2022 Cardinals MLB Game 59 thread – Friday, June 10 vs. Reds

Home The Cardinal Nation Forums Open Forum 2022 Cardinals MLB Game 59 thread – Friday, June 10 vs. Reds

Viewing 25 posts - 1 through 25 (of 82 total)
  • Author
    Posts
  • #187362
    Brian Walton
    Keymaster

    Paid - Annual

    7:15 p.m.
    RHP Andre Pallante vs RHP Luis Castillo (1-3, 3.55)
    BSM // KMOX // WIJR
    Also BSSO and BSSW+

    #187481
    Ratsbuddy
    Participant

    Free

    Somebody explain to me why Pujols is still on this team? He can’t hardly even hit the ball anymore.

    And why is Gorman not back down in Memphis trying to learn how to keep from striking out all the time? It’s obvious he isn’t ready for the big leagues yet.

    And why did this team look so lackluster in all three games at Tampa Bay?

    I suspect there might be some internal problems in the Cardinal clubhouse.

    r/Esteemed Rat

    #187483
    Cardinal in France
    Participant

    Free

    Well, Danny Mac goes on at excruciating length about how unbelievably happy Pujols is to be back in St. Louis. You wouldn’t want to take that away from the big guy would you, even if he’s only getting a miserable couple of million for hitting .200.

    #187484
    Brian Walton
    Keymaster

    Paid - Annual

    Seems an odd day to criticize Pujols as he had the team’s only extra-base hit and one of their only two hits over nine innings. Today’s Rays starter McClanahan is a lefty. That is the only time Albert should play. Against lefties. No exception. The manager has to stop playing him against RHP, but that didn’t happen today

    Finding the same criticism about Gorman on so many different threads is getting tiring. Posters who understand more than strikeouts know that Gorman is not the problem with this team and in fact is doing quite well overall.

    #187486
    Cardinal in France
    Participant

    Free

    I quite agree Gorman is not the problem with this team and still has a large sack of benefit of the doubt coming his way. I look forward to seeing more of him. On the other hand Pujols, as we ride into the third month of the season, has been unimpressive, despite his hit today, though he may be earning his keep as a mentor.

    #187487
    Brian Walton
    Keymaster

    Paid - Annual

    I respectfully disagree. Here is Pujols’ line against LHP only this season:

    .353/.385/.588/.973

    He was equally good in that role last season – .939 OPS.

    Like I said, the problem is when he is used against RHP. The Cardinals knew this when they signed him, yet they keep playing him when they shouldn’t (again, not the issue today).

    #187491
    Ratsbuddy
    Participant

    Free

    Cards get a break on Thursday as the Phils sweep the Brewers in Milwaukee. Still just 1/2 game out of first place.

    And I never said Gorman is THE problem. However, after today’s strikeout he is striking out over 38% of the time. THAT IS A PROBLEM! He’s obviously over-matched at the big league level and needs to head back to Memphis for some more seasoning.

    And I am just wondering about Pujols – did anybody see the game on Thursday? His double was nothing but a little pop fly that the 2ndbaseman flubbed. And he also fouled out to 1st. And then he hit a little slow roller to the pitcher. All of this against a lefty. My eyes tell me he’s done, washed up.

    r/Esteemed Rat

    #187494
    Bob Reed
    Participant

    Free

    It’s not complicated. In fact, it’s really straightforward.
    Albert Pujols is in fact washed up — but only against righties.

    He is still outstanding against lefties. Just like last year, as Brian Walton pointed out, with the supporting numbers to prove it.
    It is Oliver Marmol’s ongoing and 100% inexcusable mismanagement of Pujols that has created the illusion that Albert can’t hit anymore. He hits lefties and only lefties. It was true when the Cards got Albert — but just like with Jake Woodford (and Naughton, and Pallante, and others) Marmol has chosen to ignore anything and everything that happened before the day he took over as manager.

    Please, gentlemen. Don’t let Ollie Marmol’s arrogance and ignorance trick you into believing something that isn’t true.

    Now that I have supported your post, Mr. Walton, can you cut me in on a share of your share of the Denver Broncos? 😉

    And Nolan G. might be one of those sluggers who just always strikes out a lot. I absolutely HATE the whiffs, but as long as he produces, that’s 99% what matters.

    All-time career K leaders:

    1. Reggie Jackson
    2. Jim Thome
    3. Adam Dunn
    4. Sammy Sosa
    5. Alex Rodriguez

    Others in the top 20 include Miguel Cabrera, Willie Stargell, Mike Schmidt, Tony Perez, and Derek Jeter.

