Home › The Cardinal Nation Forums › Open Forum › Trade Ideas/Acquisition Ideas/Non-Cards Rumors – 2017-2018
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December 26, 2017 at 5:09 pm #40612NJ315Participant
The one position Carp should never play is 2B he is putrid there. He is not much better at 3B. Carp either only plays 1B or trade him. Why would you have a super sub that is so defensively challenged. Send Carp to the AL where he can do what he does best hit only.
December 26, 2017 at 8:46 pm #40614gscottar, I guess I am confused. I thought your scenario was signing Lind, which does use a roster spot and he would be the #5 bench player. That means only seven relievers.
If Donaldson is acquired, too, then they would have to trade one of Carpenter or Gyorko just to hold the reserves to five. The way to get to four reserves would be to trade both. I wouldn’t say that is impossible, but is probably so far out there it is not worth talking about, IMO.
December 27, 2017 at 6:58 am #40621I researched Lind and certainly agree he would be better value than Hosmer. But do we need either?
I dont understand why the Nats basically traded Lind for Adams to save $500k. Lind seems more consistent and has some ability to play outfield.
December 27, 2017 at 11:03 am #40653Brian, I’m suggesting we acquire Lind now to platoon at 1B with JMart. Carp would play 3B, DeJong SS, Wong 2B, and either Gyroko or Garcia would be traded (probably Jedd). I don’t think Donaldson would factor into the equation until July or next winter.
My thought process is this would be adding a bat a much cheaper price than Hosmer or Moustakas, frees up payroll space to add another starter and closer now, and keeps Donaldson as an option for the future.
No, I don’t just steal all of Bernie’s ideas but here are his thoughts. I had been thinking about this idea for several weeks.
If Shut Out at 3rd Base, the Cardinals Should Explore a 1st Base Platoon Option
December 27, 2017 at 11:07 am #406556th Starter ideas. I think if any further trades are made to create roster spots, maybe the Cards should consider a plan to conserve innings on potential 6th starter candidates/ relievers:
1) Alex Reyes pitches out of the pen thru mid May or early June. Then he is sent to Memphis to build up his pitch count as a starter.
2) Hudson, Helsley, Gomber, and Gant start at Memphis. Hudson and/or Helsley get called up, and are moved to the pen at the end of July/ early August. This is presuming no injuries occur among the starters, in which case I would think that Gant or Gomber, depending on their performance at Memphis could fill in on a shorter term basis in the rotation.Granted 2 roster spots would be needed, but surely Helsley and Hudson would get a look in September at least any way.
December 27, 2017 at 11:43 am #40656So you want to improve the team by getting rid of Gyorko in favor of Lind.
Last two years, bWAR:
Lind: -0.3, 0.8
Gyorko: 2.9, 3.6How is that a step forward, again?
December 27, 2017 at 12:11 pm #40658PadsFSParticipantCardinals27 – If we open with Martinez, Wacha, Wainwright, Mikolas, and Weaver….wouldn’t Flaherty be the sixth starter?
Then Reyes is seventh, and everyone else falls in line behind that. That’s a lot of depth even for a questionable, health-wise, rotation.
December 27, 2017 at 2:05 pm #40660So you want to improve the team by getting rid of Gyorko in favor of Lind.
Last two years, bWAR:
Lind: -0.3, 0.8
Gyorko: 2.9, 3.6How is that a step forward, again?
I’m not sure it is that simple. Lind is a LH bat, which we need to balance the lineup out. Also, this move could potentially give more ab’s to JMart which is a good thing.
Lastly, It is my opinion we have seen the best of Gyroko and I’m not convinced it will be repeated.
December 27, 2017 at 2:44 pm #40662NJ315ParticipantI can agree that Gyorko will probably won’t do as well in 2018 as 2017 especially if he plays as the everyday 3B. But what makes you think that Linda at age 34 will be 35 by mid-season will have better results than Gyorko. Gyorko is 29. Bringing Lind in is another one of those veteran moves that make no sense. Then you move Carp to 3B which weakens the infield defense. Always looking to save money to sign the big free agent they have never signed. They may sign Donaldson but no way Machado. You balance the lineup by signing Hosmer. I know he is not worth the money so we will always have the Linds of the world. I rather overpay for Hosmer and take my chances. Donaldson will be 33 when he hits free agency. Another “older” veteran signed to a long contract. Whatever.
December 27, 2017 at 2:51 pm #40663It all depends on what you get for Gyrko.
December 27, 2017 at 3:08 pm #40664I’m just trying to think of a way to add another LH bat with some pop while maintaining payroll space for two more major pitching additions. This is a little more complex than Gyroko vs. Lind. Heck, keep Gryoko and move out Garcia, I don’t care. And there are other options out there besides Lind: Morrison, Duda, AGon, etc…
December 27, 2017 at 4:06 pm #4066514NyquisTParticipantJust wondering…. so Gyorko will not be as good in ’18…. but there seems to be no doubt that JMartinez will be as good if not better. Hmmm. I’m not buying into these crystal ball theories based on nothingness.
