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Goldy is probably at the point where Jim Edmonds was in the latter part of his career. As much as we hated to see it, the Cardinals dealt Edmonds to San Diego for a minor league third baseman who turned out to be a pretty good player for us. Edmonds was still a decent player for a couple of years, even winding up on the rival Cubs for a period of time, which was hard to take.
I think we are about at that point with Goldy, where we need to bite the bullet and get some promising younger players in return – maybe not right this minute but likely around the traditional trading deadline time. He will still end up with a red jacket and come back for opening day in the coming years, but the wise decision is probably going to be to move on sometime before next season.
Obviously if we compete this year, all of that is out the window. But I do not expect us to be more than a .500ish team.
Extending Oli Marmol but not extending Goldy would be a strange turn of events but hey this is the Cardinals we are talking about. I understand they don’t make the same salary but I still view Goldy as one of our best players. I think he is graded by fans on a steep curve based on expectations. To me he fits this roster much better than Arenado ever did.
If Goldy’s career takes after that of Phat Albert, his OPS will soon go into the 700’s and stay there, except for maybe a fluke season as a DH.
It seems like Goldy is in better physical shape than Albert was with the feet problems and what not. I worry mostly about his bat slowing down.
To me he fits this roster much better than Arenado ever did.
Hmm, interesting. Why do you feel that way gscottar? They were both brought in for the same reason, to be the linchpins in building a championship club. Both have done what was expected, and both seem like stand-up, quality guys.
There have been more rumors surrounding Arenado being dealt, which comes from him being a native of the LA area and the fact the Dodgers had a need for a third baseman. But he has not expressed a wish to go there – more a case of people in the press putting two and two together. And he could have walked away from our club, but chose to stay.
I have very much enjoyed watching him play third base. He’s lost a little since his days our here in Denver when he seemed to make a highlight reel play almost nightly. But he’s still great, and I see both guys sort of the same light. Even though Goldy won the MVP in 2022, Arenado was arguably the best player in the league with an NL high 7.9 WAR.
He slipped quite a lot last year, and will be 33 this year. But I think he has a good chance to be a bit better this year. The Cardinals are banking on both him and Goldy to rebound. One of those guys could very well do that, but it is not likely both will – and certainly more likely both will decline or stay around their 2023 production than be better. Players in their 30s tend to decline.
Hmm, interesting. Why do you feel that way gscottar?
Because in my view we had drafted Gorman to be our longterm 3B. Instead we are having to find Gorman a new place to fit defensively, with mediocre results, and that $30M-$35M per year for Arenado could have been used on a high quality starter.
If they extend Goldschmidt, they’ll prob have over $60mm of payroll allocated to two aging players who aren’t locks to produce even $45mm of WAR. For a mid-market team, that seems like a bad risk/reward bet when you have young, semi-established players making close to minimum who play the same positions. They’re basically stuck with Arenado, so Goldschmidt’s pending FA is the only readily available near-term release valve.
Because in my view we had drafted Gorman to be our longterm 3B. Instead we are having to find Gorman a new place to fit defensively, with mediocre results, and that $30M-$35M per year for Arenado could have been used on a high quality starter.
Understandable. But when you can get a possible Hall of Famer without compromising your future much, and your core team is already pretty good, you take that over potential.
The Cardinals really need to do something like that now – not as much of a signature move, but they need to get Monty’s name on a contract. Stupid Boras needs to work with us, and set his ego aside.
I would still love to sign Goldschmidt for 2 yrs/$40-$45M with a mutual option for a third year. He was awarded League MVP just 15 months ago. He can still stretch way out and catch those hurried throws on the infield and leap high and catch those balls hit over his head. Unless he got seriously injured in the second guaranteed year of his contract, the Cardinals would no doubt agree to that option year. I just don’t know about 5 yrs/$97M, guaranteed. It sounds like bad business for the Cardinals.
I agree that neither Goldschmidt nor Arenado want to be veteran leaders. I don’t think either of them has embraced the Cardinals’ fan base the way Wainwright, Pujols, Ozzie, Edmond, and others have. The very best of their years are likely behind them. So they’re never really going to be ‘face of the franchise’ guys. But they are both really, really good baseball players.
I think a 2 year extension would be fine also but if he doesn’t come back next year what is the plan for 1B in 2025? Would the Cardinals go with a Burly/Baker combo or go after a FA like Pete Alonso? I’m sure Alonso wouldn’t be cheap.
I don’t want declining and no leadership Goldy. Let him ride into the sunset. Not that spring results are that important but he has been horrible. To me his spring results may be an indication that we are in for a slow start from him. I know people here love him but I rather let him go too early than hold on to him for too long.
I don’t want declining and no leadership Goldy. Let him ride into the sunset. Not that spring results are that important but he has been horrible. To me his spring results may be an indication that we are in for a slow start from him. I know people here love him but I rather let him go too early than hold on to him for too long.
Yes you have said repeatedly that you don’t want Goldy here but who would you want at 1B in 2025?
If Goldy isn’t here in 2025, then I think there’s 3 possibilities. None of those is a FA and none is Walker. They each depend on what happens this season.
1) If Gorman continues to have back issues that plague him and 2B is deemed to exacerbate those issues, then Gorman will be the new first baseman. Donovan or Saggese or Edman would be the full time second baseman. This scenario seems most likely to me because it solves 2 problems – keeping Gorman in the lineup while improving our defense.
2) A combination of one or both of Burleson and Baker depending on how they hit this year. They certainly could platoon well together.
3) If Ivan Herrera hits the ball well and Contreras struggles at defense and framing but continues to hit extremely well, then Contreras could move to 1B and Pages could be the backup next year with a limited time share.
Gorman appeared in 119 games last season in which he accumulated 406 AB’s. If he can stay on the field for 150 games I don’t think he’ll have any trouble reaching 30 to 35 HR’s and pushing upwards of 90 runs across HP. He’s a dangerous bat.
If Goldy is in the MVP race, Bill may go for his HOF cap, and over-extended him.
What if his 2023 .810 ops falls to the high .700’s this season? That’s a whole different scenario, right? We could sure use that MVP season again.
I’m glad they stepped back from extension talks. Gives Paul a chance to achieve his best case, and decide what’s best for him and his.
I see him as the current face of the franchise.
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