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There is no need to carry that many relievers unless your bullpen sucks and you don’t trust anyone or you don’t trust the manager to properly handle the bullpen staff. In the Cards case it looks like a little of option A and option B.
BHC, I suggest you tell all MLB teams your opinion, since it is a trend across the game. The Cardinals did not devise carrying eight relievers on their own.
Conner Greene is the Blue Jays 11th ranked prospect.
Does addition (of pitching)foretell subtraction (of pitching)in the near future (before opening day).
It kind of seems like the Blue Jays picked our pocket on this and the Diaz trade. We couldn’t get them to give us Donaldson. So is this supposed to be the next best thing?
I guess it’s ok depending on what Leone we get.
So I guess what the ownership meant was they were done on the FA market. Lol
So if Pham goes on the DL who plays CF? Ozuna can and Fowler can sort of.
If the bench ends up being Martinez, Garcia, Kelly and Bader it will be the cheapest bench in baseball. Four guys making the league minimum or close to it. Would they consider a LH veteran OF to balance the bench?
Leone seems like a good pickup. Pretty solid 7th inning guy. Greene could turn into something later, has good stuff.
This probably means there will be quite the competition in spring training between Bader, O’Neill, and Adolis-Garcia for the final OF spot. I would think Bader is the current favorite.
Derek Shore and I offer our commentary on the trade.
https://thecardinalnation.com/cardinals-add-reliever-dominic-leone-prospect-for-randal-grichuk/
So what happens when Pham and Fowler make their annual trips to the DL?Cards traded the wrong outfielder.Fowler should have been sent packing.
On paper, Leone sounds like a good pickup for the Cards. But, why has he been with three clubs in three years, and was able to be picked up off waivers by the Blue Jays? I hope there isn’t a bad clubhouse presence involved. Four teams in four years?
In 2015, Leone was part of six-player trade that included Mark Trumbo. Hard to pin anything on him personally. In November 2016, the D-backs had just fired GM Dave Stewart and clipped TLR’s wings. The new regime decided to protect others on the 40-man and Leone was a casualty. He had been good in Triple-A, but not with Arizona – sort of like Mike Mayers. Perhaps the Jays sold high on him, but if he continues his 2017 results, the Cards got a good buy for the next four years.
I get that a vocal few have wanted Fowler gone, and rarely miss an opportunity to remind us of their opinion, but really, why keep wasting the breath/keystrokes? We all know it ain’t happening.
No one wants to acknowledge he was the team’s best player over the final two months of the season, once he came off the DL the second time. You know, the time they were fighting to make the playoffs. Isn’t a .993 OPS in crunch time (better than Pham, DeJong, Martinez, etc.) worth something?
A little light in my opinion. But worse, despite the O zuna trade, we should still be trading depth for up grades, not tge other way around.
Hard to argue with another bullpen arm and a guy with a 100 mph arm for an outfielder that is eminently replaceable and sooner rather than later.
We probably have six guys not named fowler, pham and osuna that can give us what grich gave us last year or damn close (more in most cases) — bader, O’Neill, ja garcia, valera, Mercado, and arozarena. Maybe the last three are a slight stretch but the first three are not.
When you have a situation like that and you get what we got, you made the right move. I’d probably look into moving MORE people for the right deals.
Here is a very informative article from just two weeks ago that outlines in detail why Leone improved so much in 2017.
Conclusion: “All of this is why I believe in Dominic Leone going forward. Yes, he’s a reliever, so things could just go wrong without warning – but beyond that required caveat for all bullpen-dwellers, everything he did in 2017 suggests that he should be good again in 2018. His stuff changed, then he adjusted how he used it to maximize his success (likely with the help of Russell Martin and Pete Walker).”
https://toronto.locals.baseballprospectus.com/2018/01/05/why-we-should-believe-in-dominic-leone/
Terrific trade. The patience had run out on RG, we help out our bullpen immensely, plus get a young flame thrower. The OF depth at the upper levels enabled Mo to feel comfortable doing this.
Lots less ulcers now not having to watch a high ceiling player constantly swinging at sliders in the dirt and rising, letter high 4 seamers.
I do agree with carioca in saying we should be going the other direction too…
There should be some sort of upgrade out there for us — somewhere. You can’t accumulate numbers like this without it biting you in the ass eventually.
Even now we’ve got too many outfielders. I know that you dont want to trade all your depth but when you’re shoving age appropriate prospects down to aa because the two rosters above them are full you’ve simply got too many guys.
I am confused by the discussion. How is Leone not an upgrade for the bullpen? Wasn’t the bullpen a need?
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