Minor league salaries

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This topic contains 117 replies, has 15 voices, and was last updated by Brian Walton Brian Walton 3 weeks, 6 days ago.

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  • #79926
    Brian Walton
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    lrcardinal, I haven’t researched it, but I wouldn’t be surprised if Boras stipulated that Murray be allowed to play football this past fall as a condition for signing with Oakland in the first place.

    #79929
    Brian Walton
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    Now the specific financial demand is being disputed.

    #79938
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    CariocaCardinal
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    Yes, playing football this fall was a condition of the signing. Not sure how/why Oakland didnt get more guaranties or financial penalties if he decided to go to the NFL.

    He wont get an additional $15 million to play baseball. That would be guaranteed money equal to a top 10 NFL pick which he is not. I think he will be lucky to get an additional $5 million.

    #79939
    Brian Walton
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    That may be, but to me the bigger issue is MLB opening up major league contracts to recently-drafted minor league players who are nowhere near ready for MLB. If Boras gets that door reopened, it will be exploited again.

    What this shows is that MLB will bend any “rules” they put in place to manage spending, when it benefits them. Again, another weakness they are creating that can be exploited.

    Don’t get me wrong. In this particular case, good for Murray getting whatever he can, but one part of me is disappointed. It will only increase the gap between the few minor leaguers who receive the majority of the money and the majority of the players who get peanuts. So again, the focus for change is in the wrong place, IMO.

    #79941
    Brian Walton
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    This is going to drag on beyond today…

    #79949
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    gscottar
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    The MLB owners are a real piece of work. They want rules in place that will inhibit spending and squeeze the players then they start getting pressure because a potential young star decides he may choose a different league to play in so they decide to bend the rules. What a joke.

    And people wonder why most young people follow the NBA and NFL but ignore MLB.

    #79990
    BlackHillsCard
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    Minor League Hockey players in the AHL (equivalent of Triple A) earn around $42,000 a season meanwhile Triple A players with no MLB service time earn about $12,000 a season. That’s insane!

    #80078
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    SoonerinNC
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    There should be a solution in this somewhere. One of the problems is that there are too many unknown factors. How much money do the major league teams clear? My sense is that it is more now days because of the TV money. How much would it cost each team to pay the minor league players more? And how do you even calculate it because I’m sure there is a vast difference between what people on both sides of the issue believe is fair. And really, this is a three sided issue because of the agents who are motivated to get the salaries to the highest point possible. And they may have the greatest control of the issue.

    I don’t believe that everone on one side of the issue or the other are all evil. People are just not made that way. I don’t have any illusions about the potential greed of individuals. I spent most of my business career as a human resources person and had to sort out a lot of issues that could lead to unfairness. Sometimes I got a lot of support from management and other times not so much.

    I don’t have a problem with only 4 or 5 teams bidding for Machado and Harper. Both have been with organizations that have underperformed. Do they really mean enough to pay 30 Million + a year. And if New York, Los Angeles teams are involved why beat your brains out when they can easily top what you can afford to pay.

    I don’t doubt that the owners are slow playing the free agents but if I was an owner I would be reluctant to get into a bidding war over the average to below average players. Why would you want to risk overpaying a player if there are better alternatives. Remember the Cardinals went on their August drive after DLing some of their free agent aquisitions and bringing up Hudson, Gomber and Ponce let along Flaherty earlier in the season. How many times do you have to be burned by a Fowler, Cecil and Holland to become a little cautious. And did Lynn really perform at a level above the qualifying offer in 2018.

    I don’t have a problem with the players getting a percentage of total revenues. But a fair portion of it should be based on team and individual performance in the form of a bonus. You might even see all teams playing hard to the end with that kind of system.

    Of course one of the big questions is how much is a reasonable amount. Entertainers and talking heads on TV earn much more than major league players. They in turn earn more than many CEO’s of businesses who are responsible for the success of the organization through superior performance. I worked with two CEO’s/Presidents who increased their business fourfold. Neither made near 1 Million a year.

