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This may be an ongoing topic, so I decided to start a thread.
Perhaps he has improved enough to transition into the rotation. However, his minors results are not encouraging. Coming up as a starter, the last time Leahy had an ERA under 5.00 was in High-A in 2019. His final season starting was 2022, when he had a 5.23 ERA in 26 starts (and one relief outing) for Springfield. Going forward from there, he relieved almost exclusively with a few spot starts mixed in.
At Springfield the year before, 2021, Pallante posted a 3.82 ERA in 21 starts. A difference is that Pallante was given very little time at Triple-A before being brought into MLB action.
I suppose he deserves a shot as a starter next season especially if Gray leaves but would he be on an innings limit? We are going to be so desperate for innings as it is that is not going to help the situation.
Libby, as Leahys’ example, IF deserving. If you have to pull Leahy from the rotation, nothing lost. If he succeeds, 150 IP would help in 2026.
“Alluring”! Choo-choo, here comes the hype train!
Kyle Leahy throws three scoreless frames, allows one hit and promptly erases it with a 4-6-3 double play ball. Struck out one, didn't walk a hitter.
A promising early look at someone who should be an alluring starting pitching candidate next year.
— Katie Woo (@katiejwoo) September 28, 2025
If the hype is about his four pitch types all having positive value, it’s true. Same guy for two seasons now.
They are not a serious franchise any longer if they are seriously considering this (debatable that they aren’t already). They are the freaking Pirates more and more each day.
80 pitch 5 inning guy – twice through the lineup – min wage. I can see that being the plan. I don’t know if it would work, but it seems plausible, and starters don’t grow on trees. League average is going to have to be good enough for a couple years at least until hopefully the pipeline gets fixed, and some way is found to grow or acquire difference makers.
This would allow them to pencil in the starters for next year as Gray, Pallante, Liberatore, Leahy, and McGreevy with Mathews on deck. Alluring indeed.
This would allow them to pencil in the starters for next year as Gray, Pallante, Liberatore, Leahy, and McGreevy with Mathews on deck. Alluring indeed.
Good chance Gray is subtracted from that list unfortunately.
They are not a serious franchise any longer if they are seriously considering this (debatable that they aren’t already). They are the freaking Pirates more and more each day.
You must have said the same thing when Larissa tried this with Brad Thompson and Braden Looper.
Step back from the ledge. I’m in the ain’t broke don’t fix category myself but we are in a transition phase and at worst if it doesn’t work they can just send him back the pen.
Me personally thinks we should go out and get two rental starters if Pallante is DFA or put back in the pen and Gray is traded. We don’t have anything ready to go in the minors for another year. Getting some help like we did in 24 via FA wouldn’t be the worst idea. Back end starters to fill inning that can be dealt at the deadline.
The serviceable starter role has evolved into an 80 pitch five inning guy not expected to go beyond twice through the batting order. That is a lot more reachable for Leahy than moving into the rotation was back when Brad Thompson and Looper were trying to do it.
Gray has no trade value. In fact, it’s negative. I can’t see them eating salary to placate him.
There’s also a point where we have to maintain a minimum team salary and keeping the big three seems like an easy way to do that to me. Why trade Gray to save $20M if you have to turn around and give $20M to a lesser starter?
If they move the alluring Leahy to starter, then they don’t even have to go after any free agent starters (if Gray stays)
Kyle Leahy is 28 years old and the last time he was remotely effective as a *starting* pitcher was when he was 22 years old in Low A-ball. In High-A his ERA was 6.30, in AA it was 6.28, and in AAA it was 6.31 across 2022/23 before switching to full-time reliever.
To the best of my knowledge, in the 150 or so years of major league baseball, no pitcher with Kyle’s overwhelmingly consistent track record of frustration and futility as a minor league starter has ever gone on to be an effective MLB starter. Maybe Kyle Leahy will be the first. Or maybe he’s a 17th-round draft pick who’s found his niche and the Cardinal organization should be overjoyed with his development and leave him where he’s finally having success.
The thing about having him throw 88 innings out of the bullpen this year (most in the Senior Circuit), it’s a significant health risk. And the thing with converting him back to starting…well, why mess with success?
