- This topic has 138 replies, 31 voices, and was last updated 6 years, 9 months ago by
.
-
Posts
-
They won the division. That was the goal and anything else is icing on the cake.
Ever heard of Hayden Fry? Wikipedia says,”Fry turned his attention to changing a losing attitude and starting new traditions at Iowa. Hayden would not celebrate close losses or moral victories,…”
ERA is 23.14? I’m no baseball guru, but isn’t that a little high for a closer?
Thanks…… I needed that to brighten up an otherwise very gloomy sports night, BrockLou. Well, today wasn’t a total loss, as my Packers laid quite a nice spanking on the Boys in Dallas.
Martinez didn’t want to close to begin with. I have a feeling that during the offseason, he will tell MO he doesn’t want to be a closer, and that will solve our rotation problem. The FO will have to come up with a strategy to handle the closer issue for next year.
On another note, it’s has been nice seeing Carpenter contribute to the team for the past few weeks. He looks real while he’s doing it. (I’m not going to explain what I mean by that last comment, so please just leave it alone.)
well to be fair to this team, I have always felt we were a year and some changes away from being a team that could be expected to make a run for a world series title. but with our great pitching this second half, I thought just a few guys getting hot offensively could get us through at least to the series. its not over but we don’t have anybody really hot let alone a few guys.
A quick comment on both Martinez’ – the Cards do not win the division without them.
On to the game. While Carlos could not bring it home, the real problem is the offense. You score one run in 18 innings, chances are you will lose both games. We were fortunate to even have a shot at winning today in that Waino matched Soroka pitch for pitch.
I felt Shildt should have at least attempted one bunt with DeJong in the 8th. You have first and second, no out, one run game, you simply have to get a run in that situation. My fear was DeJong would hit into a DP, but fortunately he got the ball out of the infield. But the right call was to move the runners over, and so at least one sacrifice attempt should have been tried.
I also disagreed with the pass to McCann. The old “never out the winning run on base” thing was nagging at me when they went that way. But it was a full discussion on the mound and the consensus was to put him on, it just did not work.
Back to the 8th, after DeJong’s fly out Bader ran us out of the inning. But had he got to third Fowler’s fly would have plated a run. Hard in a way to put too much criticism on Harry – he was trying to make something happen.
If tomorrow’s game is a close lead late, I think you go to Mikolas as the end guy. But it will be all hands on, so anyone except Mad Jack could be expected to pitch.
They won the division. That was the goal and anything else is icing on the cake.
Gtfoh with that lame mentality. You think that’s what Carp was thinking while pitching his guts out? Shildt (failed) today. People will say it’s on Martinez but most knew we were screwed with him coming in. He couldn’t do it so why put him in that position? We don’t have a “closer”, he got hurt earlier in the season and management failed to replace him. Miller or Gallegos should have started the 9th.
(edited by moderator for language)
1982willie said:
its not over but we don’t have anybody really hot let alone a few guys.
True, but if they can somehow win on Monday, one of those hot guys would start Game 5.
(Not you specifically, but seems a number of folks have already given up.)
bikemike said:
If tomorrow’s game is a close lead late, I think you go to Mikolas as the end guy. But it will be all hands on, so anyone except Mad Jack could be expected to pitch.
I don’t think they should wait until the end to go to Mikolas, if Hudson needs help. We’ve seen other teams in the playoffs use starters for multiple innings of relief and other than Corbin tonight, it has seemed to work.
