September 23, 2022 at 4:00 pm #202055RatsbuddyParticipantFree
For those of you that remember Ken Reitz I am just wondering how you think him and Arenado stack up? I guess the question is that if you were taking into consideration defense and defense ONLY for your 3rdbaseman then which one would you choose?
For those of you that might not remember Kenny Reitz playing for the Cardinals back in the 1970s he was nicknamed The Zamboni Machine. And, of course, there was a reason he was called that as well. He didn’t win the Gold Glove as much because Mike Schmidt won it with his offense. But Reitz did win the Gold Glove in 1975, finished his career with the highest all-time career fielding percentage, and led the NL in fielding percentage six times, which is a record.
I think alot of people have forgotten just how good Reitz was.
r/Esteemed RatSeptember 23, 2022 at 4:16 pm #202057gscottarParticipantPaid - Annual
Reitz was a very good 3B but I don’t recall him making the flashy and spectacular plays that Arenado makes. Kenny was also a painfully slow runner but that didn’t really detract from his defense. The zamboni machine was very good.
If I had to rank Cardinal 3B from the last 50 years based on defense I would go with:
5. OberkfellSeptember 23, 2022 at 5:03 pm #202065Nigel TParticipantPaid - Three Months
No comparison. Arenado, Rolen, Pendleton were all superior. Kenny had Yadi’s speed. Reitz would sling the ball across and didn’t possess the arm of Rolen or Nolan.
Reitz was my favorite player, though. When the excitement of spring came, Reitz would start out white hot and lead the league in batting average for three weeks.
He was a terrific fielder, but Arenado and even Rolen must be in the conversation for GOAT at the hot corner.September 23, 2022 at 5:06 pm #202066Nigel TParticipantPaid - Three Months
Kenny was undone by his personal demons and Mike Schmidt’s home run power.September 23, 2022 at 5:13 pm #2020671982 willieParticipantPaid - Annual
I loved Kenny. He never was one to make those exceptional plays like arenado does and to a lesser degree rolen. But since like rolen, he hardly ever booted the routine play, I put him above arenado if you take offense out of the equation. Do defensively I go with rolen, Reitz, and then arenado cause to me a great player should almost always make the routine play. Things happen but with arenado it happens too frequently.September 23, 2022 at 5:18 pm #202068Euro DandyParticipantFree
Nigel, Reitz was Mr April for sure! That was always funny to me. With my poor memory, it seemed like it happened every year, but probably not nearly as often as I think.
As for Rat’s question, I try to give the older players their due, because I do believe recency bias causes them be overlooked as each new generation sees what they see. However, in this case I don’t put Reitz on the same level as Arenado or Rolen.September 24, 2022 at 7:46 pm #202251bicyclemikeModeratorPaid - Annual
Loved Reitz as a player as he had that excitement about the game similar to what you see with Nootbaar on today’s club.
Whenever I think of Reitz I have this visual that comes to mind, from a game in Dodger Stadium. It would have been 1975, and the Dodgers had a guy on first. The hitter attempted a sacrifice bunt (yeah, they did that back then), and the ball was sort of looped in the air towards third. Reitz charged in and played it like he would snag it in the air, but then stepped back, let the ball bounce, and started a 5-4-3 double play. Really heads up play and I can still see it play out.
Hard to say on who was better because back then I did not see Cardinal games on TV most every night. We see Arenado a lot and the guy is amazing. But maybe had we seen Reitz all the time we would appreciate him more. We have to go more on reputation, and maybe an occasional memory from some of us older fans.
All I will say is the franchise has been blessed with some great defensive third baseman, including the guy in my avatar, as well as others that have been mentioned in this thread.November 12, 2022 at 10:17 am #206624RatsbuddyParticipantFree
I see where Arenado won the Platinum Glove award for about the 6th year in a row, or something like that. He’s pretty good. So was Kenny Reitz.
r/Esteemed Rat<~~~~who has a couple inches of snow on the ground this morning.November 12, 2022 at 10:48 am #2066251982 willieParticipantPaid - Annual
Yea I don’t know what goes into determining these platinum awards. It’s hard for me to believe arenado is the best fielder in the league. If so great defense has really became a lost artNovember 12, 2022 at 10:58 am #206628
Reitz was an outstanding defensive 3B’man, but like some have pointed out, Mike Schmidt had the inside track on the NL GG Award at that position during most of Reitz’ career. I had forgotten that before Schmidt made his debut, Doug Rader had a stranglehold on the GG award at 3B in the NL. At any rate, Reitz’ primary contribution to Cardinald success was the fact that he, along with Leon Durham, were the two players sent to the Cubs in exchange for Bruce Sutter during the winter of ’80.November 12, 2022 at 11:12 am #206633
1982willie…Arenado undoubtedly gets outs on plays that I don’t think any other human is capable of making. That said, I’m not sure I’ve ever seen someone with his level of talent occasionally botch a relatively routine play. The GB to the left side of the IF this past post-season in game #1 was a glaring example. My impression is that he sometimes tries to showcase his extraordinary skills to a level that gets him in trouble. He’s only been a Cardinal for two seasons, but at this juncture, I felt more comfortable with Scott Rolen manning up at 3B.November 12, 2022 at 1:16 pm #206637Cardinal in FranceParticipantFree
I’m surprised Ken Boyer doesn’t rate a line or two in this conversation. He’s the only one besides Arenado to win an MVP.November 12, 2022 at 2:08 pm #206641
Pretty sure Arenado has yet to win an MVP award. Five GG awards demonstrate that Boyer was outstanding with the glove, but interestingly enough all 5 GG’s were awarded to him before his ’64 NL MVP season. Santo took over that 3B GG award in ’64 and Doug Rader took command of it in ’70 until Mike Schmidt showed up.
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