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I’m truly sorry, Onyx. But talk around and find out what the story is. Do you live in St. Louis? The man pouts when he’s taken out of CF. He pouts when he is taken out of leadoff. He came to the wrong place for multiple reasons and is now unhappy and loafs both at the plate and in the field. It’s a way of showing his unhappiness. That’s not “garbage”. It’s a poor effort for a whopping $16.5 million salary for 8 months worth of work. It’s simply the truth and obvious to anyone who’s playing close attention. Mike Matheny was a team first guy as a player and expects the same from his players. When they are more concerned with themselves it sets a bad example for what Mike is trying to accomplish. Look at what all the Astros players said in the locker room celebrating their championship. They attributed their success to team closeness. All for one and one for all. Until we rid ourselves of several me first individuals on this roster it’s going to be difficult to achieve that unity.
Ugh here we go with more he said she said garbage from bccran who keeps saying he has knowledge inside cards baseball..sure keep telling yourself that….all it is here is your opinion nothing more….far fr from facts!
bccran, if Pham has that attitude and you have an “in” with the Cardinals, why didn’t they trade him in the offseason? They could have received a pretty good haul for him this past winter.
Onyx – if you don’t care for what I post then just don’t read it. Simple answer. Thank you for doing that.
Regarding Pham, his attitude soured when he didn’t get the contract he felt he deserved. His interview with SI was off the charts inappropriate.
I don’t believe his personality changed when he didn’t get his contract. What you have described is a personality trait, not an attitude. The Cardinals should have known how he would react. They have had him in their system for over 10 years.
I don’t buy it. Those personality traits were already present. If they didn’t see them, that’s the fault of the Cardinals front office. They should have seen enough to capitalize on his value this past winter.
30 year old who was drafted in 2006. Injury history including eye issues. Probably more valuable keeping him than trading him. Wouldn’t have gotten much for him, even though he had one good year in 2017.
My two cents – from an outsider without any true inside knowledge on Cardinal management, Fowler does look to be sort of a whiner. He strikes me as a guy who is great on a team that is going well. His baseball personality tends to ebb and flow with his team and surroundings, rather than being steady and strong despite circumstances.
As for Pham, he seems to be a complex character. On the one hand, he is a professional who works hard and really drives himself. I am sure this slump has driven him nuts, and he is probably pressing and trying to force things rather than relax and go with his ability.
But then you have the resentment at not getting an extension after last season. Perhaps that is eating at him some as well, but he seems like a guy that would be all the more driven by that. Still I think his talent will show through and at the end of the season his numbers will be there. Where the club goes with him at that point is anyone’s guess though.
My sense is we will part ways, and Bader will be the center fielder for the next few seasons. We’ll see though. You have to be careful about trading guys because of non-production reasons. Anytime emotional factors become a big part of a trade, your risk of making a bad move increases. The Cardinals know that well, as they have made a couple of legendary horrible deals that were emotion driven (Carlton and Hernandez). If they trade Pham at some point primarily because he expresses his feelings in a bad way, then the chances increase in making a bad deal.
Lot’s of talk on other boards that Mo threw Dex under the bus in a radio interview yesterday. Anyone hear it?
Mo has had a history, as far as I can tell, of keeping himself outside the sphere of blame for a whole number of moves that the Cards have made that haven’t worked out, and even some that have. I remember him saying that he was in favor of trading Pham, and the same thing with the signing of Holland (“outvoted”).
The timing of the comments was poor, to be sure. Dexter has had a seemingly negative reaction to it, as maybe he should. But he’s still been awful this year in every facet of the game and probably should have taken some responsibility for it, himself.
This whole thing feels like it ends up with the Cards dumping Fowler and paying most of his salary. The comments very well could be what gives him motivation to waive his NTC. Hard to expect much in return at this point as his value has completely tanked.
I’m guessing MO’s comments probably were intended to irritate Fowler so he would waive the NTC.
Now he would never admit that but I could see it being a possibility. Mo has since came back and tried to walk back his comments but that doesn’t really change the potential original intent.
I don’t know if this a rare case or not since I don’t follow other MLB teams as much as I do the Cards.
A GM calling out a player that he recently gave a huge contract to, seems to be an awkward and serious situation.
Mozeliak had his (DeWitt’s) pocket picked when he acquired Fowler. At the time of that signing Mo thought he was getting A. a spirited team leader, nope(he’s last one to show up, and the first to leave and now a moper from his pine seat). B. a proven lead off batter, nope (when was the last time he led off and what did he do when he was leading off) C. a defensive wizard in CF, nope (that’s laughable).He brought in Arozarena to be the big slugger from the 4 hole. Well Arozarena started out looking like a complete miss but has worked himself out of that hole and is starting to produce, but is still not the power guy that was traded for. Cecil isn’t what what he was advertised as. Holland is not the closer we needed. Gregerson….. Leone. So he could have gone on with the criticism, but he would only be making himself look worse.