    #187495
    Ratsbuddy
    Participant

    Free

    Pujols is outstanding against lefties? Really? Did anybody see the game today? He was pretty bad.

    But……I will hold judgement until he faces another lefty or two.

    #187496
    blingboy
    Participant

    Paid - Annual

    I didn’t think much of Pujols and Yadi yucking it up over that strike out when the team is getting its head handed to it. There was nothing to be jolly about. Yadi wouldn’t be pitching if they all weren’t stinking it up. It doesn’t help Ollie throwing in the towell before its over, and it doesn’t help Mo doesn’t provide him a roster to do much else because 3 or 4 guys out of 13 can pitch. Not at all a product on the field I am excited about.

    #187497
    forsch31
    Participant

    Free

    after today’s strikeout he is striking out over 38% of the time

    Rats, you are figuring this wrong. His strikeout percentage is only 34%. It is based on the total PLATE APPEARANCES not at bats. If you figure it the way you are, it skews the numbers.

    Here’s an example:

    Player A – 100 PAs, 20 walks and 20 strikeouts. K% your way = 25%, correct way = 20%
    Player B – 100 PAs, 0 walks and 20 strikeouts. K% your way = 20%, correct way = 20%

    For strikeout percentage both players have 20% when figured correctly.

    #187499
    Brian Walton
    Keymaster

    Paid - Annual

    Among National League rookie hitters with at least 50 at-bats, Gorman is second-best in both slugging and OPS.

    Making broad assessments of any hitter based on watching one game against one pitcher is ridiculous. Ignoring hard data over a longer period is just as bad. Pujols is an asset against lefties but should not play against righties.

    Interestingly, Gorman is not playing against lefties, so the Cardinals understand splits. So why does Gorman sit against his weak side but Pujols does not? We probably all know the answer, but it is hurting the team.

    #187500
    1982 willie
    Participant

    Paid - Annual

    Some crazy stuff. Criticizing pujols who got one of the two hits today. Better to criticize the others who didn’t get a hit. The luck of the hit means nothing. People are funny. The rays are a good team with good pitching. For some reason people think we should be able to smack them around like we do the cubs or the reds. We also think how great one of our starters are when they only give up a run or two but I’m sure their fans are wondering why their team didn’t hit them better.

    #187501
    1982 willie
    Participant

    Paid - Annual

    To me pujols usage is one of the few things I can quibble with marmol about. I’ve felt as this team is constructed, we arent going to win the pennant let alone the world series this year. So pujols might as well get his shots and from what I generally see, he’s about as successful as other guys. Now I hope we win the pennant and such but it’s hope. People like to give all these stats and analytics to talk about who should be playing or whatever. That’s all fine. It’s a game of numbers. But you can also do the same with the team far as stats and analytics. I don’t think those stats and such have us being world champions at the end of year, it could happen but I don’t think that is what the numbers say. That’s just my thoughts on that.

    #187512
    Cardinal in France
    Participant

    Free

    Just to be clear, in my comments yesterday responding to a post critical of Gorman and Pujols I made no negative remarks about Gorman at all and concerning Pujols I merely said after more than two months into the season his performance was “unimpressive.” I still believe that to be true. Of course if you want to judge only selective parts of his performance I guess you can argue just about anything.

    #187515
    14NyquisT
    Participant

    It would be interesting to know what Gorman’s k/rate is against starting pitchers and what it is against the BP (sans the closer). He can hit AAA types but Ks too often against actual MLB pitchers.

    #187516
    Wooster
    Participant

    Free

    Well CIF theres no need to be apolegetic about your thoughts on Pulous or anybodyelse. This is “Merica” and you can say what you want. When he gets a hit hes great. When he doesn’t- 4 times out of 5 hes a bum. And so it goes in baseball. Personally stats have never been my bag. Not everybodys the same. My sweet wife always did the scoring.I’m much like Willie in that I assess based on what I see every day. The “Reunited” hoopla has died down now and we should be focusing on whos gonna develop now for next season. Which rookies to keep around.What to do about our abysmal pitching free agents. How to play games and still develop our AAA level bull pen. We really look like a rebuilding team to me right now but thats ok.As long as you see it for what it is.
    Willies discourse with others was really just misunderstanding over at-bats vs plate appearances. Google it, it explains it. Personally Gorman hasn’t blown my socks off like ge does his own every time he swings. I had the Rays coverage yesterday and replay showed him swinging up trying to lift the ball in the 9th with our best chance to score. Jeez man just getting a hit then would have been huge. Beware of the hype in a game where success is measured by getting a hit one out 3 times. Go Cardinals!

