2023 StL Game #67: Monday, June 12 vs. Giants

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  • #224023
    Brian Walton
    Keymaster

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    6:45 p.m.
    LHP Matthew Liberatore (1-2, 6.00) vs. RHP Logan Webb (4-6, 3.09)
    BSM // KMOX // WIJR
    (and Bally Sports Southeast/Southwest Extra)

    #224112
    ZTR
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    I can see a win for the Cardinals here.

    Liberatore is due for a good game.

    #224114
    blingboy
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    My understanding is O’Neill is closer than nootbaar. I think the defense would be worth the strike outs right now. I’d like to see Walker at DH for now. And let Willson rest up for a couple weeks. We are just giving up too much. The opposition finds the week spots.

    #224123
    Lee
    Participant

    If Libby can’t locate, it will be a long game.. (or maybe a short one for him.). has had troubles lately.
    If he can’t fix immediately, he needs to head south and work on command in aaa, not in majors.. unless the Cards are going to throw in the towel for this year..but I don’t think we are at that point yet, thx to the weak division.

    #224125
    bicyclemike
    Moderator

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    Checked the numbers to date and Arozarena has 10.4 WAR, and Libby -0.6. A net loss so far but not a huge deficit if Libby can get consistent as a full time big league starter.

    Randy has done well though and has his own special following in Tampa with “Randy Land”, the section of seats in left field at Tropicana Park.

    Randy is having a good early career, but not overwheling. Still if he picks up the pace a little he would project to Scott Rolen-like numbers.

    As for Libby, I would prefer him starting every five days to Wainwright. Libby is the future and needs to get the reps.

    #224126
    gscottar
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    #224131
    stlcard25
    Participant

    Ouch, one of the decent relievers gone. Never ever good to have a forearm strain. The wheels are quickly coming off this bus.

    #224132
    blingboy
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    1. Brendan Donovan (L) 2B
    2. Paul Goldschmidt (R) 1B
    3. Nolan Gorman (L) DH
    4. Nolan Arenado (R) 3B
    5. Willson Contreras (R) C
    6. Dylan Carlson (S) RF
    7. Jordan Walker (R) LF
    8. Paul DeJong (R) SS
    9. Tommy Edman (S) CF

    #224133
    1toughdominican
    Participant

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    Not good news. He’s been respectable with an ERA of 3.24 this season and has only been touched up for 1 HR, but he’s allowed 9 ER’s in 25 IP’ed which is the total ER’s he allowed all last season in almost 65 innings of work. Several of those ER’s runs charged to him this season have resulted from BB’s coming around to score. He was a genuine lock last season until that first WC game, but that’s what everyone will remember. That’s just the way it goes.

    #224134
    1toughdominican
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    I’m surprised people haven’t begun to mispell Tommy Edmond’s name in CF…

    #224138
    Ratsbuddy
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    I continue to wonder why Contreras is batting 5th???

    If he has an 0-4 tonight he will be below the Mendoza line, perhaps.

    #224139
    Euro Dandy
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    I continue to wonder why Contreras is batting 5th???

    If he has an 0-4 tonight he will be below the Mendoza line, perhaps.

    On the other hand, if Willy goes 30-30 over the next 7 games, he’ll be batting .300 — it’s all part of the amazing job Oli is doing. It’s how you earn trust.

    #224140
    Euro Dandy
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    I’m surprised people haven’t begun to mispell Tommy Edmond’s name in CF…

    Nobody’s going to mispell a great CFer’s name like Tommy Ballgame. But they might mispell misspell. Sorry 1td, I couldn’t resist, haha.

    #224141
    Euro Dandy
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    The wheels are quickly coming off this bus.

    stlcard, were looking at different buses. I don’t see any wheels, lol.

    #224142
    1toughdominican
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    Ohh, boy…I sure ‘missjudged’ that one, Euro!…I’ll stay out CF and let Tommy Edmonds run down those tough ones. I should have known better. I mean, he did get into Stanford…Haha!

    #224143
    Euro Dandy
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    I think they need to keep going with Libby as a regular starter at this point. It really doesn’t matter this season, and even if it does later because the Central is so bad, who’s going to do better? It’s time to see what he’s made of against the big boys on an extended basis. It might prove to be a really bad idea if the Cards go that route, but I want to see it play out. I’ve always thought the bend in his breaking stuff is too smooth, but you never know, he might respond.

    #224144
    Ratsbuddy
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    This article thinks the forearm strain could be bad. Maybe even lead to Tommy John surgery. Does he know what he’s talking about?

    https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/mlb/st-louis-cardinals-season-from-hell-just-got-a-lot-worse/ar-AA1csj6F?ocid=hpmsn&cvid=9fabf8d77fc54df993a0cf4b4db9a115&ei=12

    #224145
    blingboy
    Participant

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    Sometimes a TJ surgery doesn’t hold up, or the elbow otherwise continues to have problems. I hope that is not the case with Helsley, but he has been on the IL for his elbow before subsequent to coming back from the TJ a few years ago. At any rate, ‘forearm strain’ usually means a lengthy IL stint.

    #224146
    blingboy
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    It seems like a contributing factor to the poor performance is management decisions based upon factors other than what gives us the best chance of winning. I don’t mean to say that Ollie gets to make those decisions, but whoever is, it is hurting the team.

    The team would have a better chance with Knizner behind the plate right now. The money trumps that, though. But it doesn’t explain why he remains in the middle of the order. With Gorman its not money but tout that keeps him there at #3 despite continuing to be dreadful. It seems undenyable that we would be better with Donovan in LF and Walker at DH. That even though Donnie is not a geat outfielder, he would give away less that Walker does. But there is the tout involved in that as well.

    #224148
    blingboy
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    Ha, I just forgot Bochy isn’t with SF anymore.

    #224149
    1toughdominican
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    Giants are a game above .500, but find themselves in a similar position as the Cardinals at 7 back in the NLW. I also noticed that the first place DBacks now lead the Dodgers by 3.5 games and are tied with the Braves for the best record in the NL.

    #224150
    1toughdominican
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    Looking at the standings you’d think Bochy may have wandered off to Miami…

    #224151
    CardsRedSox4Ever
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    Well, Walker is no Ricky Henderson. Just sayin.’

    #224152
    1toughdominican
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    No, he really isn’t. Rickey may have been the most devastating offensive force I’ve ever seen play in this league. He just created countless problems that could be termed a genuine crisis every time he stepped into the box and subsequently reached base. It almost wasn’t fair to the defense.

    #224153
    CardsRedSox4Ever
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    And Contreras is just an out machine these days. If I were the Giants with 2 outs and no one on, I’d walk three batters to get to Contreras. I think the analytics would probably support that too.

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