40 Man Roster at Season’s End

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  • #236499
    Gagliano
    Participant

    Paid - Annual

    Not sure how I forgot VerHagan! Thanks!

    #236514
    Jnevel
    Participant

    Paid - Annual

    We are at 40 total players are the 40-man today (counting those returning from the IL.

    5 days after the World Series VerHagan will become a free agent. 39 total.

    The Cards need to make arbitration offer decisions by Nov 14. I don’t really have a great feel with what they will do with Knizner. I believe they will go ahead and make him an offer but that doesn’t necessarily mean he’s on the team come Spring. My guess is that everyone gets an offer except Jacob Barnes and Jake Woodford. O’Neill is still likely more valuable than that offer and I believe Hudson is too. John King is the only other question mark here. He might be non-tendered. His salary figure would be relatively small though and he pitched solidly for us after the trade so I think they may keep him. 37 total.

    Then by November 17 they need to add Robberse and Kloffenstein to protect them. Remember they may also choose to protect Bedell and Pages, but I am projecting that they do not. I think they’ll also look to quickly sign 1-2 free agent players (1 starter and maybe a reliever). Plus, given our draft position, I think they’ll want to keep 1 spot open for the Rule 5 draft in December. Therefore, I’m projecting 2 additional guys getting dropped off the 40 man to give them enough room. The Buddy King waiver claim is kind of confusing to me because it doesn’t make much sense since we already have several 2B/3B guys with Fermin really being the only one who can backup SS. If it were me, Buddy King would be 1 of the 2. But it’s not me and I have to think the Cardinals picked him up for a reason. So I’m going to project that Wilking Rodriguez gets offered back to the Yankees and that the Cardinals once again DFA James Naile. Conner Thomas, Packy Naughton, Moises Gomez, and John King (from above) are the others that are in the conversation as cuts.

    So in summary, VerHagan leaves via free agency, Barnes and Woodford are not offered arbitration and released, and then by Nov 17, Robberse and Kloffenstein are added and Wilking Rodriguez and Naile are designated for assignment.

    There’s a good chance I’m wrong about someone on the list, but so far so good. I’m really curious to see what happens with the catching situation, who gets added for the Rule 5, and obviously what pitchers get signed or traded for. There are a lot of moving parts that will be happening all at once. It should be a fun ride.

    #236522
    Euro Dandy
    Participant

    Free

    Jnevel, re: your comments on keeping a spot open for Rule 5 draft. Is that just a general thought or are you thinking about specific players who might be left vulnerable and would be a good fit?

    #236523
    Jnevel
    Participant

    Paid - Annual

    Euro, it’s just a general thought due to the fact that we’d get the 5th or 6th selection so it’s an opportunity to add to our bullpen. We usually don’t get to pick until around 18-25.

    I only pay attention to the Cards farm system so I have no idea who might be available. But early on in the Rule 5 there are typically some interesting players because some teams have stockpiled players and they run out of space to protect all of them. You typically are not going to get an impact player but you might get a productive role player for free.

    #236528
    Cardinal in France
    Participant

    Free

    Just out of curiosity, does anybody actually read that John Denton stuff on the official Cardinal website?

    His latest piece of wisdom, “questions for the Cardinals off-season,” is the thumbsucker to defeat all useless thumbsuckers. I know most of these guys are lured away from Pravda to pass their time extolling the Cardinals until overtaken by nausea, but this fella has achieved new lows. The last decent Cardinals writer I can recall was Jenifer Langosch. I assume she has moved on to greater things.

    #236529
    blingboy
    Participant

    Paid - Annual

    I guess it’s his job, CiF. He’s not getting paid to explore whether getting some pitchers this winter will fix what’s wrong, or just kick the can down the road.

    #236531
    Euro Dandy
    Participant

    Free

    Jnevel, thanks.

    It’s no doubt something teams need to stay on top of. Some years the list of undrafted players ends up being more interesting than the list of drafted players.

    #236532
    bccran
    Participant

    Need to cleanse the 40 man of guys who have very little future with the organization. The fillers.

    Barnes
    Naile
    Thomas
    VerHagen
    Fermin

    #236561
    cardsfan64
    Participant

    From the Cardinals transaction page:
    10/30/23 – RHP Jacob Barnes elected free agency.
    10/29/23 – 3B Juniel Querecuto elected free agency.

    #236847
    cardsfan64
    Participant

    #236851
    blingboy
    Participant

    Paid - Annual

    What do we need a UT for? A 2B/LF UT.