December 27, 2017 at 4:18 pm #40666NJ315ParticipantIf they can’t afford Hosmer and two major pitching additions then they won’t be competitive ever by penny pinching.
December 27, 2017 at 4:29 pm #4066914NyquisTParticipantHosmer AND TWO major pitching additions… nope. If you go into Card’s command module offices you’ll find copper coins with no Lincoln left to see. This has been going on for a few years. Who was the last ONE major pitching addition? Cecil or Leake? Cards are likely done until ST.
December 27, 2017 at 4:34 pm #40670NJ315Participantwell then they will also ran until the hit the draft jackpot like they did with Pujols
December 27, 2017 at 4:43 pm #40673Just wondering…. so Gyorko will not be as good in ’18…. but there seems to be no doubt that JMartinez will be as good if not better. Hmmm. I’m not buying into these crystal ball theories based on nothingness.
If moving Gyorko helps us afford two major pitching additions then it is well worth going with the crystal ball. JMart still makes the league minimum.
December 27, 2017 at 4:53 pm #40679PadsFSParticipantTyler O’Neill seems like fine depth in the LH hitting department. Carpenter should play 1B every single game against a RH pitcher. I don’t see a lot of value there, which is probably why Adams never played.
If they want to upgrade at SS or 3B and can find a LH hitter, then that is different imo.
December 27, 2017 at 4:57 pm #40680NJ315ParticipantSaving all this money. I am curious who will they sign next year? Harper? Machado? Donaldson( probably because he won’t get 10 yrs but just a lot of money? Anybody else that I can’t think of? Because the two major pitching acquisitions will be on the books already. Who do we trade to “free” up more money? Waino will be gone but who knows maybe they will give him a 3 year 60mill ext like Molina. Will they extend Ozuna? So many needs so little money. I guess if they sign Donaldson then they can’t extend Ozuna.
December 27, 2017 at 5:08 pm #40681PadsFSParticipant14NyquisT
Just wondering…. so Gyorko will not be as good in ’18…. but there seems to be no doubt that JMartinez will be as good if not better. Hmmm. I’m not buying into these crystal ball theories based on nothingness.I don’t get this theory either.
However, JMart, used exclusively in a platoon, would be likely to hold value. Gyorko seems to get exposed as he plays more and no one is advocating putting him in a platoon. Also, a lot of Gyorko’s WAR was tied up in his defense at 3B, that is probably above-average, but not top-five in the league good, as the data suggests in 2016 and 2017.
You really can’t beat a guy that puts up exact 112 wRC+ figures two years in a row. I just see 3B as a really strong place to improve our team, much like RF.
Our 1B production was 5th best in all of baseball and we are bringing back the three main headliners. Meanwhile, 3B production was 17th best in baseball. Garcia and Mejia just played too much there (300 innings combined)
December 27, 2017 at 5:12 pm #40682PadsFSParticipantRight now, I still think they have $29.4M to spend for 2018. They are at $145.6M and should be able to go to $175.0M, or at least get to $158.7M, which leaves $13.1M to spend.
Note: $175M comes from Goold saying that that’s the internal budget that the payroll can go to, while $158M is 5% over last years’ payroll, which is how much they’ve been increasing payroll since 2005.
December 27, 2017 at 8:46 pm #40687Signing Moustakas to play 3B would solve the LH hitter and power. I wouldn’t mind that if they could sign him to the contract he was predicted for in an article I read. I think the figures were 5 years for around $20 million/year or less. I will have to find the article.
December 27, 2017 at 9:52 pm #40688Don’t know if this is what you saw, but MLB Trade Rumors estimated 5 years/$85 million for Moustakas.
https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2017/11/2017-18-top-50-mlb-free-agents-with-predictions.html
Just curious. Who would you jettison off the current roster if you signed him?
December 27, 2017 at 11:15 pm #40694I think that was it.
I would probably look to trade Gyorko or possibly Carpenter. I would create a package to upgrade RP, SP or OF. If some package would bring Archer and Colome, that would work for me. That could also lead to more transactions to complete some upgrades either in the majors or in the minors to improve our depth at all positions.
December 28, 2017 at 10:07 am #40705Tyler O’Neill seems like fine depth in the LH hitting department. Carpenter should play 1B every single game against a RH pitcher. I don’t see a lot of value there, which is probably why Adams never played.
If they want to upgrade at SS or 3B and can find a LH hitter, then that is different imo.
O’Neill is a RH hitter.
December 28, 2017 at 10:08 am #40706Signing Moustakas to play 3B would solve the LH hitter and power. I wouldn’t mind that if they could sign him to the contract he was predicted for in an article I read. I think the figures were 5 years for around $20 million/year or less. I will have to find the article.
My problem with Moustakas is that it completely takes us out of the Donaldson and Machado market next winter.
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