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“Isn’t there a DSL catching prospect that put up very good numbers?”
You’re thinking of Juan Rujano, 27, who just turned 18 in December. Big backstop (6′ 3″ and 190) who posted a solid 120 OPS+ or so in the DSL last year. Bad news, he fanned 23% of the time, which is awfully high for that level of competition.
Good news, he seemed to be much, much better by the end of their brief season.
Started 3-29 with just 3 walks and 9 whiffs. Thereafter, he mashed .333/.466/.516 with an acceptable 16/25 BB/K. Strong arm and big exit velocities for a teenager.I think they should bring up Crooks up if he continues hitting like this for another week. Send Pozo down and give Crooks the majority of the starts at catcher.
I see the roster matrix has Rujano on the FCL roster so we will see how he does in the US. Their season starts beginning of May. He’s big. Two Rainiels.
Thanks for all of the interesting responses, guys.
“P.S. Other teams might prefer Rainiel Rodriguez, who is now a consensus top 100 prospect in baseball.”
Calling Rodriguez a consensus top 100 prospect is like calling Meryl Streep a good actress. Factually true, but one heckuvan understatement.
Here’s his ranks, worst to best:
Baseball America 35th
MLB Pipeline 34th
Keith Law 29th
ZiPS computer model 26th
Fangraphs 25th
ESPN 19th
Baseball Prospectus 16th
OOPSY projection system 3rdLooks like consensus top 30. And the mean of the above rankings is 24th. Not too shabby.
Anyway, since there’s been so much speculation on this thread about the future of the catcher position in St. Louis, here’s my platonic ideal moving forward — assuming all of these guys keep performing well, and stay generally healthy. (That’ll never happen, of course. This is just the dream version.)
Herrera becomes full-time designated hitter (and emergency backup backstop) and signs an extension through age 31 or 32. Crooks and Bernal become a catching tandem long term, dividing plate appearances fairly equally. Rai-Rod switches to the hot corner, assuming he has average aptitude there. And the strapping Juan Rujano moves to the outfield — LF if he runs okay, RF if he doesn’t.
I think Brian is right with not needing Pages and Pozo.
Short run I’d bring up Crooks and send Pages to AAA to be the 3rd catcher called up in case of injury. Give Crooks the time Pages has gotten. I’d also drop Pozo from the 40-man and add a bat from Memphis, but I’m unsure just now which bat. See what Crooks can give you, and if Crooks and Herrera can cover the C, with Herrera getting enough DH time to get to 150 starts a year (maybe 60 at C, 90 at DH), and Crooks getting some DH time too (maybe 100 at C, 30 at DH) would work. If so, then Bernal might be that trade piece bling mentioned.
I like Bob Reed’s idea of moving Rodriguez to 3B.
I like Bob Reed’s idea of moving Rodriguez to 3B.
They would have to start now and see if it works. Anyway, we will have to see how an under
size guy gets along in the upper levels. I am not biting yet despite what the algos think. If we end up with a really good catcher out of all this it will be fantastic. Talk about having all these guys stuffed into the lineup somehow is just silliness, IMO.bling, which of these catchers could fetch a 150-game starting outfielder in trade?
Herrera.
He is the only one who has demonstrated success in MLB. Hopefully, Crooks can be added to the list sometime this year, followed by Bernal. Of course, they have to be good at the MLB level, which is less sure than everyone thinks. If more than one of them is good, we should trade one for an outfielder.
If it was me in charge, I would try to trade Herrera for a young starting outfielder ASAP, before Herrera has a chance to fade. It is a risk assuming at least one of Crooks or Bernal will step up, but a risk worth taking.
I don’t think Crooks is ready for MLB yet. His AAA performance is very hit or miss quite literally. He needs to stay there a while longer and work on his plate discipline. He is striking out 36% of the time. It isn’t just bad discipline as he has a very bad rate of swinging at 38.9% of pitches out of the zone. He is also just whiffing a lot with a 18.8% whiff rate which does not inspire confidence. MLB pitchers are going to exploit his discipline and I think Crooks would struggle if called up today.
Between Crooks and Bernal, statistically even if both are projected to be a median of a big league, one will fail to live up to that most likely. My realistic hope is we get at least 1 above average regular and 1 backup C out of the trio of Crooks, Verbal, Rainiel.
I don’t think Crooks is ready for MLB yet. His AAA performance is very hit or miss quite literally. He needs to stay there a while longer and work on his plate discipline. He is striking out 36% of the time.
There is nothing unusual about results in the upper levels falling short of the hype. The Cardinals org should get more aggressive in the area of trading highly ranked prospects for MLB ready talent. Being in rebuild mode doesn’t mean we always have to take the long odds hoping for the jackpot. Sometimes take the better odds of turning one in the bush into one in the hand. Heck, if we could get a pretty good outfielder who would be around for 4 or 5 years for Rainiel, the odds are good we would come out ahead.
“Heck, if we could get a pretty good outfielder who would be around for 4 or 5 years for Rainiel, the odds are good we would come out ahead.”
If by “pretty good outfielder,” you mean a 2-3 WAR guy, then no, I wouldn’t make that deal. Spending substantial money or prospect capital on a 2-3 WAR outfielder is exactly what the Birds did when they went after Fowler and Ozuna — the double debacle that veered the club toward the general mediocrity since 2015.
If on the other hand it’s a 3-4 WAR outfielder, then I almost certainly would do the deal. (But only if I was 99% sure that Rai-Rod couldn’t be successfully converted to the hot corner.)
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On an unrelated note, Chase Heath homered today. This means that over his most recent 14 games for Palm Beach, stretching back to last year, he’s hitting .370/.482/.696 with 5 homers in 46 AB’s and a stellar 9/8 BB/K ratio.
