November 10, 2017 at 10:23 am #37597
Bw52, there is certainly no reason that both sides could not sell high. I don’t think that Pham is untouchable, I’d just guess that the Cards would prefer to deal any other outfielder they have instead.November 10, 2017 at 10:31 am #37599
Biggest thing I see happening is all these people saying Stanton to STL makes the most sense is getting alot of cardinal fans excited, and there is going to be ALOT of po’d fans when he ends up going somewhere else and it will just be another example of MO saying well we tried we just finished second crap.November 10, 2017 at 10:48 am #37602
Yes, there are plenty of people who overreact about most anything. The way I see it, Stanton would be nice, but he is far from the only fish in the sea. Try to get it resolved one way or another as quickly as possible and move on to Plan B if needed. Hopefully, Miami is of a similar mindset.November 10, 2017 at 11:24 am #37606
Just do me a favor, somebody.
If/When we trade for Stanton don’t just post here. Either start a NEW thread saying something like “Cards Trade For Stanton” or amend this thread title to include something about a trade has indeed happened.
r/RatNovember 10, 2017 at 11:50 am #37608
I imagine the Cardinals will want to try Pham in CF next year and slide Fowler over to LF. Either way, the two players will occupy some form of LF/CF, leaving RF for the taking.
If we are going after Stanton, there is no room for Piscotty, who plays RF almost exclusively. Grichuk would still have a spot as the 4th outfielder and can play CF if needed. O’Neill is basically the LH version of Grichuk, so if we do end up trading Grichuk, O’Neill has to stay. In this scenario, Harrison Bader is expendable as well though.
I think Piscotty is the primary trade return for the Marlins. I don’t want to lose Dakota Hudson and his slider for the bullpen or Alcantara/Reyes/Flaherty either. They don’t really have a need at catcher so Carson Kelly is out. Jordan Hicks and Luke Weaver make the most sense as the pitching return. So I would say Piscotty, Weaver, Bader, and someone like Aledmys Diaz is about the right package.November 10, 2017 at 12:14 pm #37610
I’m pretty sure O’Neill is a RH hitter.November 10, 2017 at 1:13 pm #37611
Rats: I hate for you to be disappointed but Stanton for the Cardinals is pie in the sky.November 10, 2017 at 1:22 pm #37612
Cards need to keep O
Neill because who else is a power threat in the near future........nobody.Cards have guys like Mercado and Sierra who have stolen base ability and Bader runs well also.Given my choice i would rather lose Piscotty ,Pham,Fowler,Mercado before ONeill,Bader. I would rather keep Grichuk around as spot starter /4th OF with Bader.
Bader is young 23.Flashes some speed and power and was not overwhelmed at the MLB level.
O`Neill young 23 at AAA.Better walk rate than Grichuk and above average OF with exceptional power and some speed.
Grichuk 26 ,Big time power.Good defense.Streaky to the extreme.
Fowler 31 -massive overpay,injury prone,below average defense.Mo screwed the poochy with Fowler deal.
Pham 30 career year.Damn fine season.Injury issues,eye issues.Will he repeat at age 30.Sell high .
Piscotty 27 -can be solid RF but s trending down a bit and still has family issuies trhat obviously affect him.Rumors have said he would like to go to a West Coast team closer to ailing parent.
Sierra 21-speedy slap hitter with good defense.probably 4th OF/PH
Mercado-22 prospect with some pop and speed at Double A ball.
Those are my views and opinions.I realize Fowler is probably not going anywhere and Cards are stuck with his crappy defense,injuries and big salary.November 10, 2017 at 1:56 pm #37613
If we get Stanton then Piscotty probably should go but we will be selling low on him. I believe that he is considerably better than in 2017. We could probably sell high on Grichuk because like all of us many will be intrigued with his tremendous power potential. He could well be one of those guys who suddenly blossom in his late 20’s by figuring out that it is very hard to hit offspeed pitches in the dirt.
I have been pretty skeptical of the possibility of getting Stanton but very few if any have the depth of talented outfield and pitching prospects that we have. This is Mo’s best shot at making an impact with the prospect surplus. It is more about prospects than money. I would much rather have Stanton than Martinez. I am always skeptical of late bloomers.
And yes O’Neill is definitely a right handed hitter. I probably saw 70% of the games he played for Memphis and he never batted from the left side.
November 10, 2017 at 1:58 pm #37615
- This reply was modified 3 months, 1 week ago by SoonerinNC.