Bob, I’ve been mostly with you on this one all along. I watched enough of Leahy starting in the minors to think it’s a bad idea to ever go back. His control has never been great with too many balls left over the middle of the plate. That’s still the case today. He just gets away with it because he almost never sees a hitter twice now.
All that said, his sweeper is a new pitch for him and he seems to command it well. Sometimes it is even borderline excellent. I could see a world where Leahy could be about what Kyle Gibson gave us last season. That’s #4 starter potential with somewhat of an innings limit and a hit to the bullpen. Is it worth it? Maybe if we’re desperate for starters it could be. That’s where my head is now. If the team is unwilling to spend anything on starting pitching, then I guess Leahy is a better internal option than others. But it’s not really ideal.
Gray has no trade value. In fact, it’s negative. I can’t see them eating salary to placate him.
I think they will most certainly do it if he waives the NTC. And they aren’t trying to placate Gray. They are trying to placate BDW’s budget.
Why trade Gray to save $20M if you have to turn around and give $20M to a lesser starter?
I wouldn’t count on the $20M in savings to be used to buy another starter. Most likely it goes into the bank.
We want these guys to develop and take steps forward. If your previous evaluation no longer fits, take a fresh look. You could drop the minors baggage as Leahy has. What’s to lose? He is “ruined” as a reliever if he doesn’t succeed in the rotation?
I just want to mention that O’Brien didn’t settle in until after the age of 30, and that, so far, he looks like our 8th inning guy for 2026. Also, Gorman, Walker, Arenado (hate to see him go), possibly Gray, and possibly even Contreras (I’d like to see Herrera at first base) could be part of a trade that could bring back a starting pitcher. We also have a prospect here or there that could get us a starting pitcher if we could find a deal that made sense. The Cardinals are not without options.
“You could drop the minors baggage as Leahy has. What’s to lose? He is “ruined” as a reliever if he doesn’t succeed in the rotation?”
Here’s what’s to lose. See if this doesn’t sound like exactly what will happen.
Marmol watches Leahy in Spring Training and sees an extremely inconsistent but occasionally effective starting pitcher — just like the 2025 versions of Andre Pallante and Miles Mikolas. So Marmol decides that Leahy has the raw talent to be a starting pitcher and sends him to the mound over and over in 2026, despite an ERA around 5.00, or maybe worse. There are no obviously superior alternatives, so this goes on for two or three years, or however long Ollie is permitted to (mis)manage the club.That’s the risk. That’s what’s to lose. A potentially excellent reliever is lost and another crappy Pallantesque starter is gained. At a time, mind you, when really good relievers are more valuable than any other moment in the history of the sport. I realize I don’t need to say this, but a reliever with an ERA of 3.00 helps you win, and a starter with an ERA of 5.00 helps you lose.
What makes this whole thing truly absurd, is that this Redbird combo of manager/pitching coach that’s supposed to turn Kyle Leahy into an effective starting major league pitcher, has over the past two seasons somehow turned an already terrific MLB starter into a mediocre journeyman. Sonny Gray, 2019-2021 with Cincy, ERA+ of 135. In 2022-2023 with the Twins, ERA+ of 144. Last two years with Ollie & Dusty, ERA+ of 101. Sonny’s still got the goods. Outstanding health, spectacular K/BB ratios, best of his career. But he isn’t preventing runs.
So with Cincy, he was Randy Johnson or Rube Waddell (both 135 career ERA+)
With Minnesota, he was roughly Roger Clemens or Addie Joss (both 143)
As a Cardinal, he’s been Oil Can Boyd or Rick Wise (each 101)But I digress. Point is, Leahy has struggled badly for year upon year, and now he’s finally found something that works for him at the highest level of his profession. Leave him alone and let the man have a few good years out of the bullpen.
We don’t know who internally is pushing the Leahy as a starter initiative, but I do agree that I wish the Cardinals would leave him alone.
Ok, not Leahy, cool. Pick another name. One that did well in A-ball 5yrs ago, plug and play. Your call, you guys are the gurus.
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