Alex Colome trade thread + Longoria + Archer?

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  • #40175
    Avatar858booyah
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    Giants might throw Duggar to the wolves but would they be interested in Grichuk? IT seems odd that the Rays would be interested in him in any deal involving Colome or Archer or both with Keirmaeir, Souza and Mallex Smith, Span ext….

    #40176
    AvatarNJ315
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    That’s your preference. Mine is not pay 30M per year after age 33.

    #40215
    thejagerthejager
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    With taking on Longoria’s reasonable contract no longer a possibility of making a deal with the Rays easier in theory… are we now done with the Rays?

    I hope not…i still want Colome and Archer and we have the guys to get them
    then sign Hosmer once his price comes down a bit (seems already happening) and call it an offseason

    team would be revamped and ready for a good two year push while letting a new crop of prospects mature to replace the ones we have lost

    #40223
    Avatargscottar
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    It totally agree jager. We still need to do the deal for Archer and Colome then sign Hosmer. I would take it a step further and sign Darvish also, which we could afford if we can move Gyroko, Grichuk, and Wacha.

    #40246
    thejagerthejager
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    I disagree about Darvish..i dont see where we have shown any interest in him…and i dont think they want to cozy up that close to the luxury tax threshhold

    Archer Colome and Hosmer would be plenty…then you bank on one of your remaining young starters (after the Archer Colome deal) to pan out long term

    I think CMart Archer is a good 1 2 punch…then Weaver Wacha Mikolas fight it out for being our number 3 with the loser being just fine as a #4… having 2 legit high end at worst #2s and 3 #3’s is a fine strategy for putting together a rotation…doesnt depend on any one player ruining the staff with an injury or down year

    #40282
    Avatarmudville
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    I didn’t realize that Colome got busted for PED’s in 2015 followed by 50 game suspension. Forget Colome.

    #40290
    Brian WaltonBrian Walton
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    I did not recall that either. For grins I went back and looked at the drug. Two Cardinals minor leaguers in 2008 and two more in 2010 were also busted for Boldenone. All four are long gone.

    #40296
    Avatarmudville
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    PED’s degrade the game of baseball, and any game for that matter. Competition is intended to bring out the best in those participating. Production that is based on the use of PED’s is fake. It is dishonest. It is cowardly because the people doing it are afraid to meet the challenge with trust in themselves.
    When a player has mediocre stats then, overnight, becomes a super star, it has to make you wonder. Here are a few links:

    Rob Dibble Tweets Jose Altuve Uses PEDs Or Juiced Baseballs For HRs

    https://wikiurls.com/?https://www.craveonline.com/culture/1283505-steroids-peds-back-baseball

    https://www.nbcsports.com/video/aaron-judges-performance-yankees-shouldnt-raise-questions-about-peds

    #40299
    Brian WaltonBrian Walton
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    Baseball’s testing used to be a joke. It isn’t any more. That doesn’t mean there are not still cheaters, but people who sit back and assassinate a player’s character with absolutely nothing to back it up really make me angry.

    Stan Musial went from a sore-armed Class-A pitcher to a batting champion and MVP in three years. I bet someone would have accused him of using steroids if today’s world had existed then.

    #40303
    Avatarmudville
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    There shouldn’t be any more cheaters. If MLB wanted to make testing foolproof, they could.

    What fries me is people idolizing a player like David Ortiz who got busted for steroids once, then doesn’t get busted again when he hits .315 with 48 HR’s at the age of 40. That just shows that MLB will only bust players that they want to bust when they want to bust them.

    #40305
    Avatar858booyah
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    I agree we will need to pay for the Archer-Colome combo and likely the Rays want Flaherty and Weaver and maybe Kelly at least with someone else. They want ML ready talent and can’t miss prospects.

    #40316
    Avatar14NyquisT
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    Flaherty/Weaver/Kelly for Archer/Colome would set the team back five years. Asinine call.