Bob, that trade brings back some bad memories. To trade away 2 quality pitchers for 2 years of Ozuna is one of the worst trades in recent memory.
Very interesting point about Heath. In only 75 abs he has amassed very impressive offensive numbers. He should more playing time going forward. Let’s see if he can sustain these numbers. Hopefully he gets the Bernal/Crooks treatment. Play him every day at catcher, dh, ad 1b He’s done great as a 20th round pick.
(But only if I was 99% sure that Rai-Rod couldn’t be successfully converted to the hot corner.)
You’re not going to be 99% sure he can be an MLB third baseman until he does it in MLB. That is the bird in the bush part.
My point isn’t about Rainiel in particular. It is the proposition that rebuild doesn’t mean always taking the long odds hoping for a jackpot. Alternatively, sometimes try for the jackpot, but also pay the rent.
Good discussion all around. ATM makes sense why they don’t have Crooks here now. Good points by all. Ideal scenario if Rainiel could hit and play third. I’m thinking about Blings suggestion to trade Herrera. Let’s pretend he’s hitting and you get offered a 2-3 war outfielder.
Rainiel I would not trade personally and I also see litte chance of him moving to 3rd. Rainiel is the best bat in the org and one of the best hitting prospects in baseball. It doesn’t matter to me if Rainiel is C, 1B, LF, or DH, he has a middle of the lineup 30 HR potential. Teams generally don’t do top prospect for top prospect trades and even then for an OF prospect only maybe Josue De Paula has a similar bat upside but the Dodgers aren’t trading him for a C prospect. Trading Rainiel for an OF would require getting a lesser player in return. To me I’ll just take Rainiel’s bat potential wherever it plays.
I’m not trading any of the C until at least the deadline and maybe the offseason. I want to give Herrera enough run way to see how much he can catch. If the team thinks none at all by that point, I likely keep both Crooks and Bernal to have better odds of getting a starting caliber C. If Herrera can play back there even at the 40% rate he is to start the year, Crooks is the one I would lean toward trading. Bernal has more upside to me and I think he has a much better future bat than Crooks.
For trading off the MLB roster, Burly seems like the choice to me over Herrera and both do have some value although Herrera more. Burly is already on an arb salary and that one less year of service control means he is less likely to help contending Cards teams. The team should be able to have someone move to 1B if needed should Burly be traded. I wouldn’t rush to trade him to trade him though.
An example of the thinking. If you decide Raiiel is your lottery ticket and you believe, then you don’t need all of Herrera, Crooks and Bernal to get you there. You could have traded one this spring and another this winter if Rainiel is still tracking. Most touts fade vs better opposition so you have to diversify risk by playing the odds.
As our plethora of milb catching candidates make their way to STL it is going to be increasingly difficult to keep both Herrera and Burly on the same roster unless the Cardinals are fine with one of them being a full time DH. Most teams don’t want a full time DH.
So I could envision Herrera or Burly becoming trade bait along with at least one of Crooks, Bernal, or Rainiel. To bling’s point it might make sense to move one of the milb catchers now before their shine wears off. I acknowledge that is a glass half empty apporoach but it is also reality. Why not cash in while you can instead of rolling the dice and coming up with nothing?
Of course you would need to be able to choose which one to move. That was always Mo’s propblem. He usually chose wrong. I am hoping this front office is better at internal talent evaluation.
GScott hit the nail. We have to be honest with ourselves with our internal evaluations and act accordingly.
Ivan Herrera is only 25 years old, so very likely to just be entering his prime as a hitter. And he’s already very, very good.
Sometimes when a team is mediocre for several years in a row, as the Cardinals have obviously been, their best players get undervalued even by their own fan base. Here’s how well Herrera has hit over the past three seasons, compared to some well-known others.
OPS+ from 2023-2025
Mookie Betts 136
Kyle Schwarber 135
Cal Raleigh 133
Ivan Herrera 133
Rafael Devers 132
Jose Ramirez 132
Francisco Lindor 129
Pete Alonso 128Overall, Herrera ranks 19th in all of MLB over the 3-year span (min. 750 PA’s). For me, he’s a guy you offer a reasonable contract extension to, rather than someone you deal away — even if he’s only a DH and nothing but a DH. Because his major and minor league track records strongly imply that he’s gonna keep right on hitting like this for at least another half decade.
With his nagging leg injuries and sometimes ridiculous #2 lineup slot (he’s posted a sub-.800 OPS batting second in his career, and .900 hitting 5th/6th) Ivan The Terrific hasn’t gotten the RBI opportunities that his talent warrants. But he’s an outstanding hitter who just needs the chance to show it better. I really hope they keep him around.
Bob, I hope they keep Herrera as well. If they have to choose between the two players I would rather see Ivan become the long term 1B. I like Burly a lot but Ivan has more upside to me as long as he isn’t catching. Catching is just going to cause him more injuries and impact his offense.
I do not support trading Herrera or Burly, even in this rebuild(it is folks, not a retool) you have to have a couple of anchors.
That being said, Herrera needs to accept being the LF or 1B! He can’t clog up the DH spot for 4 years. I mentioned this yesterday, but Baez will be the CF at some point in 2027 and they will still need a LF. Heck, put Burly out there and Herrera at first!
Is Baez really a CF? I know he is playing there in Memphis, but every scouting report I have read on him projects him to be average defensively in the corners with a plus arm.
Defense – MLB 50, BA 50, FG 45
Arm – MLB 60, BA 60, FG 55I don’t think there is any major help coming at CF from the farm at least for a while unless Peete does look like he will stick there and have enough hit tool to make the bigs.
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