    I think it criminal that minor league players are not paid for spring training. I don’t think you can compare the hockey minor league program with baseball; The Cardinals have 9 teams vs 1 for each NHL team. However, the baseball guys should get a fair wage. Maybe some system of minimum salaries. Hard to apply an incentive system there because of so much player movement.

    As usual, any system usually results in unintended consequences. Most of the domestic guys who reach the majors are most often top 10 draft choices. Others are selected with no serious thought they will reach the majors but are needed to fill out the rosters. Not sure how they will fare if minor league costs are increased. We once had over 30 minor leagues. Some will say that the owners will in bad faith make changes. You have to believe that all 30 owners are bad people to believe that they are totally indifferent to their player’s welfare. I don’t believe that. If over the long team you don’t return a profit most organizations fail resulting in loss of many jobs. In baseball the issue is more complicated because there are always deep pocket people out there who are willing to pay almost anything for the prestige of being a professional team owner.

    I will probably be blasted for this post but I find it hard to believe that everyone involved has no interest in the future of the game. However, there is a problem and solutions need to be identified.

    • This reply was modified 8 months ago by Avatar SoonerinNC.
    #80575
    Brian Walton
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    #80576
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    MLB’s argument is disgusting and the MiLB needs to get unionized soon. Furthermore, this is an idiotic way to build your organization. If I’m investing as much money as I already am on scouting, player development, etc. I’m going to make sure my investment is focused on getting better and not how they are going to earn money for their families the rest of the year.

    #80596
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    mudville
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    I think the MLB players with the big contracts should help the minor leagues out. If they would each pay 10% of the value of their contract to the minor league players, that would help a lot. And the MLB players would still have plenty of money to spend on themselves and their heirs.

    #80598
    Brian Walton
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    I think the MLB union should organize the minor leaguers – and if they need to increase dues to MLB players for the staffing and legal fight, so be it. That is how the MLB players should be taxed, IMO.

    #81338
    Brian Walton
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    An interesting comparison table. (My friend Jeff’s idea for one team to break ranks with the other 29 is totally unrealistic, though.)

    #81351
    stlcard25
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    It is unrealistic, but it would be nice if one owner had an actual conscience and broke with the ranks.

    I do think that a lot of these owners believe they’re doing the players and the communities alike a great service by gracing them with their presence. For another example, I live in a town that has a refinery that makes gas for a big region around the northeast. Gas prices should be superb, right? Despite them literally having to truck the gas 500 feet from loading to the tank in one case, our local gas prices are consistently the highest in the state. Why is that? I can only see it as greed and hubris; they know it would be such a far drive for anyone to drive to get outside the area that they supply fuel to that it wouldn’t be worth it. So they gouge the locals because there is no alternative.

    In the same way, minor league baseball is pretty much the only way to become a pro baseball player, so they have their audience captive and can do whatever they want, just because they can. It’s oppression, pure and simple. I hope someone ends it sooner than later.

    #81356
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    gscottar
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    For the minor league teams that are not owned by their MLB affiliates what expenses are they responsible for vs the expenses the MLB affiliate is responsible for?

    #81359
    Brian Walton
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    Organizations cover player and coach salaries, medical, strength and conditioning, etc. Minor league teams run their facilities, sell tickets, etc. Lines are pretty clear.

    #81372
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    gscottar
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    I assume the minor league teams get to keep any profits from ticket sales, concessions, and parking or do they have to share with the big league club?

    #81378
    Brian Walton
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    I believe that is true, no sharing.

    #81379
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    14NyquisT
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    Who is the “President” of the Memphis Redbirds?

    #81383
    Brian Walton
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    The team’s owner is Peter Freund. The President/GM is Craig Unger.

