So what are we going to do?

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  • #174774
    Mrperkins
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    I don’t see Sosa as a full time starter in the league. I think we should employ him in utility manner while he is cheap a couple years and let someone else pay him after that. Is Garcia still controllable? I’m not really confident in him or McFarland repeating their success. I’d like to see one good lefty added to pen. I don’t trust Kim and his back. I would do sherzer at 2 and 35mm

    #174776
    bccran
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    Forsch –
    Not trying to compare them as players, but Lou Brock’s OBP his first full season in the majors was .300.

    #174779
    forsch31
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    Actually, in 1962, Brock had an OBP of .332 as a leadoff hitter. He had over 400 plate appearances, of which most were as a leadoff hitter.

    Notice, I did include Edman in the lineup with the caveat that if he gets his OBP up, he should be the leadoff hitter.

    #174780
    blingboy
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    Its easy to lose sight of the fact that our lineup stunk most of the year.

    #174781
    ZTR
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    So, is the consensus on here that Sosa is NOT the every day SS?

    If we picked up either an every day SS or an every day 2b and kept both Edman and Sosa that would cover the minf…

    If we stand pat I like Bling’s suggestion if splitting leadoff between Edman and Carlson to maximize the splits….(of course 1/2 way into the game if their SP is relieved by an opposite throwing pitcher…)

    Better find Molina’s replacement and get him groomed. I would think they will play close to 33% of the season?

    I agree with earlier comments that the bench can be stocked from within maybe adding one veteran bat.

    I’m not convinced Flaherty, Mikolas, Hudson, & Kim will ALL stay healthy – if fact I’d bet one has a long stint on the DL and one is off and on the DL.

    Wainwright may pitch like he’s 28 again or he may pitch like he’s 41.

    Happ / Lester are older than dirt too and at best one of them will be a serviceable 5 / good locker room guy (along with Molina & Wainwright).

    So, unless there are a couple of minor league pieces that we KNOW will be ready I’d like to see them at least try to grab a front end starter but, failing that, at least add one middle rotation guy.

    It feels like they have enough pieces to cobble together a pretty good bullpen so long as the starting rotation does not disintegrate again.

    #174782
    Cardinal in France
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    Bling: That’s what worries me. All season I was saying this team looks pretty good on paper, and they revealed themselves merely mediocre, an offense that just couldn’t hit on all cylinders. Then came the last three weeks that got us all excited again. I really like these guys for the most part but I fear that without significant change we are setting ourselves up for another season of disappointment. The question is, which team is the real team, the pre-September team or the exciting run to the end.

    #174783
    blingboy
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    The possibility of Edman playing SS everyday has been mentioned, but I hope most of us can agree that nobody moves a prospect coming up off that position without good reason.

    I have no feeling for what the organization thinks about playing Sosa at SS full time next year. The pressure got to him some in the WC game, but he seemed playable aside from that. His bat seems adequate.

    Another unknown is what the organization thinks about Gorman’s glove at 2nd base everyday in MLB. It would be remarkable if they took Edman’s 2B defense off the board, so that factors in. Gorman as a DH is going to depend upon how much trouble he has with the shift as a lefty batter. I have no info to base an opinion about that.

    #174784
    Cards667
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    I think of Sosa as Aledmys Diaz. He’s not an everyday guy, good utility and serviceable short term fill in.

    #174787
    Ratsbuddy
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    ZTR,
    Yes, while it may not be unanimous I believe the majority feel that Sosa is NOT the answer at SS. We need to go after one of those free agent shortstops hammer and tong. I prefer Seager. But if Arenado could convince Story to come our way that would be fine also.

    r/Esteemed Rat

    #174788
    GameCard
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    “You can’t count Edman as your lead off hitter if Nolan Gorman is playing 2B”.

    This is nonsense…Gorman should & will not ever play 2nd over Edman who is a natural at 2B. Edman makes the Cardinals go and should lead off. His OBP will get better when he commands the strike zone better and draws more walks.

    #174794
    blingboy
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    I hope Mo’s strategy isn’t hoping Edman gets better.

    #174796
    forsch31
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    GameCard, you need to get ahold of the Cardinals’ brass and let them know that. It looks too me like they are grooming Gorman to be the second baseman shortly.

    #174797
    forsch31
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    BTW, during the win streak, Edman hit .241/.261/.289/.551. He did not make the Cardinals go.

    #174798
    14NyquisT
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    I believe that most of Mo’s wishin’ and hopin’ and crossed fingers will be reserved for DeJong…. and DeJong will be around next season.

    #174800
    Ratsbuddy
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    When Edman learns to lay off the high strike he will get better. Teams are pitching him up in the zone because that’s his weak spot now. I assume he is going to hit TONS and TONS of balls up in the zone off the machine this off-season.

