2017 MLB Game #135: Cards at Giants Sat Sep 2

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  • #32275
    Avatarforsch31
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    795 times. What do I win?

    #32277
    Euro DandyEuro Dandy
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    Actually there were 30 outs today, so the math is a little off…but you make a good point. There isn’t a single manager in the league that has struck out fewer times than Matheny has this year. That’s got to be what sets him apart.
    And I bet when he yanked Lyons to set up the Posey vs Oh matchup, he told Oh to not give up a hit. Something probably got lost in the translation and Oh didn’t understand the message, or Oh just decided to give up the hit regardless of anything Matheny said. Who could’ve seen this outcome happening?

    #32278
    Avatar858booyah
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    Mike Matheny strikes out all the time. Putting Sheriff against a guy with a .958 OPS against lefties is a perfect example.

    Not using Tommy Pham as a PH is another. All indications are he was available and even Pham himself said he’d be ready to go last night?

    So if you want to chest thump your Matheny card tomorrow if we win go ahead but almost no one wants to hear it tonight. He’s the manager and he takes the blame when we lose and the players don’t perform or puts them in positions to fail. End of story!

    #32279
    AvatarNJ315
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    You are not answering my question when the players do well does Matheny get credit? Yes or No simple question.

    #32280
    AvatarTexasCard
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    I don’t holler after every loss about the manager. Today though without a doubt tells me that he needs to go. No way on this planet am I taking Lynn out of that game. The man can’t manage its as simple as that.

    #32281
    Avatar858booyah
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    When the results in the standings lead us back into the playoffs and even then he’s shown a propensity to be slow to the party. This is where a veteran guy like Gardenhire on the bench would do wonders. Even though Magic Mike would look at it as gestapo tactics. We can’t rattle his world one bit now can we?

    But this team wants a bunch of yes men! Yes massa, yes sir, no sir, play the had your dealt sonny. Matheny has no stones and is just happy to have a job. Guy doesn’t have balls to go against the company line and demand some trades like someone else would’ve.

    Guy will never win a world series here and shouldn’t be the manager of this franchise! Anyone who defends him doesn’t want to win and has been brainwashed by the Cardinal way.

    #32282
    Avatarbccran
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    858 – I defend him and I want to win as much as anyone and I’m not brainwashed (and have probably been a Cardinal fan a lot longer than most on here).

    #32283
    AvatarTexasCard
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    Well they have their excuse. It was a blister.

    #32285
    Avatar14NyquisT
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    Down 7 on Sept.3…. only the “won’t give up until we’re mathematically eliminated” die-hard Cardinal fans are thinking Oct. play this season. Anyone with a sense of reality can see that the results like yesterday’s loss to the Giants have occurred too often this season and that is why this team is a .500 club. Too many Ks and not enough offense has doomed the Cards…. not to mention the lousy bullpen.

    #32298
    CardsRedSox4EverCardsRedSox4Ever
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    We’re headed back to the 90’s unless some big changes are made soon.

    #32299
    Avatarbccran
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    With all cylinders pumping, they can go toe to toe with anybody.

    #32300
    AvatarNJ315
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    bccran can you expand on what do you mean by this…After every Cardinals loss, there’s a certain “element” that just has to blame it on the manager.?

    #32309
    Avatarbccran
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    Sure, there are some people who are into analyzing everything a manager does in a game. In a loss, they will usually criticize him for the lineup, pinch hitter use, poor management of the bullpen, etc. It’s what they like and choose to do. Others, just enjoy watching the players’ performances, and aren’t really into tactics.

    #32310
    AvatarTexasCard
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    #32311
    Avatarmspaid
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    No, BC:

    They problem is they ARE pumping all cylinders; they’re just not that good. The whole notion that we have the talent we need they just have to play better has been used by these owners for years. Walt used to say that and Mo has many times. There are just too many guys on this team who are pedestrian. If they show up at spring training with this same roster, and admonishing people to “play better” then 20218 will be just as crappy as 2017. There needs to be a complete house cleaning this winter with big signings and big trades IF they want this team to get better. If they don’t care then they won’t do anything again.

