Our need is to buoy up our disastrous outfield.

    #148014
    stlcard25stlcard25
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    VEB spotlights Michael Brantley as a possible free agent addition. I’d think there would have to be a DH and a drop in the market for this one to happen.

    https://www.vivaelbirdos.com/2020/11/23/21590972/free-agent-spotlight-michael-brantley

    #148059
    Avatar14NyquisT
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    Staying healthy is the #1 need for the Cards in 2021.

    #148127
    stlcard25stlcard25
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    An article on fits for George Springer:

    https://www.espn.com/mlb/insider/story/_/id/30361565/the-best-mlb-free-agency-fits-george-springer

    They note that the Cards spending is unlikely, but also make this comment:

    Need: The Cardinals were last in the majors in home runs.

    On paper, this looks like a good fit, as the Cardinals haven’t had much offense from their outfield the past two seasons. They would like to give Dylan Carlson a chance to take over center field and they still have Dexter Fowler, Harrison Bader and Gold Glove left fielder Tyler O’Neill around. If only you could take the good parts of all those guys and combine them into one player.

    #148152
    Avatarbccran
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    The scary thing with the outfield being such a risk is what the rest of the team looks like. Take a realistic look at it. –

    C – Unsettled right now, with your solid, foundational rock a free agent. If he comes back, he’s probably going to be sub par offensively. If it’s Knizner, he’s untested.

    1B – Solid as a rock.

    2B – He had an OBP of .317 last season, and a slugging percentage of .368. OPS of .685

    SS – Slugging percentage dropped off last season by almost 100 points. OPS of .671.

    3B – Ouch. OPS of .639. For a 3rd baseman?

    So on the infield, you have 3 out of 4 guys with an OPS in the 600s.

    You simply can’t afford to miss in the outfield. With guys who have already been given a chance and fallen short.

    #148158
    Avatar858booyah
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    We’ll see if anything but a lefty bat to either play inf or platoon in the OF is added.

    #148160
    stlcard25stlcard25
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    So on the infield, you have 3 out of 4 guys with an OPS in the 600s.

    They’ll be 100 points higher next season, most likely. You are completely missing how crushing the schedule and COVID were to those guys.

    #148164
    Avatar858booyah
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    I’m sure covid played a part and the schedule was a another.

    Regardless they add a small piece or two to the puzzle they’ve got to get better production from 2-3 guys.

    #148165
    Avatarbccran
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    25 – Carlson and Fowler are going to get the majority of the playing time in 2021.
    How you you expect O’Neill, Bader, Thomas, and Williams to develop, sharing one spot in the outfield/lineup?

    #148168
    stlcard25stlcard25
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    Regardless they add a small piece or two to the puzzle they’ve got to get better production from 2-3 guys.

    I agree with this. To compete over a full season, you have to have some guys overperform. In 2020, literally every offensive player underperformed, with the possible exceptions of Fowler, Goldy and Miller. Even they were just average. Without playing multiple doubleheaders every week, they should be quite a bit better.

    #148169
    stlcard25stlcard25
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    25 – Carlson and Fowler are going to get the majority of the playing time in 2021.
    How you you expect O’Neill, Bader, Thomas, and Williams to develop, sharing one spot in the outfield/lineup?

    I expect that Fowler will primarily be a bench bat by mid season, opening the door for Carlson to be a RF. O’Neill will be in LF, Bader primarily in CF, and Fowler filling in. Thomas will be in Memphis to start but could fill in CF if Bader struggles. Williams should probably be traded, but maybe he takes over Ravelo’s role if he goes.

    #148170
    Avatarbccran
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    25 – If the virus effected most guys in 2020, why did Bader’s performance improve in BA, OBP, SLG., and OPS?
    The same for Goldy.

    #148171
    stlcard25stlcard25
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    Goldy had an exceptional year, given the circumstances. Still, his OPS+ of 142 was 1 point above his career average. Bader had a good year, which had a lot to do with being put in the situations where he would be likely to succeed. Hopefully he will do the same going forward.

    Still, that’s two guys in the entire lineup. How many regressed or had career worst seasons? I’ll still maintain that the virus and the cramped schedule had a massive effect on this team. It mostly played out in the power and stolen base department, and I think we will see a bounce back next year in both.

    #148172
    Avatarmudville
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    Bader has to be a freak. What else could it be? I guess you would have to say the same thing about Goldy. They’re both freaks.

    #148174
    Avatarbccran
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    We pretty much know that Carlson and Fowler, both switch hitters, will be in the lineup every day. So again, if you have Bader (whom you like) in CF because of his defense, how do you get O’Neill and Thomas enough at bats to really see what you have there. Both are right handed bats, like Bader. Seems like a quandary.

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