    Edman is a gamer. He’s the Cards leadoff man and their 2ndbaseman. PERIOD.

    #174801
    PadsFS
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    Edman has to be close to one of the best at getting to second on his own from the lead off spot with his 40 doubles and 30 SBs.

    #174802
    kscardfan
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    This will piss a few off. But imagine this, figuring there is the stupid dh next year. Herrera and Bader for Contreras. Just let that sink in a bit. Cubs probably get a better offer but.

    #174803
    blingboy
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    We don’t need a .219 vs RHP bat in the lineup. We already have guys who pad their stats vs lefties. The ‘he will get better’ crowd might like it though.

    #174806
    kscardfan
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    Like I said above Herrera and Bader for Contreras. Just let that sink in a bit. Cubs probably get a better offer but. Marcus Stroman good young Pitcher. Admires Waino could learn from him. Pick up a hitter. High BA and OBP. Good defense and some speed. I see Starling Marte for this. 300 hitter with high obp. Should have a few more good years in him. Overall I end up with this. Wouldn’t be spending a lot of money and vastly improve the Team.

    My Lineup — If Edman not hitting flip to bottom of lineup and move Carlson to 2. Vast improvement in this lineup without sacrificing much at all on defense.

    Edman 2B
    Marte CF
    Goldy 1B
    Arenado 3B
    O’Neill LF
    Carlson RF
    Contreras RH DH / C —Gorman LH DH
    Molina C
    Sosa – SS / 2B

    My Roster:

    Catcher – Molina, Contreras
    3B – Arenado, Gorman, Rondon
    SS – Sosa, Edman
    2B – Edman, Gorman
    1B – Goldy, Yepez,
    DH – Conteras, Molina, RH, Gorman LH

    OF – O’Neill, Marte, Carlson, Rondon, Yepez

    SP – Flaherty, Hudson, Stroman, Mikolas, Waino

    SP / RP – Woodford, Kim, Reyes

    RP – Cabrera, Gallegos, Hicks, Garcia, McFarland, Whitley, Martinez ( Yes that one) Cheap

    #174808
    kscardfan
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    bling gonna disagree with you on Contreras. That is the one place you can live with less offense. We all know what a stud defensive Catcher does for your Team. Imagine having a weak defensive Catcher over the years instead of Yadi. Better be proactive in getting a replacement unless you believe in Herrera. Knisner not an answer.

    #174809
    bccran
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    Excellent point about the job of the leadoff man to get into scoring position. I wonder how man leadoff men matched Edman’s steals and doubles. And how that counterbalances his OBP.

    #174811
    bicyclemike
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    I will state a minority opinion here that I think Sosa will be a very good player. The reason is that he is athletic, and has good baseball instincts. Plus as a bonus he brings a lively style – he is energetic.

    He is definitely the guy I go with at short in 2022.

    #174813
    Cards667
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    Going to have to really disagree with you on Contreras. I want nothing to do with him and especially for Herrera and/or Bader. I’m definitely not a Bader hater though, like many are. And actually I am a Bader believer and like the progress he made this year.

    #174814
    forsch31
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    Out of 73 players who had at least 70 plate appearances in the leadoff spot, Edman was 54th in OBP. He was 3rd in doubles and 3rd in SBs. It’s hard to quantify how the doubles and stolen bases counteract the OBP but SLG does take into account total bases. Edman was 52nd in SLG. If you take his 25 stolen bases when batting as the leadoff hitter and add 25 to his total bases, then re-figure only his SLG, he moves up to 36th in SLG. What this tells me is that no matter what way you slice it, Edman was not one of the better leadoff hitters in the major leagues in 2021. Maybe he will be one of the best in the future. However, until the OBP comes up, the team should identify a different leadoff hitter.

    bikemike, I agree about Sosa….unless they want to sign Seager or Story. There have been a few knowledgeable posters who have raved in the past about Sosa.

    #174815
    Mrperkins
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    One guy I would contact is Steven Matz. I know he had some injury stuff early in his career but the last 3 non-covid years he has been reliable with 30, 30, and 29 starts. ERA consistently around 4 with 2 years with the Mets defense behind him and last year pitched to 3.82 ERA in the division with Boston, New York, and the Devil Rays. He may have finally figured out how to win as his 14-7 record is nice. Career 8.6ks/2.8BB per 9 doesn’t scream elite but our defence could really make him look good. He should come a lot cheaper than his teammate Ray and would be a big step up from Lester/Happ.Agency is Icon Sports so no Boras. Maybe 3 years/55mm? What do you guys think, am I way off on the $?

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