    And what did Mo part with for these two guys?

    #236853
    Jnevel
    Participant

    Paid - Annual

    He got Jared Young for nothing and he used the cash he got from sending out Adolis Garcia a few years back to get Riley O’Brien. We will see how that one plays out.

    Honestly though, I’m not sure what is going on. O’Brien makes very good sense. He was effective at AAA last year, strikes out a lot of guys, adds RH depth, and he has options (I think anyway). But first Kennedy and now Young? I’m really not sure where they are headed with these guys. But the good news is they cost us nothing and we can try to pass them through waivers ourselves tomorrow if we want.

    #236858
    Cardinal in France
    Participant

    Free

    This must be Mo throwing his warmup pitches.

    #236863
    Cardinals27
    Participant

    Free

    O’Brien looks interesting, Young doesn’t make much sense.

    #236874
    Nigel T
    Participant

    Paid - Annual

    Young makes sense if Baker, Yepez, and Gomez disappear over the next five weeks.

    #236875
    cardsfan64
    Participant

    And Young bats lefty!

    #236877
    blingboy
    Participant

    Paid - Annual

    Mo doesn’t seem to be positioning to protect a lot of guys. Robberse and Kloffenstein might be it. The next 7 days will be interesting.

    #236888
    Jnevel
    Participant

    Paid - Annual

    Young is a little more interesting than I initially thought after looking into him. He makes more sense than Kennedy did. I think I’d rather have Young over Yepez and maybe over Gomez too. Young has some positional flexibility and he hit really well this past year with both power and average plus he gets on base. I think he’s a keeper at least into next season. Some of the others will have to go to make room for at least 2 Rule 5 guys and at least 2 other open spots for a free agent signing and a potential Rule 5 pickup. I now believe Kennedy will try to be passed through waivers along with Naile and Wilking Rodriguez will be offered back to the Yanks. For the last spot I’m going to go with Yepez. It’s a shame because he once looked to have a lot of potential, but boy did he not show any of that this season.

    #236896
    Brian Walton
    Keymaster

    Paid - Annual

    To me, adding these depth guys on the position player side may suggest they are getting backfill in place for upcoming trades.

    #236946
    mudville
    Participant

    Paid - Annual

    I’d like to know what is NOT being said about Riley O’Brien. If a player is what his stats say he is, then why would Oakland essentially just drop him? Bad attitude? Was 2023 an outlier? Is it that O’Brien appears to be ready for the major leagues, but not really?

    #236950
    blingboy
    Participant

    Paid - Annual

    mud, there is pretty good stats and metrics heavy article, explaining some reasons to like O’Brien. Its lite on the negatives, which essentially are persistent control problems and that it was his 3rd year in AAA. He misses the zone a lot, especially with his secondaries. That usually doesn’t fly to well in MLB.

    https://www.vivaelbirdos.com/2023/11/7/23949600/an-introduction-to-riley-obrien-and-jared-young

    But basically, he fits the profile of what Mo has been going for since the deadline deals, high K/9.

    #236956
    Jnevel
    Participant

    Paid - Annual

    Also, this is a roster crunch thing where O’Brien would be a minor league free agent if he’s not put on the 40-man roster. The A’s have a lot of guys that are similar to O’Brien – depth pieces that may or may not work out. Heck, they collect them like crazy. But they made the decision to let this one go for cash (which they always crave). It’s not a ringing endorsement of O’Brien by any means. But all we need to do is justify why he’s better than the 38th or 39th or 40th guy on our roster and if he is, then it’s a risk worth taking.

    #236958
    stlcard25
    Participant

    To me, adding these depth guys on the position player side may suggest they are getting backfill in place for upcoming trades.

    Hopefully it’ll be an interesting couple of months. The Cards’ roster certainly could use some freshening up after it was an AAAA outfit by the end of the year.

    #237236
    cardsfan64
    Participant

    #237238
    Jnevel
    Participant

    Paid - Annual

    Interesting. I knew there was some chance they would add Pages. Pages has always been one of my personal favorites.

    I suspect this means the team plans to lose one of its big league catchers due to either a trade (Contreras or Herrera) or being cut (Knizner). I think cutting Knizner makes the most sense. We gain a roster spot, add a little money to our free agent budget, and the team is likely better with Herrera catching 50% of the games next season. We shall see what they do, but I fully expect 1 of them to go now that Pages has been added.

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