    #40317
    AvatarOnyxgem
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    It wouldn’t set the team back five years at all. Heck Kelly might not even play here for the next 3 years and no guarantee flar or weaver anything other than ave while archer is a bonidied ace

    #40323
    AvatarNJ315
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    Archer an ace???

    #40326
    Avatar14NyquisT
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    Archer’s ERA WHIP and BA have all gone up in the last three seasons… and he lost 19 games in ’16. That’s who you want for our ace? I wouldn’t give up Weaver or Flaherty or Kelly even up for Archer because they are improving… not going south. Get real.

    #40327
    AvatarCardinals2016
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    Yeah, Archer seems like a #3/#4 type pitcher…I’d rather go with Flaherty…

    #40338
    AvatarOnyxgem
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    Yeah cause wins are what shows if a pitcher is good or something…..

    #40339
    AvatarBrianpnoonan
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    It would definitely set us back. Five years probably not.

    Flaherty will be good, dunno about great. Kelly will be very good and imo trading him is insane. One injury and yadi doesnt get his job back. Catcher is the one position the backup should play 60-70 games per year. Weaver is the same as flaherty to me. Very similar to wacha minus the injury fears.

    … But once again we simply have too many pitchers. What’s the difference in practicality between a 3 and a 4? Not much. A 2 and a 3? More but not much.

    I dont know where the trades stop and start. They will be necessary. I wouldnt touch that one though.

    #40341
    AvatarNJ315
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    No wins don’t tell the story. Look at the rest of his numbers and tell us what is Ace quality about them.

    #40343
    AvatarCardinals2016
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    Archer’s career ERA is 3.63. The last two years, it was above 4.0 His career FIP is better at 3.46.

    His career WHIP is 1.21.

    That’s not ace level. That is #3/#4 starter level.

    Do you want to give up 3-4 prospects for a #3 starter when we probably have one or two (Flaherty/Hudson) sitting in AAA?

    #40347
    thejagerthejager
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    Yes Archer is an Ace. And a move to NL would only make him better. He’s rip through the NL central

    Having to deal with tha AL and specifically the AL eat for your entire career will always move those numbers higher.

    Over 200 Ks pretty consistently while being on a mediocre team with mediocre offensive support is pretty good

    Yes he is an ace. And for the cost he should absolutely be a priority

    Giving up Reyes and Hudson and Kelly with a few others would not set us back 2 yrs let alone 5

    If we trade Kelly we have Knizner long term and we’d sign a veteran FA catcher undoubtedly.

    Also everyone is so concern d about having this amazing catcher backup but no one gets upset about not having a legit backup SS

    Reyes Hudson replaced by Archer and Flaherty and Weaver

    2018
    2019
    2020

    CMart Archer Wacha weaver Mikolas Waino
    CMart archer Wacha weaver Mikolas flaherty
    CMart archer Wacha weaver Flaherty

    We’d have 2yrs to develop the next rotation candidate and even then it’d only be for the 6th starter

    #40350
    AvatarNJ315
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    He is not an ace he is a 2 at best.

    #40370
    thejagerthejager
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    I disagree. And I think across the league he is considered an Ace

    And his performance to contract value makes him worth even more.

    #40371
    AvatarNJ315
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    You can disagree but the numbers show clearly he is not an ace.

    #40372
    Avatar14NyquisT
    Participant

    If they start trading 3 elite prospects for a #3 starter that’s a waste of 3 elite prospects, especially if their names are Reyes-Flaherty-Kelly-Hudson-Knizner. Start with Hicks-Helsley-Fernandez-Mercado-Woodford-Perez…. very good prospects but not quite superior just yet.

    For what we’re paying Wainwright and Fowler this season we could afford a couple of viable players. Let the guys that have gone through our system and are ready for MLB spread their wings. Save money for when all-star caliber FA players become available. But not for one season. If the idea is to trade for #3 starters and having them blocking potential all-stars, that is nonsensical.

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