Why is everyone saying its Mozeliak that needs to do something? I thought it was Girsch (sp)?
r/RatNovember 10, 2017 at 2:23 pm #37617
I think because a lot of people view Girsch as little more than a figurehead and lacking any real power…November 10, 2017 at 4:37 pm #37621
I don’t view Girsch as a figurehead. Obviously he is below Mo in the chain of command but he comes across as very assertive and knowledgeable to me. I think he is going to have much sway in the day to day operations while Mo will monitor the overall operations of the club.November 10, 2017 at 9:26 pm #37626
Neither Mo or Girsch mean anything. It will be Junior who decides if they get Stanton. It will be Junior who decides if they even call the Marlins. It will be Junior who ultimately decides to go with a second tier slug. It will be Junior who sends Mo and/or Girsch out on a BS good will tour to explain why once again the Cardinals were unable to do anything in the off-season. Once and for all get it out of your heads that anyone but Junior makes acquisition decisions.November 10, 2017 at 9:30 pm #37630
Nate, any owner of any professional team worth a darn is going to make the final call on an acquisition as significant as Stanton. Why do you always try make the Cards to be somehow different (when you have no first-hand knowledge of any of them)?
For at least 10 years, I have never let pass your misrepresenting opinion as fact. No reason to start now. 😉November 11, 2017 at 5:10 pm #37646
As much as I agree with nate’s cynicism in this particular case… I will always bring up 2011 and his relentless negativity… Followed by about three seconds of “oops, I was wrong”… And back to the negativity.
To be fair… He did apologize at the time. Then went right back to the negative.November 11, 2017 at 9:06 pm #37648
Miami Herald reporting indicated talks between Red Sox and Marlins “could be” heating up.
Wouldn’t bet the first time Cards lost to the Red Sox.November 11, 2017 at 9:53 pm #37649
I think the Cardinals should be the leaders for Stanton, and the only reason they won’t get the trade done is that DeWitt is scared of the contract, based on his statements this summer. Of course, after Machado and Harper sign next year, Stanton’s contract is going to look very reasonable.
The Giants already have $166 million tied up in 8 players. They also have nothing to trade.
Boston would be better served just signing JD Martinez to be their DH. But they could package JBJ and Brian Johnson to the Marlins. JBJ is better than any outfielder the Cardinals will offer back. Johnson is not as highly ranked as any of the Cardinals pitchers that would be offered back.
Philadelphia is in the same division as the Marlins, which makes that trade unlikely. I don’t believe they are as far away as people make out, because they could sign say, Lance Lynn and Alex Cobb this year, plus trade for Stanton, and offer Machado and Harper ten year deals worth $40 million per year next year, and they will STILL be under the luxury tax. But does Miami really want to face that possibility?November 11, 2017 at 10:00 pm #37650
The Phillies were 66-96 this season, in last place 31 games behind the Nats and 11 games worse than the Marlins. Stanton ain’t going there.November 11, 2017 at 10:34 pm #37652
Stanton ain’t going to wave his No Trade Clause for PhillyNovember 11, 2017 at 11:59 pm #37653
Latest from Peter Gammons:
“…while media speculation can list St. Louis, San Francisco and Boston as most likely landing spots, each one of those teams would have to sell him, because there is a strong feeling among those who know Giancarlo that they’re not cities that fascinate him for different reasons.”November 12, 2017 at 12:28 am #37655
You guys are just talking yourselves into major disappointment when Stanton goes somewhere else and we sign a second tier slug to bat 3rd or 4th.November 12, 2017 at 3:35 am #37659
I fear that if we don’t get Stanton or someone of his caliber that the front office will sign an average guy, talk it up really big, and then act shocked when we miss the playoffs again and the whole front office gets the boot along with Matheny…November 12, 2017 at 10:38 am #37662
They should get Ozzie Smith to help with Stanton. Remember when we traded for him he wasn’t thrilled about leaving Southern California to come to St. Louis. Once he was here he was sold. Its almost the same situation we have here with Stanton.
r/RatNovember 12, 2017 at 10:55 am #37664
I guess by now that when Stanton signs elsewhere, anyone else will be considered a slug.
Theory: Stanton is headed to the Phils. When you see consecutive comments with “ain’t” in them (slams on desk) that’s where he is going.November 12, 2017 at 11:30 am #37665
“The Phillies were 66-96 this season, in last place 31 games behind the Nats and 11 games worse than the Marlins.”
The Phillies won 66 games while clearing the books to go after the free agent class of 2018. The only contract on the books after next year is their CF at $6 million. Next year, they will be right back up at the luxury tax, if not over it. Do you really believe they are not going to be bidding on both Machado and Haper? Do you really believe any other team can offer more to those two than Philadelphia, which will be nowhere near the luxury tax even if they sign them both for $40 million per year?
They used to spend like the Red Sox, Yankees and Dodgers. They are just waiting to have the team in place to do it again.
I think if they talked to Stanton and showed their game plan for next offseason, similar to what the Cubs did with Heyward, they’d have a real chance at convincing him. But Philadelphia is the last place the Marlins want to trade Stanton, because they know what’s coming in terms of spending and farm system.
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