It should be the owner throwing our true GM under the bus, but that wouldn’t help the already rapidly declining faith in our team being abandoned by a lot of die-hard, life-long Card fans. I have read many, many opinions coming from that group that are seriously disillusioned regarding the present team. I’ve read feature stories claiming that the Cards are underachieving and boring etc, etc.
This is not the normal nit-picking that you normally read… this has become flat-out disappointment and apathy thrown in and bordering on despair. I think the GM gets it, he just can’t do enough to right the ship. (not the titanic, yet). IMO, the Cards won’t be active come the trade deadline. We simply don’t have the chips to provide the glaring needs of this team. PLUS…. Mo can’t afford another imprudent move.
Just trying to keep it real.
If Fowler is the last one in the clubhouse before a game, and the first one to leave after a game, and if he refuses to take extra batting practice, while continuing poor play at the plate and in the field, then he is in violation of the spirit of his Contract. The Cardinals should file a lawsuit to have his contract declared null and void. That’s what should be done with Fowler, IMO.
FWIW, Mo is literally getting roasted on MLB radio for his Fowler comments. Not by fans but by the commentators.
A lot depends with what has been said previously in private. If they have already spoken several.times privately with Fowler and his behaviors haven’t changed then going public might be somewhat justified.
can someone post the link to the article or info that shows the Fowler is the first to leave and last to get to there for practice etc.?
Also, a link to the one about him not taking batting practice
I am fine for believing these things if they are true but I am curious if anyone has there original source as sometimes the truth gets occluded in repetition
Thanks in advance
thejager – Everyone knows that bccran cannot reveal his source. There’s nothing unusual about this. Other reporters (i.e. the ones who get paid for reporting) often refuse to reveal their source. What it boils down to is ‘Do you really think cranny is making it all up?’ Personally, I don’t for a minute think he is making it all up, and I really don’t care who is leaking the information to him.
If MO is getting roasted on MLB radio, I suspect that Fowler is putting the commentators up to it. IMO, its looking more and more like Fowler wants to get fired by the Cardinals so he can retire from baseball and spend his stolen money on the good life.
What is the original source not necessarily WHO told whoever who reported it, but WHO reported it in the first place and where is that link?
Also, if Fowler really is last to arrive first to show up that seems pretty easily confirmed by the reporters (at least for who leaves first after a game)
I personally dont believe ANY player is first to leave or first to arrive all the time… it is just a hyperbolic storyline used to stress a point in favor or against a player to emphasize whatever the opinion being expressed is stating
So…either link to the facts as far back as that can be proven or stop using those statements as facts to validate opinions
if it isnt hyperbolic then show me the facts even if those “facts” are someone “saying” that is what they see and then putting it on twitter or in an article
im only going to believe 3rd or worse hand information so far…so i am only going to give credence to any opinions based off of that information so far as well
if someone cant post the links to the information I am not going to consider ANY of those arguments at all
if someone wants to base their opinions on bad information that is on them but no one else has to consider bad information any kind of “proof” or justification for whatever they say
show me the facts and i will reconsider and reevaluate…without them it’s just talk
and the fact that such a hyperbolic statement is being used so literally i am already extremely skeptical
All you have to do is look at the way Fowler is playing and you must know something is very wrong. Or, are you so naive as to think he just can’t find his mojo, and that’s all that’s wrong with him? I don’t believe everything I read and everything everybody says. But I find it really hard to imagine that bccran is making it all up. And if he’s not making it up, then ‘what’? Also, I’d be willing to bet that you give credence to opinions all day long whether you are aware of it or not.
TJ –
There are other people on here who know people in the organization. They pass things along but probably guise it better. They’ll state it as their opinion. They’re smart to do that. If I hear something that I think dispels or substantiates one side or another of a discussion on this forum, I’ll add what I’ve heard in a more direct manner. I’ve never started a new thread to report something or pass along something.
That should tell you something.
I passed along the issues with DF before they ever came to light (on an existing thread).
What I passed along was unfortunate, but true as you can now see.
Again, if I pass along something that you don’t believe (or don’t care for), just ignore it, think less of me if you must and move on. Thanks very much.As many of you know, I’ve moderated versions of this board going back to a time that predates Brian’s involvement – the Fanhome days. (Wow, am I feeling old!)
Cranny also goes back that far. (How old are you feeling, cranny?). The same questions arose then as they do now – How does he know what he claims to know, etc?
A fellow mod whose integrity I trust 100% (no longer around) gave me enough information to satisfy me that cranny’s info is sound.
Like anything else, info can become obsolete & baseball has a lot of moving parts so info can change fairly quickly.
But I have yet to find Cranny making stuff up.
Dexter, Aliya, and Naya welcome Ivy Noor Fowler into the world. Congrats Fowler Family! pic.twitter.com/5pCxBkfLHR
— St. Louis Cardinals (@Cardinals) July 3, 2018
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