    #187518
    gscottar
    Participant

    Paid - Annual

    It shouldn’t be a mystery as to why Pujols is on the team. It is to sell tickets. The same reason as to why he was signed in the first place. The Cardinals decided that nostalgia would be good for business so here we are and he WILL NOT be released before the end of the year. As Brian and Bob pointed out Pujols would be fine if he was only used against RH pitchers.

    #187519
    gscottar
    Participant

    Paid - Annual

    And instead of fretting over Gorman I will continue to fret over Dickerson, McFarland, Brooks, Naughton, Wittgren, and VerHagen. Completely wasted money and roster spots on ineffective veterans when those spots could have gone to internal candidates who would perform better. As someone mentioned before the low hanging fruit is rotten.

    #187520
    jj-cf-stl
    Participant

    It would be easier to write off Pujols starts versus righties if the majority were home starts, to sell tickets, but they’re not. It’s pretty much even up for the season home and road.

    Before Yepez, Donovan and Gorman joined the club, the alternative to AP starting versus righties was Dickerson, and he stunk it up early on. He had an ops in the low .400’s, the day before yepez joined the club.

    #187521
    stlcard25
    Participant

    Paid - Annual

    And instead of fretting over Gorman I will continue to fret over Dickerson, McFarland, Brooks, Naughton, Wittgren, and VerHagen. Completely wasted money and roster spots on ineffective veterans when those spots could have gone to internal candidates who would perform better. As someone mentioned before the low hanging fruit is rotten.

    Yes. What was the money we spent on all those guys plus Pujols, and even including Matz? Seems like we could have gotten a pretty nice upgrade to our rotation for that price.

    #187526
    CariocaCardinal
    Participant

    Paid - Monthly

    Not that worried about Gorman but what would his k rate be if he also faced lefties?

    #187528
    sjeff70
    Participant

    Free

    They play the Reds tonight so hopefully they can win the series. The Reds always play them tough so we will see.

    Looking forward to watching O’Neill tonight. Maybe Pujols can hit a HR off some mediocre pitching in the series. Not much else to look forward to other than possible PDJ coming back up soon. Not sure who I’d rather have in the lineup, Yepez, Dickerson or PDJ. Yepez has really disappointed me. He got all that information from Pujols and then he started pulling off everything. He stopped doing all the things that had him hitting to all fields. He has even discontinued his 2-strike approach. What does Pujols think of this???

    It’s funny when you think about his 2 strike approach stance. It tells the pitcher exactly what he’s doing so the pitcher can attack him accordingly. I often wonder with this team if the batters have free reign to do what they want at the plate.

    #187533
    blingboy
    Participant

    Paid - Annual

    1. Tommy Edman (S) SS
    2. Nolan Gorman (L) DH
    3. Paul Goldschmidt (R) 1B
    4. Nolan Arenado (R) 3B
    5. Tyler O’Neill (R) LF
    6. Brendan Donovan (L) 2B
    7. Dylan Carlson (S) RF
    8. Harrison Bader (R) CF
    9. Andrew Knizner (R) C

    Maybe they moved Yadi to the pen.

    #187535
    Ratsbuddy
    Participant

    Free

    This team really needs Arenado to get going. He’s just about floundered for the last 4-5 weeks. I hope Carlson is ready and they haven’t rushed him back.

    The Cards did hit a lot of balls hard in Tampa but unfortunately most of them were right at someone. Other than that they were pretty lackluster in the Rays series.

    Me and Whitey Herdog will be on the couch for this one. Along with a couple of 7×50 Palma Real Presidente cigars. The Doppler Radar shows all clear in St. Louis. And din-din today was a trip out to the other Amish restaurant north of town on the lake, Lakeview. Catfish fiddlers, mashed potatoes/gravy, green beans, noodles, dressing, sweet tea, and vanilla soft serve ice cream were on my menu.

    And later tonight, after the Reds/Cards game, we will be tuning in to the Dodgers and Giants at Candlestick Park.

    r/Esteemed Rat

Viewing 25 posts - 1 through 25 (of 82 total)
  • You must be logged in to reply to this topic.