    #32312
    AvatarLoganAlpha30X7
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    I do know that I’ve seen Matheny’s name on the list of managers that could be on the hot seat if the team doesn’t do well this year, the hot seat or one of those that loses his job…

    #32314
    RatsbuddyRatsbuddy
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    The Cardinals do NOT, under any circumstances, need revamped or rebuilt or the house cleaned. They just need two, maybe three key players. Alex Reyes might end up being one of them. Then a late reliever and a big bat and who knows, I can envision 90+ wins in 2018 – easily.

    r/Rat

    #32316
    Avatarbccran
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    Rats speaks logic.

    #32317
    AvatarLoganAlpha30X7
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    I think that we need more than three, our entire outfield looks to not be able to even play in the majority of the games of the season and plenty of other positions need an upgrade as well, we don’t need to fully blow it up but I think that we need several new players, and Reyes and the like don’t count imho…

    #32319
    Euro DandyEuro Dandy
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    Two or three pieces might do the trick if they are very high value types. But who really believes our current execs will acquire or trade for MVP-types or CYA-types — not happening. The improvement will be incremental, if at all. Our current roster construction is full of average, with some promising pieces on the horizon. And yes, Matheny is an area that could be targeted for incremental improvement. We have to hope this year’s version of the Cubs is closer to reality than last year’s version…and we can take a step or two forward ourselves.

    #32320
    Avatarbccran
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    OF – Fowler, Pham, and Piscotty. With Grichuk, Martinez, Bader, Martini, O’Neill, Sierra, A. Garcia, and Arozarena all in the picture, I don’t see a big move here that would entail big bucks and blockage.

    IF – Carpenter, Wong, DeJong, and Gyorko. Garcia, Voit, Valera, Diaz, Mejia, etc. providing depth. I could see a big upgrade and move at 3B. Probably via trade.

    C – set with Molina and Kelly.

    SP – Waino, Martinez, Wacha, Weaver, and Reyes as he recovers. Flaherty, Gant, Hudson, Gallen, Gomber, etc. for depth. I don’t see them spending big money here.

    RP – big upgrades needed. Lyons, Tuivailala, Brebbia, Lucas, etc. are a core, but there will definitely be some major moves.

    JMHO.

    #32322
    Euro DandyEuro Dandy
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    bccran, re: your comments on the pen. Although I think everyone agrees much needs to be done, seems like going with the SP surplus to fill the needs might be a viable approach…guys like Hudson and Gant. It would be cheaper and give the prospects a different look than Memphis. I don’t think I like making big moves and $$$ contracts for guys that seem to flame out as quickly as they rise.

    Cards have done it before. It’s an interesting thought considering some people think that pitching staffs in a couple decades might have two “short starters” paired for some games.

    #32327
    AvatarLoganAlpha30X7
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    You trade three of the guys in the outfield and the logjam is gone, Fowler and then whoever would play the other OF spot opposite the guy that we traded for probably wouldn’t play every game so if you traded three guys away and promoted three of the other guys or something like that then the logjam is gone, the infield needs work as nobody is really set there, the bullpen needs a BIG change and we’ve already seen Mo fail in that at least twice with Oh and Cecil. Reyes probably won’t be back fully till late next year at the earliest and the others still need more time before they’re starters…if Wainwright and Martinez struggle again next year our SP spots should be wide open and some trades could help us a lot, not meaning that we should trade for just anybody but…sometimes you need new faces from outside the organization…we’re not spending money and we’re seeing the result, not saying that spending big money automatically means wins but what’s the point of not having any big contracts on the team and watching the playoffs from home year after year…

    #32373
    CardsRedSox4EverCardsRedSox4Ever
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    The wide range of opinions is fascinating, and the best solution probably lies close to the middle. Not a complete house cleaning, but several improvements in key areas. Look, the Cardinals will keep true to their culture which is to rely on homegrown talent and limit trades/free agency. But clearly the bullpen needs major work, outfield some, and 3rd base. It doesn’t matter a whole lot if you get an outfielder who hits .290 vs. the .240 we have now if the bullpen can’t keep games close in 7-9. We would be division leaders now if it weren’t for relief losses in late innings. Reyes could/should be a 15/16 game winner if BP backs him up. Waino possibly if health stays good. Weaver, C-Mart, Wacha should be 10 game winners all. Manager needs to be looked at hard too — he has underperformed even if you factor in mediocre players, particularly with bullpen pitchers.

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