MLB labor unrest

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This topic contains 224 replies, has 20 voices, and was last updated by Brian Walton Brian Walton 1 month ago.

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  • #80912
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    mudville
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    I don’t know how to get to something reasonable and fair. I think it’s going to take both sides actually caring about one another, and others, although that seems impossible at times.

    The players see guys around them getting rich, and they want to get rich, too. I guess that’s human nature. They see ball clubs making millions upon millions of dollars, and ask ‘How can I get rich if the owner keeps so much money for himself and his investors?’ The owner can argue ‘My ball club is worth a billion dollars. If I can’t make at least $30M on my investment, I might as well sell it and put the money in an annuity. There are annuities that will guarantee me 3% ($30M) a year for 10 years.’ So, go figure, I guess. But, IMHO, the answer is above.

    #80940
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    CariocaCardinal
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    #80942
    Brian Walton
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    Good article. Thanks for sharing. Moral is market corrections are not always predicted.

    This one sentence particularly caught my eye.

    “Giving more money to lower-quality free agents isn’t going to boost win totals and actually is likely to disconnect the payroll and wins correlation (which MLBPA would like to keep intact).”

    #81004
    Brian Walton
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    Speaking of market corrections… The better players are getting better money even before free agency. $26 million for a five-year player.

    #81010
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    mudville
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    Yikes. Here’s a 27 year old kid getting $26M dumped in his lap, enough money for several lifetimes (if he could take it with him). I wouldn’t be surprised if the Rockies try to trade him before the end of the season since its highly unlikely that they are going to meet his demands. There was a time when teams would trade for a player like this just to have first bargaining rights with him. I don’t see that happening any more.

    #81030
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    gscottar
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    The Rockies generally don’t trade their players under this GM. They are stubborn about it and considering the state of the AL West they will probably be guaranteed at least 2nd place.

    I would expect they will keep Arenado all year and then an incredible bidding war will commence next winter. Will the Cardinals be part of it?

    #81042
    Brian Walton
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    Just to add onto your point, there is no reason the Rockies could not grab another wild card spot or at least remain in contention long enough to make trading Arenado not viable.

    In a vacuum, I think the Cards would be a player for Arenado. However, I will watching the trio of Montero-Gorman-Nunez very closely this year for at least one more reason than before. They could have an impact on the Arenado thinking…

    #81047
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    gscottar
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    I said AL West. Obviously I meant NL West.

    Yes, the trio you mentioned I’m sure are on Mo and Girsch’s minds too. That will be a fascinating story line to play out and so many factors to consider.

    1. Will Goldy sign an extension?
    2. Will Carp play well at 3B and have his option picked up for 2020?
    3. Will Gyroko still be around after 2019?
    4. Will Montero, Gorman, and Nunez continue to blossom and will a position switch be considered?
    5. Will Arenado be available and will the Cardinals get involved? Could or would they want to pay him and Goldy both?

    #81049
    stlcard25
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    I’m certain that the Cards will at least be in play for Arenado. How much will depend on quite a few things. 3B has a lot of potential going forward, and it should be fun to see it play out.

    #81053
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    Onyxgem
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    Cards wont be a player for Arenado, just like they NEVER EVER were real players fore Harper or Machado, they are to cheap!

    #81097
    jj-cf-stl
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    The Q-offer is proof that the top 125 players continue to be paid a higher average salary.

    In the past 6 years those players AAV has risen from 13.3mil to 17.9mil.
    That’s a 25% increase over six seasons.

    #81114
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    gscottar
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    Another factor to consider is that if Goldy is retained long term and Carp’s option is picked up for 2020, would the Cardinals actually consider moving Carp to 2B so they could sign Arenado?

    #81118
    bicyclemike
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    The Arendo situation will be interesting. The Rockies want to work a long-term deal of course, but historically have not been big spenders. They did pony up for Blackmon though, and that could impact their resources for Arenado.

    As for the bigger picture, I just do not see a strong motivation for the players to push too hard for greater benefits. Most every industry is geared toward owners and executives getting the rewards, while labor and and administration services get anywhere from decent incomes to barely-livable wages.

    Baseball players are a very unique group, and deserve to be well compensated in a visible and strong industry. However, between signing bonuses before a guy has even proven himself, to salaries that set them up for life even after just a few seasons, it cannot be easy to act like you are unfairly treated.

    #81122
    jj-cf-stl
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    Wong has a guaranteed 10.25mil in 2020.

    #81129
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    gscottar
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    I am aware of Wong’s contract but if the team wanted Arenado bad enough they might move Wong or not bring Carp back.

    • This reply was modified 7 months, 2 weeks ago by Avatar gscottar.
    #81138
    jj-cf-stl
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    Playing along…. If Goldy and Arenado are at the corners, then yes, Carp to 2B.
    Where else? O’Neill, Bader, Fowler and Martinez in the OF, yadi catching.

    Do we want Mikolas resigned? I do. A near repeat of his 18′ will start the discussion at 20mil per.

    Goldy extended starts at 25 to 30mil per. Arenado 30mil per? Harper….

    I just want our own extended, and a garrett hampson type middle infielder acquired. Wong is more of a often injured bench player that will be getting expensive fast imo.

    #81339
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    gscottar
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    Some ideas I have heard on MLB radio the last few days that might helpful in speeding up the offseason. I wouldn’t consider all of these pro-management or pro-players. Both sides would have to make concessions.

    1. Set deadlines for trades and free agency during the offseason.

    2. Set up max contracts like the NBA has. For example, no contract could be longer than 7 or 8 years or could be no more than $250M. The dollar amount could be adjusted annually. If those paramaters were in place now Harper and Machado would both be signed.

    3. Speed up eligibility for arbitration and free agency. One example for this would be to start the service time clock as soon as a player is drafted. Make it 6 or 7 years for college players and 8 or 9 years for high school players. This would prevent teams from holding star players in the minors. They would want them at the MLB level as soon as possible.

    #81353
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    gscottar
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    This is a very long article but well worth the read. I think an ESPN subscription might be required.

    http://www.espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/25891797/welcome-small-market-team-worst-nightmare

    #81358
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    forsch31
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    One of the ideas that I heard thrown out on the MLB on XM is to encourage teams not to tank. That would be done by doing a lottery system on the top draft picks like the NBA. There would no longer be an incentive to tank if there were an equal opportunity to get the top draft pick.

    I would propose that the worst 10 teams, by record, would have an equal opportunity for the top pick with a slightly higher weighting than the next 10 teams, by record that don’t make the playoffs. Without the guaranteed higher pick, teams would have an incentive to at least still be competitive. You could be the team with the best record that didn’t make the playoffs and still have an opportunity to get the top draft pick. There would have to be some other considerations made to make everything equitable.

    #81364
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    CariocaCardinal
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    The idea of the worst teams getting higher draft picks is rooted in the idea of creating a more competitive system. Are the owners going to abandon that idea?

    #81368
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    forsch31
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    It might be a tough sell. However, I don’t see another way to take away the incentive to tank.

    #81644
    Brian Walton
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    I find this to be super interesting, especially coming from a player whose Arizona team recently traded away their best player and cornerstone after winning 82 games last season. Fangraphs has the D-backs falling to 79 wins in 2019.

    #81659
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    gscottar
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    I’m sure the Dbacks brass will love seeing that! Has Souza been taking PR tips from Tommy Pham?

    #81696
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    SoonerinNC
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    In reference to Brian’s article on this subject I clearly understand why the union person felt that most fans favor the owners.

    But my sense is that most fans favor the players. A simple poll of this site would be interesting.

    #81727
    Brian Walton
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