2023 StL Game #37: Tuesday, May 9 at Cubs

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  • #219598
    Brian Walton
    Keymaster

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    6:40 p.m.
    RHP Jack Flaherty (2-4, 6.29) vs, RHP Jameson Taillon (0-2, 5.29)
    BSM // KMOX
    (and Bally Sports Southeast/Southwest Extra)

    #219805
    blingboy
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    Pitcher M Su Sa F Th
    Genesis Cabrera (L) 31 0 9 17 0
    Giovanny Gallegos (R) 0 0 29 11 0
    Ryan Helsley (R) 23 11 0 16 0
    Jordan Hicks (R) 26 0 0 26 0
    James Naile (R) 0 16 0 0 0
    JoJo Romero (L) 0 12 0 0 24
    Chris Stratton (R) 0 0 21 0 28
    Drew VerHagen (R) 0 21 15 0 23
    Jake Woodford (R) 0 0 0 0 31

    #219806
    blingboy
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    That is supposed to be a chart of pen innings pitched for the last 5 days. The format didn’t work, sorry.

    Helsley has worked the last two days. Hicks 26 yesterday, but two off days before that. Cabrera 31 pitches and an off day before that. Verhagen has seen some heavy use, so not sure if he is due another day off. Gallegos has been off two days after going 29.

    Its probably going to be the B team out of the pen today. Combine that with Flaherty. But he should be fine since it was the catcher’s fault.

    This is where the chart comes from: https://www.baseballpress.com/bullpen-usage

    #219807
    Cardinal in France
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    Hey, we’re on a streak!

    #219808
    Cards667
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    Hope to see Flaherty start to build his trade value up tonight for the sell off. Hicks did a fantastic job of it last night, Stratton, VerHagen, and DeJong have made themselves tradeable so far. Just need Flaherty and O’Neill to get with the program.

    #219809
    stlcard25
    Participant

    The Cards simply have to win series at this point. Any and every series is a must win. If they can’t play at a .600+ pace through the end of July, a sell off is in order.

    #219810
    blingboy
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    Given the persistent problem with short starts, and the heavy pen use required, it seems worthwhile to keep a pretty good eye on how the pen assets are being used. Especially so with the guys who are doing well. I don’t have a lot of faith in OliMo and the gang to manage that to best advantage, nor to respond well when go-to guys turn from their good version to their bad version. We know that will happen, since it always has with these same guys.

    Each game is going to be a drama playing out before out eyes. One with multiple story lines in play. We are way behind, but it is a good time to be a Cardinals fan.

    #219814
    ZTR
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    Neither of today’s starting pitchers has set the world on fire.

    Today could be a big day for the lads. Win and it’s the first 3 game winning streak of the year AND win this series – on the road no less.

    They gotta go 7-3 for six or seven 10-game stretches in a row.

    #219817
    jj-cf-stl
    Participant

    Kiz has caught the last 4 games and Willson has been the DH. We’re 2-2 with the last rotation member Flaherty starting tonight. He better do well or Knizner may lose his starting gig!

    #219820
    blingboy
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    He better do well or Knizner may lose his starting gig!

    This current excuse is crazy enough, I’d hate to see what they’d come up with next.

    #219822
    gscottar
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    As you stated bling the current pen usage is unsustainable. If the rotation can’t give us more innings there will be more pen meltdowns in our future. We can always refresh the pen with the Memphis shuttle but I don’t know how many guys have options or if there is anyone down there who can help.

    #219823
    gscottar
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    And by the way I feel much better seeing Donovan in the lineup against a RH pitcher than O’Neill. I hope that becomes a permanent thing.

    #219826
    1toughdominican
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    We need triplets named Jake Westbrook.

    #219827
    blingboy
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    O’Neill is pulling down $5M this year, which is enough to skew playing time decisions. I had mentioned that fact last season when suggesting he should be moved before arb commitments for this year. There is utterly not one thing wrong with having Donovan out there every day. He hits, he fields, he is reliable and he is not one to injure himself just standing there like O’Neill. My fear is the $5M will push things toward a platoon. O’Neill’s K rate means he is never an attractive bat off the bench option. He is making too much to sit around. He will be back and no good will come of it.

    There is an alarming shortfall of help in Memphis, but we know that. (By ‘we’ I do not include Mo, since he is delusional as to the state of the organization’s pitching, and has been for a couple years at least. He might be thinking anything.)