Jbcards
I was so calm with Martinez in. Because I knew it was over. That’s why I say it’s on that nerd schildt. Guys a loser. Just look at him
Mike schildt is a loser. Guys got no backbone
I’m sorry I had to vent
That’s not venting. He is an average manager on a club with very good starting pitching. He’s way out of his league in the playoffs
well brian I definitely am not giving up. somebody is always gonna be down 2-1 in a five game series, others have overcame it. Flaherty is definitely hot though I would consider him just flat out good. I would say great but I feel players have to establish some years before they can be considered great. problem is Flaherty isn’t probably gonna hit 2 homeruns with a double and a single to go along with them. yea maybe our bats come alive and we score big tomorrow and that carries over to the next game. but we haven’t seen any sign of that. maybe we will be like the dodgers tonight and have that big inning. but other than their closer, we haven’t really hit or looked great against any of their pitchers. while im a fan I also try to be realistic. if we don’t get some errors or some walks by the opposing pitchers, we just tend to struggle. putting hits together for this team is a chore. been a problem all season so no surprise. but baseball is a funny game so you never know, some great pitching and some timely hitting can still win us 2 games in a row. to me though, whether we advance or not, its been a good year. lots of good things to look forward to next year. a lot of other teams would like to be where we are right now.
3.48M and TV money and BP village money, etc sadly makes none of what any of us root/hope/dream of/etc possible or likely….. if I was increasing my net worth over $150-200M a year I wouldn’t care what you people think either!!!
This game should be blamed on Schildt and CMart of course. I blame it on CMarts bartender this afternoon… Braves must have flown him in from ATL to make sure he was ready for the night and secondly Schildts lady parts, after Thurs he can’t, without pressure (aka being told to) bring him in. There is a lot more that goes on that us fans don’t know about….
I agree with bicyclemike on some observations.
1. The walk to McCann was a bad call. He hadn’t been hurting us, except once. Swanson was killing us consistently/ I suspect that if we had pitched to McCann, we would have won 1-0. Dumb to look at box scores from ten years ago.. What have they done the past couple of days. That SS was killing us.
2. Runners on first and second, nobody out? You bet that we should have had DeJong bunting. I was more afraid of a K than a fly to right, but he has been in a horrible slump, and isn”t likely to move runners over. Put runners on second and third and let J. Martinez have a shot at getting someone home.
<Brian Walton wrote:
Rats, did you watch the game? Jose Martinez had a pinch hit single to keep the eighth inning rally going. Ragging on him tonight has nothing to do with this game and instead is your tired agenda being repeated again and again and again. At least get mad at those who screwed up…>
Amen to that Brian. Rats gets pretty worked up when we lose. For that matter I do too but in reading over all these knee jerk reactions the one I laugh at the most goes something like this: “…..their pitcher is very good…….” “Our offense is bad…..” Could it be possible that the reason our offense is bad is because their pitcher is very good? Do ya think?
Rats, you say Martinez stinks as a closer but want him as a starter. Does that make sense? Do you notice how his uniform is all stained in the right shoulder area? That is all of that hot stuff he has slathered on to keep his shoulder area warm because it is weak. Despite his sterling record as a closer I would not mind seeing him traded this off season (which I hope is not coming sooner rather than later). His appearance and DeJong coming to bat cause the most groans at our house. My take on the game: They had great pitching. We had great pitching………..UNTIL. I like Mike Shildt but if he has one failing it is his loyalty to players regardless of circumstances. He had Gallegos warm in the pen and before he went through all that 9th inning drama, I thought he could have taken Carlos out. He had gotten two outs and a decision had to be made. Swanson had already hit the ball hard in previous at bats. But then they don’t pay us couch coaches enough to make those decisions.
<GACard wrote:
Mike schildt is a loser. Guys got no backbone>
Would you have made that same post if we had won the game? If you are going to charge a guy as having no backbone try learning how to spell his name.
PS: I don’t agree with you but I am sure that makes no difference.Not a happy ending. Got to admit our method has been to grab a lead and hold on for dear life. Flaherty and Waino both got left standing at the altar. Insanity is doing the same thing over and over expecting different results. We lose as a team, and when we win it will be as a team.
On the comment Brian made about using Mikolas earlier than the ninth – yes, I agree depending on how the game goes. I should have specified that I was referring to a situation where if we have another low scoring game, say 2-1 late and Hudson has carried us, then I would likely go with Mikolas to close rather than Martinez, or anyone else.
The exception would be Miller if we are facing Freeman. But don’t waste Miller on someone like Joyce, as Snitker would probably go with Duval, who is their version of JMart.