    #81551
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    Wiley
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    My thoughts on this subject:
    1. The major league players have all been there and done that, therefore they should be fully in support of the #1 priority in baseball being the minor leaguers getting a livable wage. If that means only making $14 million a year instead of 15 for playing a game, then suck it up you overpaid Neanderthals. You could easily make it part of your bargaining agreement that a % of major league salaries goes to minor league subsidies.
    2. There’s no question major league baseball has the funds to increase minor league wages, so just freaking do it already. You have happier more focused athletes working harder to become what the organizations want them to be. Worrying about finances may be the single most stressful thing in life. For god’s sake take that off the plate so your assets can focus. Maybe then players won’t retire early before they’ve had a chance to develop into major leaguers. If nothing else its positive reinforcement that you are in full support of their career growths.
    3. Baseball is so beside itself over the decrease of black athletes playing their game. Low salaries have a lot to do with it you morons. They can make way more money in other areas. They don’t need you! You can kiss all the Jackie Robinson ass you want and declare him God and it still won’t change their participation. More money, more money, more money!!! No minor leagues in football or basketball.
    4. No sport takes longer to get to the ‘Bigs’ then baseball. Years of minor league service for pittance. Somebody please make it worth their while to dedicate their lives. Yes the payout is tremendous if you make it. If…..?
    5. Personal lives put on hold because you can’t afford to get married or have kids just yet. So what of the pressure to defecate or get off the pot from parents or spouses. “Grow up” and get a real life or a real job. This goes back to the stress thing. Someone please pay these boys to be above the poverty line so they can have a life.
    6. If minor leaguers don’t like it then they can do something else…..Bullshit! Dreams are meant to be followed. Just giving up for undue reasons is not an option. They are, at the same time, performing a job and should be rightfully paid for it.
    7. We the fans demand of minor leaguers that they dedicate their lives to baseball, to improving, to succeeding, to winning, to entertaining, to becoming everything we want them to be. We pay for the tickets, the merchandise and so on, fully believing that they are being fairly compensated for doing all these things for us. Our team pride depends on it. We don’t just want Helsley to throw shutouts in Memphis or Gorman to hit 30 homers in Palm Beach or Montero to drive in 100 runs in Springfield; we want them to do it all again in St. Louis. It’s much easier to accomplish on the road to success then on the financial path to ruin. How do owners not get this???
    8. It’s a disgrace that MLB treats their future with such distain and that ML players have such short freaking memories. There is only one solution to this blackeye on the sport; PAY UP!!! “So endith the lesson”

    • This reply was modified 7 months, 1 week ago by Avatar Wiley.
    #81555
    Brian Walton
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    Well put, Wiley. Having said that, as I just typed on another thread, this will not happen without someone negotiating these changes with the owners. The owners lobbied successfully to get the law strengthened just last year to protect them from having to increase minor league pay. In other words, momentum is in the wrong direction for those who want change.

    #81557
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    gscottar
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    One thing I would add to that is that the minor league players that teams really consider assets are taken care of financially in the form of huge signing bonuses. It is the more pedestrian players that have to live off of ramen noodles. Those are the guys who need help and they probably make up the huge majority of players.

    #81559
    Brian Walton
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    It depends on how you define “huge signing bonus”, but I will tell you roughly how many Cardinals that included this year (and how many it did not).

    If huge = $1 million, the answer is two out of roughly 80 players signed (my quick estimate). If you drop to $500K, then the total increases to a whopping five.

    We are talking about the very tip of the iceberg only.

    P.S. At the other end of the spectrum, a talent like Evan Kruczynski got $3,000 to sign. Yariel Gonzalez got $1,000 (before taxes). That is far more typical.

    • This reply was modified 7 months, 1 week ago by Brian Walton Brian Walton.
    #81661
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    Wiley
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    I’m sure the owners would change their thinking Brian, if the complete minor league system staged a 1 week strike or longer. Interesting to see how all parties would react including their major league brethren.

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