    Potentially, Woodford could help from the pen when he returns, but he can be on or off, much like Zack Thompson out of the pen. They could flip flop on Thompson, but he has already failed in the big league pen this year. There is Pallante, who was cold, but I have not checked lately. There is Walsh, whom I have not followed in over a year. I am not sure of Naughton’s injury status. And then there is Zuniga, who is still not showing as on the 40 man on the roster matrix, but he is on it. For some reason they did not like him in his one inning outing. That is all there is. So it is important for OliMo to manage what he’s got and make the most of it.

    #219829
    Ratsbuddy
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    There is NOT going to be any sell off later this year. I don’t care if we are 40-60 at the trade deadline, there will be no sell off.

    r/Esteemed Rat

    #219831
    Cards667
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    No point of holding on to expiring contracts and players like O’Neill at the deadline unless they can win 20 straight and get back into contention.

    #219832
    Oliver
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    If there are out by the trade deadline, they should sell. Flaherty-O’neill-Montgomery-Edman. To mname a few.

    #219836
    Jnevel
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    I think the question becomes what do we want the ‘24 team to look like. For me, I’d keep this team and work to trade the others:

    Outfield: Walker, Nootbaar, Carlson, Burleson, (Donovan as the emergency 5th or sometimes 4th)

    Infield: Goldschmidt, Donovan, Wynn, Arenado, Gorman, ? Utility Infielder

    Catcher: Contreras, Herrera (Pages becomes emergency 5th unless we resign Barrera)

    SP: Mikolas, Liberatore, Matz, one of Hudson/Woodford/Graceffo/McGreevey/Thompson/Thomas/Paniagua/Pallante, FA Starter (note that Matz may also be a replacement candidate with one of these depth pitchers). My hope is that we end up with Mikolas, Libby, Graceffo, Pallante, and a FA.

    RP: Helsley, Cabrerra, Gallegos, any of the above leftovers plus several other good arms coming up

    That leaves 1 position player opening left. For me, ideally that would probably go to a big bat off the bench so one of Yepez, Luken Baker, or Moises Gomez – whomever seems most likely to succeed.

    Everyone else leftover is tradable except Wainwright – O’Neill, Montgomery, Flaherty, 2 of Yepez/Baker/Gomez, Edman, Stratton, Hicks, Knizner. Hudson/Woodford are also certainly tradable but they would bring nothing back.

    #219839
    blingboy
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    I wouldn’t be real worried about the position player side. I’d hope they have learned their lesson about the virtues of a good defensive outfield. There’s no point having both Walker and Burleson. Pick one and plan on a lot of DH turns and only so much OF.

    Do what it takes to get Contreras back behind the plate or move him out no matter the cost. If you want to be sure you can bring in Walker even if his D does not get a lot better, that means Contreras at DH is not a good plan for 2024.

    Don’t move Donovan off LF without a compelling reason. He can do all very well.

    Don’t chisel Winn or Herrera in unless and until they develop as dominant hitters in AAA. That means don’t move out Edman or Knizner unless and until that happens.

    Get rid of as much of the current rotation as you can. Focus on guys who answer the bell and throw strikes. No bum shoulder guys. No losers. No second rate Canned Hams.

    #219851
    cardsfan64
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    Pallante is back!

    #219852
    1toughdominican
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    I wouldn’t have been entirely certain that Pallante was going to be promoted right away, but you almost knew Jo Jo was going to take a little sojourn as soon as it was 6-3 on Sunday.

    #219854
    blingboy
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    1. Lars Nootbaar (L) RF
    2. Paul Goldschmidt (R) 1B
    3. Nolan Gorman (L) 2B
    4. Nolan Arenado (R) 3B
    5. Willson Contreras (R) DH
    6. Brendan Donovan (L) LF
    7. Paul DeJong (R) SS
    8. Dylan Carlson (S) CF
    9. Andrew Knizner (R) C

    #219855
    1toughdominican
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    They say time flies when you’re having fun. Not really sure if that’s applicable here, but it’s hard to believe that when the final’s posted from Fenway this Sunday the Cardinals will have already been more than a quarter of the way through the ’23 season. What’s entirely certain is that it’s always a foolish practice to needlessly burn daylight when it’s in short supply. Need to make a lot more hay.

    #219861
    CardsRedSox4Ever
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    Gorman starts it off right…1-0 Cards.

    Sad to see the Cubs fans throw back HR balls from the bleachers. But hope to give them plenty to give back!

    #219862
    blingboy
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    Leadoff batter gets a two strike hit off Jack. Hmmm.

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