I don’t consider my reaction to CMart to be knee jerk because I have consistently said this for weeks and weeks, which is I am fine with him coming back next year as a starter but by no means should he be the closer. If healthy, he is very capable of throwing 6 or 7 innings giving up 3 runs or less. His outings as a starter usually were very good with one bad inning. But as a closer you can’t have that one bad inning. He just isn’t cut out to be a closer.
And as I have said 1000 times If I were in the front office I would try really hard to get Brad Hand this winter. He would stablize the back end of the bullpen until Hicks can get back.
Fixing the offense? That is a whole other question. Due to our unfortunate situation with contracts I think we are stuck with most of our position players for the next year or two.
Houstonlarry24
This is my last post of the season. I cannot watch another game with this lineup. It’s sickening. The sight of C Martinez and his antics is pathetic.
I have said numerous times break this team big time and how they won a division with this lineup is freakish.
Now the real bad news Mo will not do anything but tweak this mess so we have little to look forward too. Makes me want to hurl.That’s close to what I’m feeling today. CMartinez is not a closer and certainly not a starter. The CMart/Molina bond is a myth… no one can control Martinez. After a terrible performance on Friday, there is Carlos again. This time he blew the save and was allowed to go on and turn the game into an abomination.
I don’t understand the talk of the McCann pass as being crucial. The thought process is you give up an intentional pass to turn it into an advantage. Instead Martinez couldn’t do it.CMartinez and Shildt are totally responsible for the loss and maybe the series. How can anyone think otherwise is beyond me. Condoning what transpired yesterday in the ninth inning will go in one ear and out the other. Shildt is a AAAA manager.
IMHO this team needs to move on from several underperforming and aging players .Carlos Martinez-too much clown show,too much drama,will his shoulder hold up and will he ever mature and become dedicated to his craft?Jose Martinez-defensivewly challenged,made for the DH……he
s okay but there are younger more athletic options in the wings.Andrew Miller-solid at times,bad at times,makes too much money to be a LOOGY (and he seems inconsistent at that too).Matt Carpenter-Whats he bringing to the table anymore..a rare hot game or two...….a walk or two..more than offset by a lot of strikeouts and average defense a best....A MO mistake extension.Dexter Fowler-way overpaid,plays poor defense,doesntt steal bases,strikes out a bunch,does nothing well except eat salary.Standing in the way of younger possibly better players.
IMO the Molina extension was foolish and premature but it is what it is.Trying to deal some of the aging guys for prospects/young untried players should be considered.Many people have complained about the high strikeouts rates,poor situational hitting,baserunning mistakes so why not infuse some more new young blood with the core you have now?
Molina,Goldschimdt,Wong with DeJong offer a group to start with and Edman,Bader,O`Neill,Lane Thomas,Arozarena,Munoz,Knizner with Carlson on he way sometime next season offer youth and energy.Picking up a LH bat off the bench would help,maybe Ravelo could be a RH pinch option to fill JMarts role.
By trading some big dollars if possible then Cards can decide if to go after another solid innings eater solid SP or a contact hitter with XBH power.
MY POINTS
1.Stabilize SP
2.Find another bat or two with solid contact skills with XBH power(more doubles etc, Homeruns are nice but cutting back on some of the swing and miss is needed).
3.better defensive options at 3B instead of Carpenter,better OF defense LF,RF (O`Neill,Thomas,Arozarena).
4.Work with DeJong and Bader to better hitting skills-both are young enough to improve,both provide good defense.
5.Find a solid LH bullpen guy or two-you have Miller if not traded,Cecil is still around,maybe Cingrani on the cheap I he signs plus there will be several low cost LH bullpen gus in FA looking to rebound (Sipp,Loup,etc) .Tyler Webb doesn`t give me a lot of confidence but he has done okay..Didn`t mean to get longwinded here but I see this as a chance to improve the offense and adding to the SP is major need IMO.Wacha is gone,Wainwright bounced by okay but how long ? CMart is not the answer IMO,Mikolas,Flaherty,Dakota Hudson offer a solid 3..maybe Woodford,Gant,Gomber,Poncedeleon with Wainwright for the SP.
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.